Do you wear a helmet or recommend wearing one while skiing? - Page 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTKook 

 

They have them.  A lot of the more-substantial armor is still an undergarment, though.  It can still also cause significant layering issues of it's own, because it can get hot.

 

For Bushwhacker, I didn't know the circumstances of your Dad's accident, and hope I didn't seem insensitive in talking about Leatts.  My point is, they actually do work for what they're designed for. now that they exist.  (I was skeptical when they came out, because of the way helmets and knee braces have been promoted, but unlike for them, for Leatts the stats are meaningful).  They're actually not even all that cumbersome.  So it's very rational to wear one if one is concerned about that type of injury risk.  Sports with significant injury risk tend to have an awareness of both the risk, and ways to mitigate it.  Hence moto or bmx and use of Leatts, now that they're available.  (They also don't mitigate all risk, obviously, and for things like XC mtb would imo be too hot and constricting).

 

While patrollers certainly see their share of life-changing spinal injuries on ski hills, the risk to the average Joe or Jane of head or spine trauma is so low that there's very little awareness of what the risk is.  So they have little awareness of the actual protective gear that's out there.  This is reaonable.  Most people are at more risk of a head injury at a summer backyard pool party than they are skiing, and they don't helmet up at the pool.  But there is also great awareness of a quasi-moral "need" for one type of gear that's very visible and so fashion-based -- helmets, versus shinguards, spine protectors, Leatts, etc. etc.

 

Telling people they should wear less protective gear can be helpful.  If I show up for a MTB epic on buff singletrack wearing full DH armor, you'll think it a little odd, and if I hold everyone up because I'm suffering heat stress 10 minutes into the ride you'll likely be even a little annoyed.  You might then tell me to wear less ch*t.  If someone shows up for a backcountry ski tour wearing a Leatt, I'm not goin' with them.  Sidecountry, maybe, but they get listed as a gear freak in my mental book.

wouldnt you need a full face helmet to use a leatt?  I guess the fact that a full face helmet can torque your neck would go down alot with the leatt.

trust me I do wish that the leatt was around and being used by my dad 16 years ago. My life would be way different today if that was the case. 

The points you make about someone showing up with gear that hinder them(IE full body armor on an epic ride), where as a helmet really doesnt hinder anyones skiing.

one thing about visiting my dad in rehab as kid was realize how much worse it could be. meeting someone who has had a TBI will make you sad almost no matter what. spinal cord injuries are lucky compared to severe TBIs.

Eccimortal-on ... see what kind of winter you have when you call everyone not wearing a helmet in the lift line a moron. You better wear a helmet. 

Did you do a ski-carrying-helicopter in the lift line ? And on the way to that lift line did you wear your cat-tracks to the lift-base ? How much fat did you have for breakfast at the base lodge 20 minutes before you rode the lift. Do you have half-gone all seasons on the SUV - like most people on the Sea-to-Sky ? Did you look at the GPS en route ? Or talk on the cell while following at two seconds on winter roads ?

If I was going to wear a helmet on a regular basis it would be because the turkey on the chair next to me yanked the safety-bar down as soon as he could - without warning. That's my anecdotal  "evidence" .

That's 7200 skier injuries per 4.8 million skier days. That is ALL injuries. HOW MANY CONCUSSIONS PER THAT ? 

Do your kids play soccer and head the ball. OR hockey. OR FOOTBALL. These sports have many times more concussions than the skier/ day stats.

But you probably won't have a head injury NOT because you didn't wear a helmet... but because you did not crash... or if you did, your head did not get rubbed, scraped or crushed... perhaps wet. Maybe your goggles got filled again. 

Operative word "LIVE"  dangerously and some of the personality changes with head injuries NOT NICE  I'm hard enough to live with now!!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA 

 

wouldnt you need a full face helmet to use a leatt?  I guess the fact that a full face helmet can torque your neck would go down alot with the leatt...

 

 

No, a Leatt would work with what you might call a "rec skiing" open face if it gives what you'd call full coverage.  But you are correct that the specific dangers caused by the torque from a full face are offset a lot by the Leatt. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost 

We should all go back to being pedestrians.

A well known member of our community recently died of a head injury he received while at the local country club.  He stepped on a crack in the cement walkway, fell over, and smacked his head on the concrete.  Being a pedestrian didn't save him, but a helmet would have.  However I do not recommend wearing a helmet while walking.  Skiing, yes, walking, no.

Question for those suggesting making helmets mandatory - which standard should the legislation specify - CE, ASTM or SNELL?

I could use body armor, helmets are of of no use to me.

Wow everyone that skis a lot wears helmets. Been sking a lot for 50+ years, never wore one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwiski 

Question for those suggesting making helmets mandatory - which standard should the legislation specify - CE, ASTM or SNELL?

