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Snowbird: Not for beginners, advancing beginners or low intermediates - Page 2

post #31 of 92



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Jones View Post

I can see how Snowbird could prove challenging for a beginner.  The place almost killed me

 

I would like to suggest that you come to Stowe for the Epic Ski Academy.  Then you can go back to Snowbird and rip it up.

 

Your equipment also concerns me.  Get advice from only the best.


It's going to take more than 1 ESA for OP to rip up the bird - a lot more.

 

The folks at TGR are just not sugar coating it as the PC enabled folks here.    

 

Being polite & PC will only build self esteem. Unfortunately, Mother Nature haven't attended the corporate sponsored sensitivity class and certainly couldn't care less about ones self esteem. Respect her and learn to dance with her. You'll have way more fun.

 

post #32 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecimmortal View Post

One look at the trailmap says that the Bird isn't for beginners, and LCC is known for pow. So it makes sense to me that if your a beginning skier who obviously can't ski pow. The it's not the place for you. I'm still kind of confused why the OP booked a trip there.


I thought he explained that pretty well in his review. 

 

esumsea:  Thanks for the great review.  I think it was excellent - and dead on in almost every way.

 

The two resorts I've skied the most during my lifetime are Snowbird and Jackson Hole.  Both have reputations as very difficult mountains and both try to convince beginners and intermediates that there is plenty of terrain for them at the respective resorts.  Personally, I think JH is a better place for lower-skill skiers than Snowbird.  (I'm also now extremely down on Snowbird because the owner of the Snowbird is trying to profit personally from the proposed desecration of one of the world's most beautiful and prolific salmon-spawning wilderness areas, but that's another matter.)

 

Your review reminded me of the first ski trip I ever took to the mountains - Winter Park in 1968.  Before that trip, I had skied in the midwest about as many times as you had skied prior to your Snowbird trip.  I vividly remember driving up to the base of WP, looking up, and going "Whoa! Where do people SKI on that thing???"  We fell and floundered and struggled and gaped.  And that was at a mountain that's actually pretty well-suited for beginners.  I can't even imagine the carnage that might have occurred if we had somehow picked Snowbird instead.

 

Anyway, I'm glad to hear you and your wife both still have a great attitude about skiing.  Make your next trip to one of the mountains that has more appropriate terrain and you'll continue to build on your love of skiing.  As has been mentioned, there are lots of excellent resorts: Park City, Deer Valley, Snowbasin, Winter Park, Breckenridge, Steamboat, etc.

 

I hope you'll post another review after your next trip.  I would love to see how you compare the next place to the last.


Edited by Bob Peters - 11/6/10 at 8:06am
post #33 of 92

There's another thread on here somewhere saying that Snowbird's trails are overated. Find that funny reading this thread.

There is a good amount of beginner terrain at the Bird but it's not easily accessible. The Baby Thunder lift & Wilbere lift have beginner terrain but neither is in front of any base area. Mid Gad has it also except the traverse over to Big Emma might be a little hairy for a beginner.  The Baldy lift in Mineral Basin probably has the most beginner terrain & is easily accessible through the tunnel at the top of the Peruvian lift but how does a beginner get back from there unless they're allowed to ride the tram back down. I wouldn't even consider Chickadee a lift, it's only a easy way back from the Tram to the Cliff Lodge. Guess what I'm trying to say is that if you know the mountain they do have plenty of beginner terrain, it's just not right in front of you.

post #34 of 92



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by steamboat1 View Post

There's another thread on here somewhere saying that Snowbird's trails are overated. Find that funny reading this thread.

There is a good amount of beginner terrain at the Bird but it's not easily accessible. The Baby Thunder lift & Wilbere lift have beginner terrain but neither is in front of any base area. Mid Gad has it also except the traverse over to Big Emma might be a little hairy for a beginner.  The Baldy lift in Mineral Basin probably has the most beginner terrain & is easily accessible through the tunnel at the top of the Peruvian lift but how does a beginner get back from there unless they're allowed to ride the tram back down. I wouldn't even consider Chickadee a lift, it's only a easy way back from the Tram to the Cliff Lodge. Guess what I'm trying to say is that if you know the mountain they do have plenty of beginner terrain, it's just not right in front of you.



