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Technique vs Technology? - Page 2

post #31 of 75

"John Day,River last weekend on a fishing trip."

Oooh! Oooh!

I've read lots about the John Day and want to try it sometime.


How was it.

post #32 of 75
Originally posted by dchan:
Given this info would depend on if the lessons were followed up with enough practice

Miles and miles on the mountain with a trained eye would get my betting dollar. someone just taking lessons and not getting the time on the snow to practice would not out ski someone with the experience in my opinion.

So the short answer is "it depends"
I was going to say the same thing.
Have plenty of friends who getlots of skiing practice. They may have lessons - but immediately after the lesson they will be off skiing as they always have.
I'm almost the exact opposite.
My regular routine is
1 hour warm up
Collect instructor - 2-3 hours of lesson
Practice -either doing runs of exercises as prescibed or skiing set terrain with certain 'cues' to think about. Practice goes until I can no longer perform movements correctly(no use practising WRONG). For me my mental stamina usually gives out first - I lose the ability to keep concentrating well enough.
post #33 of 75
Thread Starter 
We go to John Day about 3-4 times every summer. Lots of little towns to check out like Fossial, Spray, Kimberly, ect. Every Memorial Day Fossial has the bikers parade and Spray has the Rodeo. They seem to stay to themselves. Smallmouth Bass for the most part. The wife got skunked and I caught 4 over 12". She hates it when I cast next to her and catch one and she doesn't. It's all about presentation. But growing-up on the coast of Oregon, your born with a fishing pole in your hands.
But the BEST fishing around here is The Deschutes River and High Cascade Lakes. There are some monsters in the lakes. By all means look me up if you ever get to Central Oregon. Skiers are always welcome at the ranch.
post #34 of 75
Bop Peters post reminded me that I too had some firsthand experience with this.
During the 97/98 season I got my first shaped GS skis. A friend of mine a (few years younger) that I've raced against for years and usually run about 5 or 6 HCP numbers behind, didn't think that was the way to go. He stayed with his straight 210s. During six nights of league racing he only beat me by .04 once.
That year we both went to the NASTAR Finals at Snowmass. I skied about the same relative to the other guys my age in our Midwest league. He got a new pair of Vokls and won the age group, beating me by about the same margin as he had in years past.
Since then he's maintained that lead.
post #35 of 75
Remember- Friends don't let friends ride straight skis!!! :

post #36 of 75
You're absolutely right. A 185 cm straight ski can kill or maim. I recommend that you confiscate said skis and immediately ship them to me.

If you happen to come upon a pair of unused, unmounted straight 185s, steady yourself. They are particularly cunning and, frankly, should be overnighted to me for everyones safety.

[ May 31, 2002, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: WhosThatGirl ]
post #37 of 75
Thread Starter 
Why not go whole hog and strap a pair of 205's on.
post #38 of 75
Size very very important.

187 too big.
183 too small.
185 just right. [img]smile.gif[/img]
post #39 of 75
Hey! Discriminating against people for their choice of skis is bigotry! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
post #40 of 75
Thread Starter 
I hear ya, I just bought a pair of 180cm Atomics. Pretty shameful for a 5'10" 180# male eh?
post #41 of 75
My dad likes to sometimes go to a place where nobody knows him, and use his straight skis.

If his students say, you know my new skis make me ski so well, he says, yeah, if I put them at the top of the hill without you on them you think they would turn so well by themselves?
post #42 of 75
How about for a 5'6" 130 pounder skiing on a pair of 1976 205cm Spaulding "Starboards" at his first PSIA clinic in 1990!!!!

Stein is my hero, so I was gracefull. After one day, someone in the clinic hooked me up with "modern" skiis. Didn't change much, because I didn't know how to ski them.

Times have changed. Every now and then I put on "straights" just to remember old times.
post #43 of 75
Thread Starter 
Oh the shame of it all. A closet skier. What will your friends say? Will you try and hide them in the snow when your on them? Maybe I should have pick a more suitable phrase. Perhaps when your in the lift line you could sissor your legs to make them look longer. I guess hanging your head in disbelief only to remember the good old days of the 210 GS Crudmasters. A tear will come to my eye when I think of Ullr and how we've faultered.
post #44 of 75
My AT bindings are on conventional skis. my first pair of "good" skis, Olin DTSLs (the first ones, with the orange and black stained glass graphics). I love those skis. But in a few days I'm going to get the AT bindings remounted onto some Olin Sierras, becuz they'll be more fun to ski on.
I've got a cupboard full of once state of the art slaloms and bump skis, and will never use them again! I've got a pair of skis Blizzard made for Renate Goetschl (slaloms). I've got a left over pair from the run K2 did for Johnny Mosely for the olympics where he won. I've got hand-me-downs from a friend (who came 25th in the olympic slalom) - race Rossis.

and they will probably all end up as wall decorations as an intermediate shaped ski is now more fun that this lot.
post #45 of 75
I'm 5'10 180 and ski 150-160 cm!
post #46 of 75
I couldn't help myself - I was driving home from my tennis club this morning and happened by one of the many yard sales that have been springing up in the "new" decent weather [for spring, it's decent]. I couldn't help but spot a few pairs of skis leaning against the picket fence wearing price tags. My Acura is a speedy car, but not quite fast enough to pass that yard sale. There were a pair of Kastle something-or-others, with Salomon bindings [vintage, but lookin' good], and of course they were RED [in my experince, red is a great color to find in skis, just trust me, ok?]. So! Took a close look at the skis, and they were in phenomenally good shape, tops and bottoms, both. Even the groove in the base of each ski was flawless. They were "nominally" 180's, and the important dimension, the price tag, was $5, no change. Anyone who thinks the skis had a chance of staying against the picket fence is in la la land. Got 'em home, and the tail of the tape revealed a length of 178, tip 83, waist 62, tail 74 - hey, are these "straight", or WHAT?! Can't wait to try these babies when Smugglers Notch whitens. FIVE BUCKS!!!
post #47 of 75
This reminds me of the days when if you got on the tram at Jackson with less than 210s you held them on the toe of your boot to avoid embarassment. :
post #48 of 75

I think the skis just had to tower over your head. I skied 190s and they were respectable for my size. Or so I told myself...

