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skidding/bouncing on right turns?

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 

Alright so,

 

 

  I went up to Alta today and it was snowing so I got to ski fresh snow all day and I wasn't really even cold. I have been definatly improving in powder because that is what I did mostly today. When I used to not like skiing powder days, I like it even more with powder. Anyways, most of the mountain was great but sometimes there were icy spots and I my right turns were awful on the icy spots. My left ski would like skid and chop up and down tiring my left leg to the point I had to stop many times. The wierd thing is, with my left turns I hardly ever do this skid/bump thing. Me right turns are as good as my left turns except for when it comes to bumps and ice. Also it seems like this skid thing happens when I am turning in bumpy snow, it also isn't as bad turning in bumpy snow on my left turns. Another thing, my left leg (right turns) gets wonr out WAAYY easier than my right left (left turns). I am right footed also if that helps. If in case you need it, the skis are, Rossignol Viper X1 skis. They are a narrow beginner ski and go up to about an inch below my chin.

 

Thanks for the help!

post #2 of 20

Hi sugarluver,

Two broad categories of causes. Technique or alignment. You've got a highly skilled resource that can help with alignment issues right there at the Snowbird plaza. Go talk to Steve Bagley at Christys' Sports.

 

If the issue isn't alignment (in my mind you should rule this out first) you are doing something different turning left vs. right. Maybe always having more weight on one foot?

 

Enjoy the journey to the solution.

Kazooski

post #3 of 20

you're leaning into the hill instead of driving your hip and keeping your weight over your skis. maybe  more  with your right turn. most of this is  disussed in depth in the technique area of the forum. but you  may need a lesson.

post #4 of 20

I've never seen you ski....  My thought is that you may be doing the same thing that I was on my snowboard.  I would make a fine toe side turn and then my heel side turn would chatter.  This happened as you say mostly on harder snow.  I thought my heel side turn was deficient.  It turned out when I got into a clinic with a good examiner that I wasn't finishing my toe side turn all the way because I felt confident with it.  The result was an increase in speed going into my heel side and a chatter as I over pressured the bottom of the heel side turn to get some speed control.  I was happy to have fixed the problem so easily and pissed that I didn't get it on my own.

 

Try holding onto your left turn a bit longer and focussing on maintaining a constant speed through a series of linked turns.

post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 

Ok I will try that tommorow. Any advice for skiing bumps? I am not talking full on moguls but just skied over powder with forming moguls kind of. I see people doing long sweeping turns going fast and when I go on the same stuff, I have to take very short radius turns between the moguls and I can't go very fast at all.  

post #6 of 20

Could be, being right footed, you are keeping too much weight on your right ski when you are turning right.  It's a viscious circle; the more your left ski chatters on the ice, the less you are willing to trust it with all your weight.

 

Try a few right turns with lifting your right foot/ski off the snow.  Keep it there ready to catch you should the left ski let go, but keep it off the snow until the left ski slides out.

Edit: with beginner skinny skis, you might not be able to do this on powder, but you could do it on the icy bits. 

post #7 of 20

I think I'm with Ghost and Dalvuri.  If you put the weight on your left foot while crossing the hill (early), and start turning your feet then when your weight is securely on your left foot it will give you  more room to continue your turn through to the end and less bump and skid at the end as you try to slow from accelerating too quickly caused when you made a later weight shift in the fall line.  You probably find it easier to switch the weight to the right ski and do it earlier in the turn as you feel it's stronger, making your turn to the left a little smoother.

post #8 of 20

your not balanced on your left foot.

post #9 of 20
Thread Starter 

That seems to take care of it for the ice thing. Just putting all my weight on my left foot helps in right turns on ice. I just see people flying down bumpy/ungroomed terrain doing big sweepy turns and when I try going faster than usual, my skis wobble all over the place and the bumps really throw me off. Also, I find myself doing really short, quik radius turns that slow me down and when I do bigger turns it gets sketchy, will longer skis help with this? (I think I am getting Icelantic Pilgrim skis for Christmas but we'll see!

post #10 of 20

If you corrected a problem with your right turn with a few posts here, you are indeed a fortunate guy. lots of luck on your skiing.