 It appears the OP's preferred green runs are much lighter shade of green than the ones you are talking about. I've been skiing the bird since '81, sometime for a month at a time. We considered most green runs as run outs to the base or catwalks that we must tolerate to get around the mountain - necessary evils. I suppose in retrospective, we've forgotten there are different shades of green for beginners. Just hope they hang in there long enough to move up.   

post #35 of 92

Oh god, I'm sorry to hear your poor wife tore her ACL on a green run. I always thought ACL tears happen only to more advanced skiers who make mistakes while sitting back and low. Awful to hear. 

post #36 of 92
That's a great review. It reminds me of the first time we skied Aspen after only skiing at some of the smaller and easier East Coast resorts.

Everything was steep and everyone skied much faster and much better than we did. I in particular was terrified.

Needless to say, we've skied Aspen a number of times after that and we always enjoy it, but I always remember how badly we got beaten up the first time we skied it.

When in Colorado, you will certainly enjoy Breckenridge and Keystone.
post #37 of 92

Here are the lessons I got from this extremely useful thread:

 

1) The first thread opened with a poll that did NOT include the skiers' level. That was not intermediate but novice, which isn't bad at all for 3 prior trips!

 

Lesson: never begin a trip plan with an incompletely-worded poll.  Of course people chose Snowbird, it's the _funnest_ place for good skiers in the lower 48 (this from a JH veteran).  The O.P. only mentioned his level in a later post.

 

2) Most posters gave the OP fair warning.  But _some_ said go for it, obviously without reading the OP's level.  The OP trusted a trail map which is, in Snowbird's case, truly deceptive.  Snowbird's acreage is around 80% advanced or expert.  There is no novice terrain AT ALL at the Bird.  As stated before, the greens are traverses, not runs!

 

3) There are tools to view terrain with elevation contours here:

    http://www.mountaindynamics.com/en/resorts.php

There is an application which overlays these contour maps with steepness colors, unfortunately I can't find it now, sorry.

Why they aren't on every ski area website is beyond me.

 

4) In the east you can compare "miles of trails" of a given difficulty.  In the high areas of the west, you need to compare _ acres_

instead.

 

I went all over Snowbird (in 1980, before the long, fast Peruvian and Gad lifts) one day to find harder terrain (narrow chutes) than I could see in a cloud, nothing was really narrow except for some super-tight trees (not my favorite skiing) like around Gadzooks. (I should have traversed to Baldy.)  Of course I should have begged a local to show me.  You could ski every one of its 2500 acres.  The same is true for Jackson except for big cliff areas.  And Lordy, the steeps were everywhere and a blast.

 

Hopefully I'll return to both mountains to rip, not quite ready.  I will sit-ski Breckenridge this season with my wife, a beginner and budding novice.  I've been once before; I chose it for its outstanding novice terrain so that we may ski together, even on long, high runs.  Snowmass was the next closest contender.

 

Best wishes to esumsea, and kudos to you for keeping a generous perspective.  If you get more time in the west, and ski hard to learn powder and steeps, you could return to the Bird for a trip you'll never forget! 

post #38 of 92

This is a very good review. I hope the writer gets it ready and puts it on the resort review page, where hopefully it will assist people thinking of heading to Snowbird to think again if they need green runs. 

 

Having Emma et al marked as green is quite misleading. I used to watch people lose control and shoot down the top bit, saw one girl get about15 feet of air off the main cat track as she hit it, and came down like a bag of laundy, horrible to watch.  Patrol had to sled her away. She was screaming all the way from the top.

 

Trying to teach green run skiiers who were scared there was very unpleasant.   I would recommend people in this situation who were booked there for a week to head to Alta, where at least they'd enjoy themselves.

post #39 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post

BWPA,

 

I thought he said Alta had better beginner terrain than Snowbird.   I didn't get the impression that he felt it was particularly good for beginners and intermediates over all however.

 

That would be my impression of the place as well, btw.  I don't know it like a local, but I've skied there enough to know it's only slightly more beginner friendly than Snowbird.