Let those who slide decide.....

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexzn 

...First of all, helmet use on a ski hill is practically a done deal- almost everyone who skis more than a few days per year wears them nowadays.   Second, every protective gear is a compromise between comfort, safety, and costs.  I honestly do not see any compromises in comfort when I am wearing a well-designed well-fitting helmet , in reality it is more comfortable than hat.  And the cost is pretty small compared to the cost of everything else.  So, I honestly don't see a tradeoff in this case...

So, why are we bothering with this question again?...

Actually, first of all, the only group (outside user groups like racers who are required to wear them) among which you could say that "practically everyone" wears helmets at ski areas are what you'd call "affluent enthusiasts" who take a few destination vacations a year and identify heavily with people like Natasha Richardson.   A lot of the groups among which helmet use is often in the minority care a lot about their gear, and while it may be a newsflash to some there's no indication these user groups are on average dumber than the "affluent enthusiasts."  SOmetimes smellier, but not dumber.  So it may well be a lot of people do see  a tradeoff.  If you can't see a tradeoff, then, for you, as one user of the hill, there's no apparent tradeoff -- but a lot of other people may want to regulate heat better, have more freedom of movement, not want something that makes them FEEL, but not be, less vulnerable in trees, is less bulky, etc. etc. 

Cavalierly suggesting that everyone blow money on something that in aggregate still hasn't been shown to improve safety because, to you, it isn't a lot of money is kinda strange.  Waxing daily doesn't cost that much more money than waxing every three days, either, but I for one am happy to let others make their own waxing decisions.  And yeah, well-tuned and waxed skis can be more important to safety than anything you wear.

I love blanket statements. While it is currently the sliders choice to wear or not wear a helmet, I do see that changing at some point, it is starting with kids and we will see it moving up the ladder.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockSlide 

 

 

Purely from a safety standpoint, how many skiers really die of head injuries?

Saved mine, at least according to my doc. I got taken out from behind at Jay Peak by a skier who later told me she pulled up to ski behind me because I was such a "lovely skier." Her ski between my legs. I went down and was knocked unconscious. Next thing I remember was sliding on the rock hard ice covered slope thinking - gee, I am glad I am wearing a helmet. Passed out again and awoke in a crumpled heap. Hate to think what the result would have been without the brain bucket. Not Good. I also learned it does not pay to ski in an "attractive" way.

David

Well, I can't exactly tell my kids not to smoke and then smoke a pack a day myself.  Nor can I tell them not to eat with their mouth open and then slurp my soup.  So I started to wear a helmet.  Now it is like a seatbelt...I feel uncomfortable without it.  We all are going to wear a hat anyway, so why not wear one that also protects the brain?

Nobody's said this yet, so I will.  I like my helmet.  It gives me a little protection, it's comfortable, warm or cool as needed, keeps my goggles from moving around, and gives me a place to put my gloves in the lodge.  

I don't care what anyone else wears, or thinks about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posaune 

Nobody's said this yet, so I will.  I like my helmet.  It gives me a little protection, it's comfortable, warm or cool as needed, keeps my goggles from moving around, and gives me a place to put my gloves in the lodge.  

 

I don't care what anyone else wears, or thinks about it.

X2. I cannot think of a downside. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philpug 

X2. I cannot think of a downside. 

Hiking, just to state one very obvious one. 

Downside: takes up space in my tiny car (and storage space at home) , one more thing to keep track of (touque fits in a pocket on the bootbag), and remember to pack,  One day less skiing 'cause the lift ticket $$ had to be used for the helmet. That's all I've noticed so far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by deliberate1 

 I also learned it does not pay to ski in an "attractive" way.

 

Fortunately I've never had this problem.

Quote:

Originally Posted by L&AirC 

..., keeps my noggin warm, makes it easier to listen to music, it's a good place to put "shut up and ski" stickers, ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexzn 

... in reality it is more comfortable than hat.  And the cost is pretty small compared to the cost of everything else.  So, I honestly don't see a tradeoff in this case...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posaune 

...I like my helmet.  It gives me a little protection, it's comfortable, warm or cool as needed, keeps my goggles from moving around, and gives me a place to put my gloves in the lodge.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philpug 

...I cannot think of a downside. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete No. Idaho 

... Beside I like the music from my Ipod.Rock out.

Great stuff!  Keep it coming.  We'll get this settled.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTKook 

Hiking, just to state one very obvious one. 