 

Icelantic powder skis probably won't be the tool to refine your turns on steep icy terrain, and chatter is not an issue in soft powder as a rule, so you're good.

 

weight over the skis, not leaning into the hill, chatter gone.

 

Hey, BWP, we had a group lesson together, 5 instructors and one student, and we basically agreed. new joke, how many ski instructors does it take to give a lesson?

post #11 of 20

Is your ski the 2002 Rosignol T-Power Viper xl?  According to real skier reviews it has a speed limit of about 25 mph.

 

Regardless, if you have your technique down, a longer ski will be better at smoothing out the bumps, and a ski with a longer turn radius will feel smoother in terms of snow contact on longer turns.  Skiing a ski at a longer than designed-for turn radius feels like your tearing along instead of slicing along, because you are.

post #12 of 20
Thread Starter 

Yeah, haha. It feels like my skis definatly restrict my speed. Like the afternoon today, I had to beet it down from Collins to the parking lot to catch the bus and I can go somewhat fast on these skis but they definatly don't help me at fast speeds especially since they are so short.

 

Alta was amazing today though, we got like 2 feet overnight and the canyon was closed until 12 and the resort opened at 1 for avie control. When it did open, there were harldy an people up there at all. The powder was like 3 inches bove my knee deep when I was skiing. I feel like I am way in the back seat when I ski powder for some reason. Like my skis dive down into it so I sort of have to lean back. I sort of lean forward between turns just so I have the front of the skis to pivot around. I remember when I was scared and frightened to ski in powder, now I think it is so much fun! You definatly need steeper slopes for it though, it can really slow you down.

 

I was really trying to keep my hips forward and my weight over my skis in the bumps and that definatly did help with the chatter and wobble. 

post #13 of 20

Skiing powder on long skinny skis, works ok.

Sking powder on short fat skis, works ok.

Skiing powder on short skinny skis, not so much.

post #14 of 20
Thread Starter 

I got rid of the chatter in my turns on ice, but my speed is very restricted by the bumps which throw my skis way off and make me kind of go out of control. the little bumps make my skis really swim around. Doing bigger turns helps but then I start to go to fast.  I see people coming down the hill with big rocker skis and it looks like those skis make it so much easier and would help a ton or is it just the skiers skill? Oh yeah and, I was going off a little jump and shortly after I landed I flipped over the bars and did a summersault. Like the snow just grabbed my skis and flipped me over. I have to lean SOOO far back when I am going in powder to aviod this. Like my body is almost parralel to the fall line. Like I suck in the choppy powder but when I get out onto the groomed I am passing a lot of people and I can turn so much better. Today I was just looking around for jumps and small cliffs to hit.

 

how much Will my skiing in powder and bumpy/choppy snow improve with those Icelantic Pilgrims when I get them?

post #15 of 20
Thread Starter 

...?

post #16 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarluver View Post

I see people coming down the hill with big rocker skis and it looks like those skis make it so much easier and would help a ton or is it just the skiers skill?

 

how much Will my skiing in powder and bumpy/choppy snow improve with those Icelantic Pilgrims when I get them?

 

Skill it is. And as far as the Pilgrims go, sure they will help, but it sounds like practice, practice, practice is the answer. You live in a great area to do that, so enjoy yourself and keep working on it. If you can afford it, take a few lessons. At Mammoth they offer small group lessons (2-3 people) for about $120 for 2.5 hours. I try and take a few of those a year to keep me moving in the right direction.
 

post #17 of 20
Thread Starter 

I don't know if I can afford a lesson yet...

 

  I did demo some Rossignol S90 womans skis that were 150cm in length today. At first, they felt really heavy and weird but by the end of the day I could definatly tell a difference in my skiing. They "surf" more on powder rather than sink and drive through it like a submarine and they ski backwards as well as they do forwards to make for good 180 landings.