 

And it gets so much of the yucky powder stuff

 

Liam

 



I've only skied Snowbird 1 day and it was a white out on top. Really poor visibility and I'd like to try it again when I can see something. We've skied Alta quite a bit and skied there early in our skiing careers. IMO, Alta is much more beginner/low intermediate friendly than Snowbird. The greens in the Albion Basin and off the Cecret lift are very gentle. The blues off Sunnyside are pretty gentle and offer good transition terrain. And they groom at least 1 run off every lift. To be sure there's not extensive intermediate terrain but there is good terrain for all abilities. It also seemed to offer a lot more opportunities for intermediates to veer off the groomers without getting in way over you head. A few blues are kind of steep but I don't think as steep as runs like Lord, North Slope, or parts of Main Street at Stowe. I'm sure I'd have found Snowbird more friendly if I could have seen where I was going. But I definitely don't think it's as friendly for beginners or low intermediates.

post #40 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecimmortal View Post

One look at the trailmap says that the Bird isn't for beginners, and LCC is known for pow. So it makes sense to me that if your a beginning skier who obviously can't ski pow. The it's not the place for you. I'm still kind of confused why the OP booked a trip there.



Hey look, he actually called snowbird and the snowbird ski school before booking and it sounds like they didn't steer him away (and yes, of course they wouldn't-but still..) plus who wouldn't be attracted to the ease of access, and great slopeside lodging and general affordability of Utah skiing?  You know, for newbies, there a lot to learn beyond just skiing--but where to ski and what information to trust--like everything else in life, it only comes from experience.

 

A few years ago I was on a plane to Jackson Hole-next to me was a couple-with a pretty similar story to the OP-skiing a year, had been to Vail and liked it, now, on some recommendation they were heading to Jackson Hole.  It was a pretty lean and scratchy week, and by mid week it took real mountain reading skills to sniff out decent snow (and lots of hiking to side country Cody bowl or up high on Casper Bowl etc..and endless reps on well shielded Tower 3 chute).  I saw this same couple in the Airport on the way home, we chatted and they recounted an experience that sounded quite similar to the above review of snowbird (loved the scenery, food, place they stayed, town of Jackson, but were saddened they just couldn't ski the resort). 

 

Anyway, I just find the review of snowbird refreshingly honest and, I suspect it's a fairly common experience among intermediates, beginners and the generalized ski-vacation travelers at some of the more truly expert destinations.  My good friend who worked in the ski school at Taos for two years said he ran into this level of shock pretty often as folks who signed up for a ski week found out how little beginner, true-intermediate terrain was actually available. 

 

Oh, got love the moxy for BWPA and the Stowe is harder than snowbird claim.  Not saying it ain't true, either, but those sort of claims usually make forum threads heat up in a hurry!

post #41 of 92


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post

Hey look, he actually called snowbird and the snowbird ski school before booking and it sounds like they didn't steer him away (and yes, of course they wouldn't-but still..) plus who wouldn't be attracted to the ease of access, and great slopeside lodging and general affordability of Utah skiing? 


I can see the bird phone rep saying ‘Sir, don’t come here, you are not good enough’. Next stop – back of the unemployment line. Caveat emptor.  

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post

You know, for newbies, there a lot to learn beyond just skiing--but where to ski and what information to trust--like everything else in life, it only comes from experience.

 


Ah, my alma mater - School of Hard Knocks. Most of us are proud alumni. Remind me of my first trip to SLC in '81. Skied all 7 areas around SLC. Got so beaten up that four of us couldn't make it to the fridge to finish off a 6-pack in a week. Things do get better in later years. We all go thru it. What doesn’t kill you will make you stronger.    

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post

A few years ago I was on a plane to Jackson Hole-next to me was a couple-with a pretty similar story to the OP-skiing a year, had been to Vail and liked it, now, on some recommendation they were heading to Jackson Hole.  It was a pretty lean and scratchy week, and by mid week it took real mountain reading skills to sniff out decent snow (and lots of hiking to side country Cody bowl or up high on Casper Bowl etc..and endless reps on well shielded Tower 3 chute).  I saw this same couple in the Airport on the way home, we chatted and they recounted an experience that sounded quite similar to the above review of snowbird (loved the scenery, food, place they stayed, town of Jackson, but were saddened they just couldn't ski the resort). 

