or Connect
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Wedge Christie Mechanics - Page 2

post #31 of 38

Why not simply teach the wedge christie as a progression from a wedge turn?  It isn't really a different thing, merely a more advanced wedge turn with an enhanced turn entry and progressively greater outside ski dominance. Its skill development and increased speed, not a "form", as they used to say.

post #32 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kneale Brownson View Post

Forward side slips to develop edge release skills.

 

Really any slipping type of exercise or game including 360s is very useful.  I like to focus on facing in the direction of travel with the upper body (this is downhill BTW) and releasing the edges by extending the outside (uphill) leg to force the CM over the inside (downhill) foot flattening the inside ski and causing the edge release.  Yes, I am also rolling the ankles and should perhaps ideally be starting the edge release with the ankle roll, but I really am more interested in getting my students to move their CM into the turn, or down the hill, or anywhere at all rather than being stuck inside and back in a static position.  Most skiers I see, even in higher level lessons, are not very good at side-slipping of any kind even though they often think they are until they try.  Facing downhill with the upper body and being balanced over the downhill foot in an offensive position really opens the door into other useful movements including turn initiation from a forward side slip.  I find that particular move to be extremely useful when skiing in steep tight places. 

post #33 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by oisin View Post

Why not simply teach the wedge christie as a progression from a wedge turn?  It isn't really a different thing, merely a more advanced wedge turn with an enhanced turn entry and progressively greater outside ski dominance. Its skill development and increased speed, not a "form", as they used to say.

 

I don't teach it because it's not what I want my students to be doing.  They will naturally move through a sort of wedge christy on their way to making their first parallel turns and I expect to see that, but only for a short time.  As any L2 or L3 candidate will tell you a well done and refined wedge christy is not easy.  The only people that need to do them well are ski instructors.  It truly is easier to do a basic parallel turn.  That's what I'm teaching.

post #34 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetonpwdrjunkie View Post

 

I don't teach it because it's not what I want my students to be doing.  They will naturally move through a sort of wedge christy on their way to making their first parallel turns and I expect to see that, but only for a short time.  As any L2 or L3 candidate will tell you a well done and refined wedge christy is not easy.  The only people that need to do them well are ski instructors.  It truly is easier to do a basic parallel turn.  That's what I'm teaching.

That's my point, it is something you move through as part of the progression. Its guided skill development and not the learning of forms. The point is to continue the development, not to get hung up on the "way stations" along the journey. I agree that skiing it well is not easy and perhaps not necessary but the skills and movements are part of the development toward parallel skiing. There comes a point though, I think, when spending too much time stopped along the way is counterproductive. If a student were to move quickly to parallel, so much the better, as long as he doesn't neglect to learn the skills and movements that will enable him/her to eventually ski parallel well.

post #35 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by oisin View Post

That's my point, it is something you move through as part of the progression. Its guided skill development and not the learning of forms. The point is to continue the development, not to get hung up on the "way stations" along the journey. I agree that skiing it well is not easy and perhaps not necessary but the skills and movements are part of the development toward parallel skiing. There comes a point though, I think, when spending too much time stopped along the way is counterproductive. If a student were to move quickly to parallel, so much the better, as long as he doesn't neglect to learn the skills and movements that will enable him/her to eventually ski parallel well.

 

I think we agree with each other.  

 

I would be hard pressed to think of a real life example of an intermediate lesson where I would spend ANY "time stopped along the way" trying to refine a wedge christy.  The only time I might actually teach a wedge christy and try to get a student to refine it and do it "well" would be in an advanced L8 or L9 lesson with someone who really wanted to work on technique on groomers.  There really is a lot to learn from refining a wedge christy and that's why it can be the bane of instructors working on higher level certification.  I think there are better things I can spend my time teaching an aspiring intermediate though.

post #36 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetonpwdrjunkie View Post

 

I think we agree with each other.  

 

I would be hard pressed to think of a real life example of an intermediate lesson where I would spend ANY "time stopped along the way" trying to refine a wedge christy.  The only time I might actually teach a wedge christy and try to get a student to refine it and do it "well" would be in an advanced L8 or L9 lesson with someone who really wanted to work on technique on groomers.  There really is a lot to learn from refining a wedge christy and that's why it can be the bane of instructors working on higher level certification.  I think there are better things I can spend my time teaching an aspiring intermediate though.

Yes we do agree. I think thats why I think discussion of teaching wedge christies, if that's what this is about. is a bit odd. On the other hand, the mechanics of it (thread title) are important for progress. I think its interesting that you might work on refining the wedge christie with an upper level student. There's no doubt that could improve their skiing, if you can get them to go back to it. I spent some time teaching with Europeans, especially the Austrians and Germans. They had quite a different approach (same mechanics though). They felt we move our students along too quickly. They were appalled to see our students skiing wedge christies and open parallel in their second day on skis. They seemed to think it was important to perfect the mechanics or lets say the skills and movements before moving up to the next level. hence their emphasis on perfecting the forms at each step along the way. Must be a cultural thing. I can't imagine our students putting up with it. I used to think it must be a teaching system designed to keep students in ski school forever (for pecuniary purposes) but I suppose it was really just a different philosophy of skill development.

post #37 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by oisin View Post

Yes we do agree. I think thats why I think discussion of teaching wedge christies, if that's what this is about. is a bit odd. On the other hand, the mechanics of it (thread title) are important for progress. I think its interesting that you might work on refining the wedge christie with an upper level student. There's no doubt that could improve their skiing, if you can get them to go back to it. I spent some time teaching with Europeans, especially the Austrians and Germans. They had quite a different approach (same mechanics though). They felt we move our students along too quickly. They were appalled to see our students skiing wedge christies and open parallel in their second day on skis. They seemed to think it was important to perfect the mechanics or lets say the skills and movements before moving up to the next level. hence their emphasis on perfecting the forms at each step along the way. Must be a cultural thing. I can't imagine our students putting up with it. I used to think it must be a teaching system designed to keep students in ski school forever (for pecuniary purposes) but I suppose it was really just a different philosophy of skill development.

Rio spent 4days I think learning to sidestep properly with Austian or German instructors in the 70's.

post #38 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

Rio spent 4days I think learning to sidestep properly with Austian or German instructors in the 70's.

Thats pretty funny but it sounds about right. I had a German level 2 once who refused to follow the rest of the class as they progressed because she said her "snowplow" wasn't perfect yet.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Ski Instruction & Coaching