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Straight Skis

post #1 of 45
Thread Starter 
Does any ski manufacturer still produce traditional straight skis????

I am looking for a expert/high performance slalom or gs cut, 185 cm. I'd like to buy a *new* pair, but it seems that I'll have to go to the used market?

I demo'ed several new models this weekend and they don't do a thing for me. I am an expert skier and my stance is extremely narrow. The new stuff doesn't do a thing for me and, in fact, I feel I have less control and less flexibility. Yes, new skis do require less effort to turn, but I like to make the effort. It's fun to work it!
post #2 of 45
It seems only bump skis are still looking like old school straight skis.

But, I have seen lots of old school straight skis, like the Dynastar ...I'm gonna butcher the name...world cup 8 or 9...what I recalled as a high end ski a few years ago.. for sale for anywhere from $25 to $100. This was at SNIAGRAB in boulder last year.

You may be able to find some for dirt cheap but you may have to put some effort into your search. The old straight ski stock didn't disappear overnight they just stopped selling. Ther must be truckloads of them out there.
post #3 of 45
Aren't most skis' sidecut a matter of degree? If all you've tried are the extreme sidecuts...try a Volkl P50 (for example).

post #4 of 45
There are indeed truckloads in the Denver Gart's, but in longer lengths. I have seen Fischer, Atomic, and Dynastar GS and SL skis in various shops. Prices as low as $20. But finding a 185 will be tough.
post #5 of 45
While you are right about a narrow stance not being overly compatible with the new skis, there may be another issue here as well.

In a recent issue of the professional skier (winter 2002) there is an article about very good skiers who felt the same way you do about shapes. The author found that with these skiers their seemed to be an alignment issue. Your old straight skis are more tolerant of you being out of alignment than the new shapes. He found that with some basic stance alignment adjustments, those people who hated the shapes became quick converts.

If you haven't already done so, find a good bootfitter and check it out. Just a thought....
post #6 of 45
Definately "traditional" skis are not being manufactured anymore.

As far as the required effort, versatility and etc ------

We still work as hard, or harder than ever on the new skis! They may require less effort to make an easy skidded turn on -- but if you push them, they push back. They will push back as hard, and in fact harder as any traditional ski did. My old 'straight' 225 DH boards were not any more demanding than my radical shapes when I push them hard.

The top extreme skiers, freeskiers and racers in the world are not on the new skis for fashion!

A Ferrari certainly IS easier to do some things in than a Buick . . . but its also a heck of a lot more radical, demanding and fun.

Every technological change requires end user adaptation to get the most out of it. Jet planes are certainly easier to do some manuvers in than prop planes -- but also more radical. Pentium 4's with Windows XP are certainly different to use than 486's running Win 3.1

If you continue to use old technique with new technology you will usually be dissatified. But if you grow and adapt along with the technology . . . you get even better results!

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 16, 2002 04:23 PM: Message edited 2 times, by Todd Murchison ]</font>
post #7 of 45
Langhorne Ski Shop, Langhorne, PA .... just north of Philadelphia still has a rack full of Rossignol 9S pros 9.1 in several lengths.

The 9.1 is a slalom ski that is not a "pencil" or straight ski, but is very close since the shape is about as mild as you can get.
post #8 of 45

I figured out the conspiracy. I compared my 184 cm Volkl Carver Plus with my old 195 cm Rossi' ST Comps and guess what! The front of the ski (from the toe of the boot to the tip) is virtually the same (length)! The new shaped ski is shorter behind the binding.

It's all a sham! A sham I say! Shaped skis are all part of a marketing strategy to sell new skis! :

(Ok, a little hyperbole may have been used)
post #9 of 45
Narrow stance = very old school.

I started skiing a wide stance around 1992, even with relatively straight skis - this transitions fairly well to deep sidecut skis. I still see a few people rip old school and its really cool. There is no way any of the new skis will work for you with old technique, and there is nothing wrong with that. However, I'd give the new skis a shot in a private lesson to see if you can get the hang of them, it's almost like learning a new sport.

post #10 of 45
Thread Starter 
Yes, I am old school. 200% old school.

Honestly, I didn't realize that skiing style has split into old and new school. I thought EVERYONE'S ultimate goal was fast, tight S-turns (wedeln/yodeling) straight down the fall line or a quick hop through the moguls, and always always with legs together!

Now, I understand that most skiers aren't even trying to master that. Hmmmmm....

This would partly explain why I rarely see anyone else ski like me. And here I thought it was just because I was so damn good, ha, ha.

Frankly, I alway thought that skiing with your legs apart was sloppy skiing. I still do. To me, this doesn't look as graceful, elegant and controlled.

I can't ski in my style with the wide skis.
The wide shape means that I end up overlapping the shovels and tails because my legs are so close together. The sidecut radius fights me when I try to make really tight S-turns. My hip swing and up/down motion overrotate the skis. I feel locked in and contained. The new skis also torque my kneecaps because the ski waists are farther apart when my knees are together.