 


 

 

Spent a winter in JH in the late '80s before it was gentrified. Watching the slaughter of escapees from Apres Vous while riding the Thunder chair can be described as disturbing at best.    

 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liam View Post

Anyway, I just find the review of snowbird refreshingly honest and, I suspect it's a fairly common experience among intermediates, beginners and the generalized ski-vacation travelers at some of the more truly expert destinations.  My good friend who worked in the ski school at Taos for two years said he ran into this level of shock pretty often as folks who signed up for a ski week found out how little beginner, true-intermediate terrain was actually available. 

 

 

Couple of season back, While free skiing with a Taos instructor, she commented that I am the type of skier that can ski the same run 40 times and each time would be different and just as fresh as my first run. A trail is what you make of it. TSV is a much smaller mountain than most in term of acreage. Oster and St. Bernard do not take up much acreage and that is the beauty of them. Don't get too hung up on stats. However, TSV has a much better & more organized set up (Ski-week) to move the skiers up the food chain. The proximity of expert terrain should serve as inspiration to become a better skier. It definitely has that effect on me. I still do at least couple weeks there per season. 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liam View Post

Oh, got love the moxy for BWPA and the Stowe is harder than snowbird claim.  Not saying it ain't true, either, but those sort of claims usually make forum threads heat up in a hurry!


 

Depending on time, condition & perspective, that statement can be true. 

 

 

We've all gone thru the same experience as OP. Kind of like life & first love, we can choose to remember the good times or dwell on the bad. I much rather treasure the good memories and be wiser for it.  

post #42 of 92



 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGrump View Post



 


The folks at TGR are just not sugar coating it as the PC enabled folks here.    

 

A PC enabled folk. 
post #43 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post

 

Oh, got love the moxy for BWPA and the Stowe is harder than snowbird claim.  Not saying it ain't true, either, but those sort of claims usually make forum threads heat up in a hurry!



 I would say BWPA knows both Snowbird and Stowe as well as anybody on this forum.  Believe what he says.  He isn't afraid to voice his opinion, but more often than not, he's dead on.

post #44 of 92

I've skied both Stowe & Snowbird. Couldn't care less which anyone thinks is tougher. Stowe definitely has more beginner terrain which is the theme of this thread. Not only that but they have the most beautiful new base village & lodge right at the bottom of that terrain. All brought to you by AIG, yeah that AIG.

post #45 of 92

Glad to hear that your wife's knee is OK and that she's willing to give it another go.  One word of advice for your trip to Breck, take your time getting acclimated to the altitude.  It will knock you on your butt.  If you can, spend the first night in Denver before making the drive.  Do a search and read everything that you can find about Altitude Acclimation and follow all of the tips.  Last season we rented a house on Ski Hill road at roughly 9700 feet.  I was wiped out after lunch on the first day.  The second day was better, but not great.  Best of luck and post your review. 

post #46 of 92

 

I reviewed the original thread.  This statement

 

Quote:
 My Experience Level: My wife and I are from Miami, FL and have just gone skiing three times.

was not made until 1/31/10, after esumsea had booked his trip to Snowbird.  The original post only said   

Quote:
 

2.) Lots of green and blue runs (beginners to low intermediate)

 which still elicited several warnings, despite most readers probably assuming considerably more than 3 days lifetime experience.  So I'm not so sure my after-the-fact comment in April would in fact have deterred this trip if made earlier.  Even the most cursory research would have shown Snowbird consistently on lists of steepest, most challenging resorts in North America, so I do have some difficulty understanding why someone with 3 days lifetime on skis would spend ~$2K to go there.    