Here's an interesting twist on the topic. I spent some time today with five Level III snowboard instructors. Three of them told me they are skiing now. Not exclusively, but in addition to snowboarding.

What brought this on? I asked. The new skis.
post #49 of 75
You seem to live a parallel life to me!!!
The year I got my first pair or carvers (178cm), I was skiing in France.
So, here's the deal:
1. I am on K2s - back then no one in Europe skiied on them, even now they aren't that common in France.
2. I am going up chairs & cable cars to some of the more difficult runs.
3. Everyone (apart from me) is on straight skis, most are Salomon Force 9, etc.
4. My skis are around 30cm (1ft) shorter than everyone elses.

OK, so my day is spent being stared at on the lifts with a look of: "this guy is a foreigner, and a beginner, and he shouldn't be up here, this will be too tough for him."
Some then skied with me and realised that maybe I was on to something new. Yeah. Shorter, shaped skis!

post #50 of 75
In 1996 we organized a shape ski clinic and invited all the companies on the shape bandwagon--principally K2, Elan, and S-ski--to prvide demos. This was an outstanding clinic that tilted the fun-o-meter. We experimented with lengths from the low 120s to those corresponding to our straight skis to figls and Big Feet. The conditions were fresh powder and some groomed slopes. My daughters, 8 and 10, used the Big Feet and were ripping through powder like pros. I was particularly taken with a pair of 143 SCXs.

The purpose of the clinic was to bring NRM instructors into the new age. At the next season's fall clinician/examiner training, the avant garde were separated from the old guard by the tools on their feet. The next year, only the really old guard clung to their straights. By the year after (1999) to wear a straight ski was to admit that you were behind the times or to acknowledge that conditions were too sketchy for the new stuff and one preferred to compromise performance than to damage the bases of a new pair of expensive skis. That was the only acceptable disclaimer.

The next part of the progression had to do with length. Many skiers selected shapes that were too long. This is still happening with recreational skiers. They hate the shapes because they selected the wrong length. I have gone from a 175 Four in 1996 down to a 160 T9 in 2002, and feel I have found the perfect match.

When someone says they tried shapes and didn't like them, I suspect that their dislike is attributable to length.
post #51 of 75
Thread Starter 
I too started on shapes at a ski school. 130cm Elans. It took a few weeks to settle down on them, but soon no poles and deep powder were the big fun for the day. As a Instructor lifting 200# sit-skiers we use 170-180 Rossi shapes. What little free ski time I get, they seem to preform well. I purchased 3 years ago a pair of 191cm Volkl shapes. They are a great ski. However, I think they are too long for me and have dropped to a 180cm Atomic for next season. After skiing 130cm in waist deep powder without any floatation problems, I agree with you that many skiers are going too long at first.
post #52 of 75
I've skied Elan for more than 20 years. They've always had one of the deepest sidecuts(even when Stenmark was on them). For the 91/92 season they sent me a pair of 210 GS that were 4mm wider at the tip and 2mm narrower at the waist than current slalom skis. I loaned them to one of the Level IIIs at Tyrol and asked him(after a run) how long he thought they were. He replied,"knowing you they must be about 200 but they ski like 185s". He almost feinted when I told him they were 210s. :
These days I ride 163 HCXs with the 20mm plate. I also have a pair of WC GS in 184mm. I broke my leg in a car accident last Jan. and only got the GS skis in March so I haven't raced on them but they were making fun turns on CH this spring. [img]smile.gif[/img]
post #53 of 75
My last pairs of conventionals were 190s, I'm 160cm. (5'3" in the old measurement). I tried some 195s but wasn't happy with them at all.

I remember hearing a story that you'd see Sylvester Stallone walking around Aspen carrying these monster 200+ skis that towered right over him (they say he's short). Apparently he couldn't ski them, just carried them around!
post #54 of 75
This reminds me of all those bumper stickers from years ago.
Short what? :
post #55 of 75
I suppose that relates to something we gals call d*ck sw*ng*ng?
post #56 of 75
Originally posted by nolo:
I suppose that relates to something we gals call d*ck sw*ng*ng?
Which miraculously brings us *all* the way back to the thread's original question...

Which is better, technique or equipment?

post #57 of 75
Technique, Certainly !

As to equipment, let me just say my equipment and I go back a long way........!

post #58 of 75
I have nothing to add.
post #59 of 75
A well placed source in Telluride told me once that Sly backed out of a lucrative real estate purchase in the Mountain Village because they wouldn't change the adjacent run's name to Rambo!
post #60 of 75
I know it can be done on shorties - I've seen Barnes rip around real good on 'em.

But c'mon. Don't ya feel like a dork when your skis aren't even tall enough to fit in the rack without falling over?

Then, whadda you do when I walk by and ask, "Are those your little sisters skis"?

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