To go back to skiing with legs apart, well, that's just regression in my book.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 17, 2002 11:11 AM: Message edited 1 time, by WhosThatGirl ]</font>
post #11 of 45
I am 100% old school, but even then there was always a small "gap" in between my skis. This was mostly a result of my racing slalom however on old or new skis you should have an athletic stance. If you ski with legs welded together you are effectivley skiing on one ski. This takes away your ability to truly carve as well as limits you on terrain. There is a lot to bed said about independant leg action that you are robbing yourself of by skiing like stien erickson (an excellent skiier by the way). I would suggest to you instead of trying to rip rapid gates down the steeps your 1st day out on shaped skis, head for the blues then blacks and play with thechnice, stange, center of gravity etc. You will find that a solid technique will translate to shaped skis easily without ANY major change on your part.
Just my 2cents worth,
post #12 of 45
I can ski with my knees together on my older bandit X's. They don't have a lot of shape or width and you can find them cheap, but not as cheap as an older old-school so-called straight ski, at Al's Ski Barn for $399

Might be worth a gander.
post #13 of 45
I think the goal of most skiers is gaining the ability to adapt their technique to varying conditions in an attempt to have fun, not impress who is watching them.

To stay rigidly within the confines of one style would seem a bit boring to me.

It might be that someone prefers short, tight, quick turns (not everyone does mind you) & should therefore buy equipment to accomodate i.e. the new bump skis from any number of manufacturers. But, unless they intend to spend 100% of their time in terrain where short, quick, feet together turns are practical, learning other techniques would be self serving.

No offence, but believing a wide stance technique is a regression would be similar to believing all modern day high jumpers should return to the forward somersault approach in their sport.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 17, 2002 01:50 PM: Message edited 1 time, by snojock ]</font>
post #14 of 45
Girl, get with it! It is too much fun to stay with the strap bindings and Hemlock skis. Adapt and conquer, you can.
post #15 of 45
Some of us can ski extremely well in a totally tight stance (yes, little warp speed wedeln turns and all). . . but don't *choose* to anymore! What do you figure THAT means? :

If its really about asthetics and appearance, I would highly recommend you get mono-skis, then you'll look far more "elegant" by your definition than anybody else on the slopes!

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 17, 2002 03:00 PM: Message edited 2 times, by Todd Murchison ]</font>
post #16 of 45
Ah, the hookie lau. Wedelin' to the disco beat. Swingin' the poles in a circular fasion. Feet glued together. Skiing on the last $100 of a $500 pair of skis. Wearin' SX91s on a pair of Verticals. Stretch pants, gaiters and a headband to boot! Whahoo!
post #17 of 45
Skiing with a boot-buckle tight stance is always fun, but after awhile you realize it's not as versatile as a 'slightly' wider stance. Going slightly wider will help on steeps, blazing speeds, in crud, etc... But by wider I mean around hip width, some people say shoulder width but in most cases that is way too wide.

IMO to be a great skier you should be able to ski pretty much any way anytime.
post #18 of 45
Thread Starter 
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by spinheli:
Ah, the hookie lau. Wedelin' to the disco beat. Swingin' the poles in a circular fasion. Feet glued together. Skiing on the last $100 of a $500 pair of skis. Wearin' SX91s on a pair of Verticals. Stretch pants, gaiters and a headband to boot! Whahoo!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't forget the Levi windshirt!

Now how did you know I'm too cheap to buy new ski clothes? Hey, the stretch pants still fit, so I'm happy...
post #19 of 45
I just got a flier from gear.com, they have
Fisher WC SL for $49.99.
post #20 of 45
I had some morbid curiosity myself about whats available in old technology. Found a couple.

At http://www.liquidationsports.com/snowskis.html it says:
"I have hundreds of pairs of traditional cut straight skis with bindings available at clearance prices ranging from $24.99 to $74.99."

http://www.half.com/products/sporting_goods/index.cfm has a bunch of sets of old skis for cheap.

http://www.geartrade.com/browse/116/789/457/item/17169 A bit overpriced for what they are, but hey . . .
http://www.geartrade.com/browse/116/789/457/item/17288 the price on these pegs the owner as pretty out of touch!

Lots more at that site if you look.

That was entertaining!

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 20, 2002 06:31 PM: Message edited 3 times, by Todd Murchison ]</font>
post #21 of 45
Mountain Sports Outlet in Silverthorne, Colorado, has (as of Saturday) two pair of Fischer "World Cup RC4" in 188 cm. They look "straight" to me. $199/pr. I am not a Fischer expert so I don't what kind of a ski it is; they have red cosmetics.
post #22 of 45
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WhosThatGirl:

Hey, the stretch pants still fit, so I'm happy...

I must admit that there are somethings "old school" that should never die...as long as hotties wear them. This bit of fashion never had a place on any guy!
post #23 of 45
Nothing can be more new school then Kiteskiing, and straight wide skis are the best for that because they hold the grip better when going straight on edge in all types of snow and speeds then new shape skis,
Why don’t any ski manufacturer produce that kind of ski?
Wouldn’t a straight powder ski that also can be skidded on hard snow be a lot more interesting for most powder skiers then the Volant Spatulas water ski shaped, useless in anything but bottom less Powder!?