 

I will say that I also started skiing as an adult and that progress in the beginner stage was slow.  I was hooked but also had the attitude that I was not going to spend the $ to ski destination resorts until I thought I was capable of most of the terrain.  Fortunately in Southern California I had access to to daytrip skiing at small areas plus Mammoth weekends to measure progress in ability and what terrain I could ski.  I did make 2 key mistakes in choice of ski area.  The first was within Southern California, going to Mt. Baldy as a beginner because it was the closest and most convenient.  Baldy is sort of the Snowbird of SoCal (steep and not the greatest grooming in 1976) and I blew an ACL on my second day there.  The later mistake was going to Jackson Hole in late March of 1986.  I was capable of most of its terrain by then but I neglected to appreciate the significance of Jackson's SE exposure at that time of year vs. the midwinter conditions I was used to on Mammoth's mostly north slopes.  The latter mistake was the first motivation for me to analyze snow and ski conditions to the obsessive detail that I post here and elsewhere from time to time.                                                                                                                                                                        


Edited by Tony Crocker - 11/7/10 at 7:02pm
post #47 of 92

Mario, I enjoy your posts and your enthusiasm for skiing. Going to Utah to ski and not spending a day at the Bird, no matter what kind of skier you are, is wasting a trip to Utah, but going to Snowbird to learn to ski, as you found out is like signing up for dancing with the stars to learn to dance.  I understand that your I

 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Crocker View Post

 

I will say that I also started skiing as an adult and that progress in the beginner stage was slow.  I was hooked but also had the attitude that I was not going to spend the $ to ski destination resorts until I thought I was capable of most of the terrain.                                                                                                                                                                

 

Your location and situation make it hard to follow Tony's advice but it is good advice. Your review of Snowbird should make it easier to explain the bird to novice skiers what to expect from that mountain, thanks for that. I never forget the first time I looked at that mountain from the parking lot, hmmmm, we're going to spend the day skiing that? Next time you go to Utah, don't lock yourself into one resort, there is so much great skiing for every level if you move around a bit. I'm heading over to TGR now to see how teh maggots are treating this, should be entertaining.

 

post #48 of 92

My sympathies to your wife.  I hope she heals up ok.

 

I think it is inexcusable to show green terrain on a trailmap, only to have that terrain and lift "closed" when you try to go skiing at the resort..

 

It sounds like you got hit by a double whammy.  You were trying to learn to ski deep snow, and you were over-terrained. 

 

I remember my first foray into deeper snow, but I had well-developed skills from skiing for many years before I had to learn how to ski the deep stuff.  It was here at this resort http://www.mountwashington.ca/  (trail map here http://www.mountwashington.ca/ ).  Skis react a little differently when they are buried in snow than when they are sliding across a firm flat surface, and even if you know how to tip your skis to turn, you still can't tip them too far or they will sink out of sight, and you can't put too much weight on one ski or it will head to China.  You have to devote a few days just to learning how to ski deep snow even if you already know how to ski hard pack and ice. 

 

On the other hand my experience was also different from your's not just because of ability, but because of the Mountain.  Yes it's true that the ratings are for trails that are a lot steeper than the same ratings in the east, but the snow is so soft it slows you down.  Yes it's true that as soon as I stepped off my ski I was up to my armpits in snow (and not touching the bottom).  Yes it's true that there were steep places to ski, but there were also real green runs that were OPEN.  This was many years ago and my soon to be wife who had had a miserable day trying to learn to ski as young teenager, was game to try again.  I taught her a little bit of what I knew on the greens, and by the end of week 1 she was enjoying a few of the blues.   Besides Bear and Marmot etc. from the green chair there are more beginner trails that would be available even if they closed the green chair lift.  If you look at the trial map you will see at the top of the Hawk 6-pack chair lift, there is a run called sunset that takes off to viewer's left.  This is an easy trail, so are all the greens that it leads to.  

