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Big difference from 0 to 1 on base bevel...

post #1 of 9
Thread Starter 

I just returned from my first ski of the season.  I ski a Nordica Dobermann SLR.  I'm not a big believer in stone grinding often, but this year I had to.  I set the side bevel at 3 but left the bottom bevel flat.  I'm amazed at the difference in the way the ski responded...and surprised.  I expected it to be "hooky" but actually I felt my turn initiation was slow and sloppy and when I really leaned into the hill, I felt as if the skiis were more likely to fall away on me...I fell on my hip three times in a couple of hours .  Typically, I never fall.


I'm 44 but a strong racer who does well in the beer league.  I also switched boots from a 115 Tecnica that were pretty destroyed to a Tecnica 130 Race.  I was thinking that the lack of forward lean might have had soemthing to do with it as well.


Anyway, tomorrow I'm sticking with the 0 base bevel but I am going to use the old boots and see.


Curios if anyone has had a similar sensation...I really thought I'd feel exactly the opposite as I, on the hill, did. 

post #2 of 9

Did you check the base flatness  and the base edge bevel with a true bar?

post #3 of 9
Thread Starter 

yes, perfect....


I'm going to test tomorrow and then pull back the base to a .5 and see where that takes me.

post #4 of 9

If your a racer you should have a 3 degree side, and either .5 or 1 degree base.  Having a 0 degree base is a bad idea when your racing

post #5 of 9

Hi hegagenia:


Your post caught my attention because the topic is somewhat similar to my tuning question a couple of months ago about some AC30's that I bought as demo's -- but in wonderful condition.   Being just a recreational skier (although an athletic type that loves to carve and still bash through moguls), I was never a deep believer that a good stone ground and edge tuning would make much of a difference to my skiing experience.  I only just kept my edges relatively sharp and applied some hot wax on occasion. 


Back to those AC30's. One of pair had a bit of a gouge in the base.  So the salesman offered to have it P-tex'd and then stone ground -- included in the purchase price.   When I picked up the skis a week later, I asked the tech about the edge bevels.   He said 1 base and 2 side.   Fine, but a couple of days later, after I had been doing some research on this site (and others) about the basic points of ski tuning, I took a more critical look at the AC30's.   Checking with a straight edge I noted that the base was concave in relation to the edges along the entire length of each ski (i.e. the edges were protruding higher than the base), and also some of the edge material still had a slight amount of rust/tarnish.   The gouge was filled, but obviously, the shop's "stone ground" job hadn't been too precise.  


On my first day of skiing, the skis didn't seem right.   Certainly they didn't live up to the AC30's as being "one of the best all mountains".   On the first run, an easy blue trail, I sort of just fell mid-way through a turn.   Yeah, this was the first run of the season, but falling like this for me isn't the norm.   The skis just didn't track/behave well.   As the day progressed I made adjustments to accommodate, but I wasn't enamored with the skis.    The next day, I skied on my also new 2009/2010 K2 Recons, which I had tuned myself before the trip.   Wonderful action and control; although definitely "Lexus"- like, as sometimes commented on this site.  The day after, I skied on the Volkl Supersport 6-stars that I picked up at a garage sale. (For $10!)   These also I had tuned myself before the trip.   The carving action and quickness of rebound from edge-to-edge on these was something I had never experienced before.   


Back to the AC30's again.   Back at home, I have now filed/scraped the bases very flat in respect to the steel rails and have put in a appx .75 degree base bevel and a 2 degree side bevel.   Hot wax has followed. 


I've yet to ski on the now tuned AC30 since I've got pre-Christmas obligations and besides the wet/storming weather conditions at Tahoe haven't enticed me back up.   After my next ski on them, I'll report my impressions on pre vs. post tune performance of the AC30's.



post #6 of 9

Sounds like there could be  something going on other the the skis.


Did you adjust the new boot cuffs to the shape of your lower leg?  Did you ski om the SLr's with the new boots pre tune?


A 0 base bevel would not necessarily be grabby if deburred properly, but there would be no sloppiness. More either on edge or off edge,

No ability to feather in or for that matter out of a turn.


Did you do any detuning of the tip or tail?



post #7 of 9
Thread Starter 

No de-tuning at all.  I suspect one of two things:  1)  First day on slopes and I ski very aggressively...meaning I'm just rusty and my skiing shows it.  2)  The new boots...I'm going to try the old boots today.


If they still feel off...I'm going to put a .5 bevel on them tonight.

post #8 of 9

How sharp are they?

I haven't tried 0 on a modern ski, but I remember buying a pair of skis at a garage sale and bringing them to a shop to get them tuned.  They skied like crap on an icy hill.  I checked the edges, and they had done a crap job of sharpening them.  That was the last time I took any skis there.   I realized I as an amature could do better and started sharpening my own skis.  I found with the old skis set at 0,3 your were pretty much locked into a railed turn, and it was a bit tricky progressing the supper long radius ski into a sharp turn.  A more modern ski with a reasonable turn radius would make a sudden jump from no turn to whatever the sidecut radius is as soon as the edge engaged.  You would feel some roughness when that happened.  A 0.5 base bevel smooths things out a bit. 

post #9 of 9
Thread Starter 

Knocked the base to .5 and it solved the issue entirely.  Also, the stiffer boot is throwing me back a bit on my heels, but I'm learning to work it through the turns...helps for me to concentrate on pressuring the ball of my fooy as opposed to the whole foot.  I'm extremely aggressive through the turn and practice changing the arc in mid turn...I find pressuring the boot to varying degrees helps me to do this.


Anyway, gates on Monday...beer league starts soon.  Some young bucks this year...hopefully my 44 year old, bald, beer drinking excuse of a middle aged body and keep me in the top five.


Also, thanks to another thread where we discussed beveling without files and strictly stones...worked great. 

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