Kiteskiing are a small sport now but WILL grow as soon as people discovers the fun in using the wind,
Modern Power Kite’s are light years from the old Upski system that are impossible to use for jumping and sail up against the wind, and packs the size equal to 3-4 Kites,
The unofficial Kiteskiing speed record is around 130km/h, I’ve been close to 100km/h, towing a toboggan packed whit tent, sleeping bag, food, etc.…
It’s also possible to jump over 50m long on flatland, and jumping and soaring downhill are only limited by your own courage and common sense,

Ski manufacturer’s wake up!!!
post #24 of 45
I'll bring the kite skiing topic up at the next meeting. NOT!!!
post #25 of 45
I've seen kite skiing
I've admired kite skiing
I may be Irish, but I'm not that stupid!

Seriously though, it looks amazing. I'd love to have the guts to try it some time.

post #26 of 45
WTGirl -

Skiing is about FUN - and you should do it in the way that is fun for you. But, I really think you're dismissing the new technology/style too quickly.

I've been skiing for 40 years. Stein was my idol when I was a kid. I still think he was/is the most stylish/elegant skier ever. I even modeled my fabled(?) 'Mambo' turns after him. But I got modern equipment (Atomic BetaRace 9.20's) a couple of years ago, and not only are they a blast to ski on, it's also been a blast experimenting with them and figuring out how to do it effectively.

There are others on this board far more qualified to expand on recommended technique adjustments, but I'd say to think of it like power steering - gradually minimize the input to your skis until you feel like they're turning by telepathy. Then, find out how much fun it is to start the turn by just releasing the edges and letting your body 'fall down the hill', and to finish it by leaning so far over that you can touch your uphill hand to the snow without hardly even trying! I can still ski with my boots pressed together, but I now choose not to. (Well, I TRY not to. I also still catch myself unweighting unecessarily at turn initiation sometimes - the old 'down-up-down' thing. Old habits are tough to break!)

All this reminds me of my Grandmother, who passed away last summer at the amazing age of 102. Born in 1898, she was the first woman ever to drive a car in Lewiston, Maine. However, she stopped driving when my Grandfather got a car with automatic transmission, because he didn't show her how to use it!

Anyway, do what's right for YOU - that's what my Grandmother used to say! And, HAVE FUN - that's what I say!
post #27 of 45
Thread Starter 
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tominator:
...and letting your body 'fall down the hill', and to finish it by leaning so far over that you can touch your uphill hand to the snow without hardly even trying! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Okay, THAT does sound fun. I just might give the new stuff another try!

Still, I have 35 years of experience, having started at 3. My parents probably have 55+ hard core skiing years behind them. Everyone skis old school. My dismay is that the new shapped equipment is requiring 2 to 3 generations of skiers to radically change their technique. Years and years of muscle memory...mastering timing, unweighing, carving...it's just unreasonable to be forced to turn your back on that. If we can't buy the skis we want new, I don't what we're all going to do. Probabably hoard old staight skis till they delaminate.

I hope ski manufacturers are li$tening.
post #28 of 45
Again - jet planes definately required new skill development on the pilots part, but it was worth it. There probably were also prop pilots angry at the new work they had to do in order to master the new tools/toys, but there were no regrets on the part of those who put in the effort.

The new skis do not force you to abandon your skills, they will give you a huge head start. A skier with 35 years experience should certainly be skilled and adaptable enough to quickly reap the benefits of the superior new technology.

Again - the top racers and freeskiers in the world are not on them for *fashion* sake, they are on them for performances sake.
post #29 of 45

Have you checked these out:

Volant Machete McH, measurements circa. 110-92-102

(turn radius 48m, this is pretty near to older gs skis...)


Nordica W 125-105-115


Völkl V-Explosive 120-95-112

These are relatively straight, designed for going relatively straight and/or sliding(skidding) them on the TOP of the soft snow, so that you can do quick decleration turns/skids easily (and directly also from the higher speeds)

I wonder do you need even wider/straighter skis for kite skiing? And if so, why? Maybe some of those Atomic's powder special skis will do also? (Big Daddy? POwder Plus etc.)

Just curious, as it seems that you haven't found proper skis for kite-skiing...

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 25, 2002 01:24 AM: Message edited 1 time, by Jiehkevarri ]</font>
post #30 of 45
Well on the other hand, I saw a woman on mint-condition 30-year-old Rossignol Stratos (the maroon ones with the little roosters on the tips) last year, and I have to admit I was impressed! Good luck in your quest.

Edit: 2 more things ...

I went skiing with my 15-year-old hotshot freestyler nephew this year for the 1st time. In spite of all the 'modernization' I've recently done to my technique, when he was asked what he thought of his uncle's skiing ability he said, "He's good, but old school - looks like a guy from the 50's." Hmph!

Also, check out current ski reviews (skinet.com, onthesnow.com., etc.) I've noticed comments on some models that said something like, "...works well with both modern and traditional techniques." You might want to investigate those models.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ January 25, 2002 07:17 AM: Message edited 1 time, by Tominator ]</font>
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