 

CAVEAT you may still have some speed freaks using sunset a route back to the lift after building as much speed as humanly possible skiing off the cliff and cutting between west basin and westerly .  However, now that the new Boomerang lift is in place, they might take that instead, or be diverted to the North Bowl, now that the long traverse back from McKay lake is covered by a lift (been there done that, the descent was fun, the cross-country skiing on SG skis back was not).  Still "reverse traverse does cut across some fairly steep fast runs, so you have to keep your eyes peeled.

post #49 of 92

Great TR. I had a very unfortunate experience with some adult green slope skiers on a day with a foot or two of fresh snow. The lift serving the green slope dropped off so fast that several of the group could not get off the chair without falling and soon lost all interest in trying. The slope I was trying to help them with alternated between too steep and too flat with all the fresh snow. They would fall in some places and pole in others. These were people with several days of ski school and multiple ski trips in previous years yet they just gave up and stayed in their room for the remainder of the trip. And as we know, Snowbird is not a good resort for non skiers so it made for a lousy trip.    

post #50 of 92

Every skier should bookmark this website below. It has many ski area maps using color to indicate steepness.  If esumsea had seen this he would have skipped Snowbird:

 

From:

 

http://3dskimaps.com/

 

Also use this to navigate and zoom:

 

http://3dskimaps.com/ge/

 

Snowbird:

 

http://3dskimaps.com/snowbird/overhead

 

Go to the site if it doesn't show up here.  Compare this with Breckenridge, for example:

 

http://3dskimaps.com/breckenridge/overhead

 

Those overheads give precise steepness per area.  The "overview" maps, OTOH, give you a look at the mountain from above and the side, very useful.. One problem is that the boundaries in these maps aren't marked.  If the color is gray, it's a cliff.  Also, the tree areas are shaded and makes that look as if trees are cliffs.  The algorithm needs work, but is a great tool.


Edited by whippersnapper - 11/7/10 at 4:19pm
post #51 of 92

WS, Thanks for the link.

 

Neat site. Pick your next vacation spot by color. 

post #52 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGrump View Post


 


I can see the bird phone rep saying ‘Sir, don’t come here, you are not good enough’. Next stop – back of the unemployment line. Caveat emptor.  

 


Exactly. If he was totally clueless and had no idea that snowbird was an experts hill, thats one thing. But he was warned and was over confident thinking he could go out there and conquer the mountain. 

 

He was 1 mile from Alta and could have taken the bus over there every day to ski if he wanted to.

 

Ultimately, some people need to learn stuff on their own.

 

 

LL

 

This is just hilarious.

post #53 of 92

Took my wife who was intermediate at the time to the Bird for a week's vacation and she did fine. Got over 40 inches during that the week as well.  I think a lot has to do with the attitude of the skier, if they are going to be intimidated because everyone is telling them this is a beast then they will fail.  If they are encouraged and have a strong skiing mentor with them they can have an enjoyable week. 

post #54 of 92


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingGrump View Post

WS, Thanks for the link.

 

Neat site. Pick your next vacation spot by color. 


Soytenly!

Quote:

Originally Posted by au516 View Post

Took my wife who was intermediate at the time to the Bird for a week's vacation and she did fine. Got over 40 inches during that the week as well.  I think a lot has to do with the attitude of the skier, if they are going to be intimidated because everyone is telling them this is a beast then they will fail.  If they are encouraged and have a strong skiing mentor with them they can have an enjoyable week. 

 

Indeed, conditions and attitude are so key.  I skied (April 1980) Alta one day and the Bird the next with a buddy because our hang-gliding lessons at Point of the Mountain were postponed 2 days because of wind.  The first day we did Alta.  It was stunning, but I floundered all day be cause I hadn't skied in bottomless wet snow before, even after a season at Jackson.  I cursed because everywhere were beautiful narrow chutes off nearly every run. (I think the old Germania lift?)  Ended up on High Rustler which was really fun because the soft moguls were familiar.

 

After sleeping on my failure, I thought, "Hmm, it's neither powder nor corn nor hardpack, I'll try submerging the skis level about 6" under the snow."  Worked like a dream. I was having a blast until I took a ride in a full-depth slide on the central ridge, not quite as far north as Berry Berry Steep, and so they closed the ridge.  I was saved by a strong stand of Aspens, still grateful!