I can open the vents on my helmet and cannot do that with a hat. If I want to take it off, I can hang it on my pack (just as putting a hat in the pack)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTKook 

Actually, first of all, the only group (outside user groups like racers who are required to wear them) among which you could say that "practically everyone" wears helmets at ski areas are what you'd call "affluent enthusiasts" who take a few destination vacations a year and identify heavily with people like Natasha Richardson.   A lot of the groups among which helmet use is often in the minority care a lot about their gear, and while it may be a newsflash to some there's no indication these user groups are on average dumber than the "affluent enthusiasts."  SOmetimes smellier, but not dumber.  So it may well be a lot of people do see  a tradeoff.  If you can't see a tradeoff, then, for you, as one user of the hill, there's no apparent tradeoff -- but a lot of other people may want to regulate heat better, have more freedom of movement, not want something that makes them FEEL, but not be, less vulnerable in trees, is less bulky, etc. etc. 

 

Cavalierly suggesting that everyone blow money on something that in aggregate still hasn't been shown to improve safety because, to you, it isn't a lot of money is kinda strange.  Waxing daily doesn't cost that much more money than waxing every three days, either, but I for one am happy to let others make their own waxing decisions.  And yeah, well-tuned and waxed skis can be more important to safety than anything you wear.

Are you that far out of touch?

Apparently you have also never worn a good helmet.
 

When we were at Winter Park almost no Pros wore helmets?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Garrison 

When we were at Winter Park almost no Pros wore helmets?

Are you asking us or telling us? What defined a Pro? 

I don't wear a helmet, and I don't recommend them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkiMangoJazz 

Fortunately I've never had this problem.

Steve, at Vail you and I can spend some quality time. I will make you irresistible to women who want to run into you.

David

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philpug 

I can open the vents on my helmet and cannot do that with a hat. If I want to take it off, I can hang it on my pack (just as putting a hat in the pack)

Not just the same as putting a hat in the pack.  The helmet is far bulkier, and if you hang it on the outside, you have the weight banging around if you don't strap it well, and still adding to the profile and ungainliness of your pack if you can strap it down.  Plus, a lot of people don't want to wear a big pack.  Depending on what you're doing, this can range from no big deal to really annoying to a real bad deal. 

As for ECimmortal, I'm out of touch when it comes to the Jonas Brothers, but pretty in touch on the hill.  You've got all sorts of user groups at the hill, and yeah, in very few of those user groups do you see a preponderance of helmet wearers.  And this makes sense:  it's a bulky piece of gear of limited utility.  If there are very few user groups that tend to wear spine protectors except for specialized uses, it shouldn't be too surprising that helmets get treated on a similarly rational basis.  The two themes here are personal choice and rational evaluation of when to use various types of gear. 

I didn't respond to the poll, because there's no answer that I agree with. I'd check off "No, because I choose not to" if it were there. Are helmets for dorks? Absolutely not! Some skiers and boarders are at a higher risk for head injuries than others. Anyone who skies tree, bashes gates, or plays in a park should probably consider a helmet. Are helmets for everyone? I'm not so sure.

Note that I'm not "anti-helmet". I wear one mountain biking, road biking, on motorcycles and on snowmobiles....

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTKook 

 

Not just the same as putting a hat in the pack.  The helmet is far bulkier, and if you hang it on the outside, you have the weight banging around if you don't strap it well, and still adding to the profile and ungainliness of your pack if you can strap it down.  Plus, a lot of people don't want to wear a big pack.  Depending on what you're doing, this can range from no big deal to really annoying to a real bad deal. 

 

As for ECimmortal, I'm out of touch when it comes to the Jonas Brothers, but pretty in touch on the hill.  You've got all sorts of user groups at the hill, and yeah, in very few of those user groups do you see a preponderance of helmet wearers.  And this makes sense:  it's a bulky piece of gear of limited utility.  If there are very few user groups that tend to wear spine protectors except for specialized uses, it shouldn't be too surprising that helmets get treated on a similarly rational basis.  The two themes here are personal choice and rational evaluation of when to use various types of gear. 

You are clearly more out of touch than you think. I don't know where you ski, but when I line up for first chair on a powder day 90 percent of the people around me are wearing helmets.

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexzn 

...Most of the ski bums at Squaw wear a helmet, some wear full face and not because they want to look more affluent, but because they need it for the stuff they are skiing sometimes...

Uhh, no.  There are SOME ski bums/ bro brahs who wear helmets, including full faces (and a few film stars who come to mind who wear fullfaces most of the time), but the majority of bro brahs are much more into knit hats. 

What you are doing -- observing highly visible rocky lines, for the most part -- is similar to a tourist going to Bootleg Canyon a few times (a very rocky and steep MTB area), observing the shuttle van, and concluding that the majority of "core" mountain bikers are always in fullfaces, full DH armor and ride freeride-oriented downhill sleds.  Even at Bootleg Canyon, most aren't checking those three gear choice boxes, because most aren't riding those visible lines on any given day.

Strangely many ski bums make gear choices on a similar basis.