 

I just think that if I could change my skiing, it would be to make myself feel more comfortable at higher speeds. When I ski out of a landing from a drop I feel like I am just flying almost out of control and then when I turn, since I am not in a 100% carve, my out side ski goes all over and slams into moguls etc. . Sometimes I find myself on a narrow traverse and I feel like I am going too fast for comfort, like a series of bumps develope and really toss me around like my skis go over the face of a bump going fast and then slam into the face of another bump making my knees fly into my chest and I almost crash. What can I do to make my skis jump and fly around less when I am going fast on bumps? This problem mostly occurs when I am turning.

 

Those skis did help with being more stable but the problem didn't completely go away.


Edited by sugarluver - 12/22/10 at 7:13pm
post #18 of 20
Thread Starter 

My right turns are equally as good as my left turns now for the most part.

 

  I can ski true powder that doesn't have too many tracks just fine but when I get into chopped up crud and little powder patches, I can hardly get down. (any advice?)

I have also found I can stay more stable and I am affected less by bumps when I am carving and skiing on the edges. The only poblem with this is, I get going too fast. I am more and more looking out for jumps and stuff and I can tell I am getting better with them. I also search for little ledges or drops (small ones) to jump off. I would like to start jumping small rock cliffs but my concern is going too fast on the ride out after the landing. If I crashed this would probably be where I crash. I saw some good drops at Sugarloaf I would try but a lot of them have not very smooth ride outs with moguls and bumps and stuff that suck to go very fast on. 


Edited by sugarluver - 12/23/10 at 6:40pm
post #19 of 20
Thread Starter 

I skied yesterday on old crusty snow all day and my chatter problem was very bad, it happened mostly when I am about to finish my turn because that is when I get kind of sideways on steeper slope. My skis were bouncing around very badly (even on left turns) My skis would chatter less when I carve but I find it hard to carve on very steep. My left knee was vibrating so badly it is starting to hurt so I am questioning whether I should go today since there is no fresh snow. :(

post #20 of 20

What others have said here is good advice, sugarluver.  Here's how I summarize this, with some additional commentary.

 

It seems that you are right-foot dominant (everybody has a dominant side, and it's a very tough thing to overcome as your skiing ability improves), and this makes you rely on the right leg far too much when you are making right turns.  Overcoming the reflexive tendency to rely on a dominant leg is very, very tough: work in small steps, working from gentle terrain up to the steeps.  Having a lesson with video analysis would likely help you quite a bit in visualizing the problem - save some shekels and spring for a private or small-group lesson one of these days, it's worth the investment.

 

There could also be some alignment problems (there likely are, in fact), and I'd definitely pay a visit to Steve at Christy Sports to have your alignment assessed.  Thing is, if your boots aren't giving you the proper support and alignment, the best skis in the world will only be of limited help.  The alignment adjustment will also help you in achieving the edge angles you need to carve on the steep.  If you have proper leg and foot alignment, you'll be more trusting of your left leg and foot, and won't feel the need to lean on your right leg to feel stable.  Again, this brings us back to the foot dominance issue - but having a properly-aligned boot setup is key.

 

And there are other things at play here.  I grew up skiing in Utah, and the soft snow of the west allows for a lot of technical "variation" that wouldn't pass muster on the hardpack and ice of the east (or on a prepped race course).  Your mentioning issues on the steep suggests that you aren't getting good edge angles in the snow, and that can be caused by lack of hip angulation, leaning into the slope, rotating the shoulders by driving the outside hand forward while letting the inside hand drop back (this causes most skiers to lose hip angulation as they rotate, which causes skidding as the edge angles decrease), etc.  In the powder, it's possible to get away with some of these moves and see little-to-no detrimental effect on your skiing.  But when you move to a more packed situation, or something steeper, you see the skidding, chattering and bouncing described in your initial post.

 

One last tip: make sure your fitness level is good.  While the alignment issues will create a more stable platform for you, having good core and leg strength (as well as good flexibility) helps immeasurably in being able to have stability.

 

Whatever the case: have fun!  Living in the Wasatch is quite the treat.

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