 

But had the snow been powder, the story would be different.  Powder is _simple_ to ski, but takes lots of grunt.  A good brave athlete even at the beginner level can learn it in a day.  In those conditions the open faces of Snowbird/Alta/Jackson etc. are much easier than eastern moguls, let alone ice. If you fall in powder there is no pain, so you can tear at the terrain with abandon and learn the balance fast.  And steeper is actually easier until about 40(?) degrees or so.  Deciding whether you're falling or skiing in powder is almost a value judgment.  Skiing well on ice takes a damn long time though, I never became good at it.

post #55 of 92

this thread is EPICski

post #56 of 92
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Crocker View Post

 

I reviewed the original thread.  This statement

 

was not made until 1/31/10, after esumsea had booked his trip to Snowbird.  The original post only said   

 which still elicited several warnings, despite most readers probably assuming considerably more than 3 days lifetime experience.  So I'm not so sure my after-the-fact comment in April would in fact have deterred this trip if made earlier.  Even the most cursory research would have shown Snowbird consistently on lists of steepest, most challenging resorts in North America, so I do have some difficulty understanding why someone with 3 days lifetime on skis would spend ~$2K to go there.    

 

I will say that I also started skiing as an adult and that progress in the beginner stage was slow.  I was hooked but also had the attitude that I was not going to spend the $ to ski destination resorts until I thought I was capable of most of the terrain.  Fortunately in Southern California I had access to to daytrip skiing at small areas plus Mammoth weekends to measure progress in ability and what terrain I could ski.  I did make 2 key mistakes in choice of ski area.  The first was within Southern California, going to Mt. Baldy as a beginner because it was the closest and most convenient.  Baldy is sort of the Snowbird of SoCal (steep and not the greatest grooming in 1976) and I blew an ACL on my second day there.  The later mistake was going to Jackson Hole in late March of 1986.  I was capable of most of its terrain by then but I neglected to appreciate the significance of Jackson's SE exposure at that time of year vs. the midwinter conditions I was used to on Mammoth's mostly north slopes.  The latter mistake was the first motivation for me to analyze snow and ski conditions to the obsessive detail that I post here and elsewhere from time to time.                                                                                                                                                                        


Hey Tony,

 

With all due respect (and I appreciate, have used and learned a lot of what you have posted), you are incorrect.  Maybe it is because I had linked the wrong thread by mistake, which was asking for advice for the trip I am going on now rather than the one I went on last spring, which is when I went to Snowbird.  The correct thread is:http://www.epicski.com/forum/thread/90780/help-with-where-to-go-for-the-best-skiing-in-late-march-early-april-please-help-a-newbie-out/60#post_1265467

 

On the poll itself it states: My wife and I went skiing for the first time this holiday season at Heavenly, and we loved it so much, we want to go skiing again for my spring break.

 

I don't think I added that on the 20th (the last time I edited the original post), but it could have been, but still that is before the 31st. Either way, I had not chosen my destination until the 26th of February. 

 

Yes, I was warned, and I have stated as much.  I should have listened. But there have been many times I have been told something was too hard and I was able to master it with no problem.  My point is that when I went to the horse's mouth and called Snowbird several times, not once did anyone say the truth about their mountain.  Not the main line, not the ski school, not the lodging rep, no one.  I kept reporting back that I had all these people warning me, but they kept dismissing that opinion repeatedly stating that Snowbird had plenty of terrain for everyone.  That is simply not the case, ESPECIALLY when they close big thunder.  Perhaps I should have known better, but seeing that I am a beginner, I think you can understand why I did not.  I researched Snowbird in more than a cursory way.  Sometimes when you know a subject well you can fathom how some parts of that information can be obscure to one who does not.  Believe me I do research and I try to learn.

 

Lastly, I am glad you had that experience in Jackson Hole, because it was the wellspring of some valuable information that I have used almost to a fault.  Thanks for your efforts.

 

post #57 of 92

You should go over to tgr and post nekid pics of your spinner wife that'll teach those meanyheads

post #58 of 92


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MTskier View Post

this thread is EPICski



Superbros fkna.jpg

post #59 of 92
Thread Starter 

Thanks for all the posts and support.  Glad that over here people support rather than try to denigrate.  I have not been able to check back, but here are a few thoughts and responses to what was posted while I was gone:

 

KevinF: I appreciate the complements and well-wishes.  I try, even though it may get me flamed.  Glad you had the same impression of Snowbird.

 

Paul Jones: I would love to go to Epic ski.  Unfortunately my school schedule always precludes me from doing so.  Yeah, the equipment would concern me also, that is why I went to Sierra Jim and got some Solomon boots and blizzard Magnum 7.6 skis.  Don’t have to worry about getting taken advantage of by unscrupulous ski shops.

 

KingGrump: “It's going to take more than 1 ESA for OP to rip up the bird - a lot more.” I agree. “The folks at TGR are just not sugar coating it as the PC enabled folks here.” I don’t agree.  Just look at the title of some of the threads at TGR and you can surmise the general attitude there.  That is why I am glad I chose to join this place.  My suspicions of TGR were only confirmed.

 

“Being polite & PC will only build self esteem. Unfortunately, Mother Nature haven't attended the corporate sponsored sensitivity class and certainly couldn't care less about ones self esteem. Respect her and learn to dance with her. You'll have way more fun.” Totally agree.

 

Bob Peters, skibum4ever, steveturner: Thanks for the complements.  Sorry to hear you had a similar experience but at least you can commiserate.  Yes, my wife and I are still in love with skiing and yes, I will write another report about Summit county and Breck, in particular.

 

Metaphor, Ghost: Thanks for the well wishes   

 

Whippersnapper: Thanks for the info and complements.  While I believe I started the thread with the words “My wife and I went skiing for the first time this holiday season at Heavenly” I may have added it later, but not too much later.  Still I will try better to be more specific in the future.  Thanks for the great links!!!

 

Ant: Thanks for the complement on the review.  This line: “Having Emma et al marked as green is quite misleading. I used to watch people lose control and shoot down the top bit, saw one girl get about15 feet of air off the main cat track as she hit it, and came down like a bag of laundy, horrible to watch.  Patrol had to sled her away. She was screaming all the way from the top. “ is what I am talking about.  Scary thought.  You give good advice, especially with your last two sentences.

 

Liam: “Hey look, he actually called snowbird and the snowbird ski school before booking and it sounds like they didn't steer him away (and yes, of course they wouldn't-but still..) plus who wouldn't be attracted to the ease of access, and great slopeside lodging and general affordability of Utah skiing?  You know, for newbies, there a lot to learn beyond just skiing--but where to ski and what information to trust--like everything else in life, it only comes from experience.”

 

Thanks man, you seem to be able to read me loud and clear.  Sometimes it is hard to regress and see things from a newbie point of view.  You seem to not have this problem.  Yes, a lot of what lead me to Snowbird was not the mountain, but the lodging, the great package deal, the restaurants etc, but I was still leery.  It was the misinformation I received from Snowbird that led me to choose it.  I don’t know why KingGrump would suggest the rep would get fired if he said “Snowbird is a very steep and difficult mountain, you may have a tough time finding skiable terrain, “ rather than, “No, that’s ridiculous, there is plenty of trials to ski at Snowbird for any level.” All I am suggesting is that they be more honest in their assessment of the mountain.  Glad you like the review.  I did not just want to post a fan boy review, but a cautionary tale about what happened to me, even though some of it is embarrassing.

 

Jimmy: “Mario, I enjoy your posts and your enthusiasm for skiing. Going to Utah to ski and not spending a day at the Bird, no matter what kind of skier you are, is wasting a trip to Utah, but going to Snowbird to learn to ski, as you found out is like signing up for dancing with the stars to learn to dance.  I understand that your I”

 

Thanks man, funny post!

 

Skifishbum: "You should go over to tgr and post nekid pics of your spinner wife that'll teach those meanyheads." Not sure if you are trying to be sarcastic.  but this is what I was going to head my review with (with the caption welcome to Snowbird).

 

Wlcome to Snowbird 2.jpg

 

She is a Snow bird. Guess she does not mind that I am all head, or maybe that is why she is with me


Edited by esumsea - 11/8/10 at 6:19pm
post #60 of 92

...knee looks fine to me

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