Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!
|Originally posted by Wear the fox hat:
The concept that only they can be right, and all others must be wrong, and must be put down at every opportunity sounds close to the kind of elitism that they accuse the PSIA of.
Where in this thread have I expressed this attitude? And don't pull in a quote from the fruitbooting thread, that's an entirely different matter. I don't mind if snowlerbladers have their own schools and get married, I just don't want to see it. (Before you call the ADL or something, that's a joke, a bad joke, true, but still a joke. You'd think someone wearing a fox hat would have more of a sense of, how would you say it, humou
Bob Barnes is the only poster in this thread to have exhibited the elitism you speak of, by saying that I can't be much of a racer since I wasn't aware of the term "Reaching Short Turn." The evidence in so far proves him wrong.http://forum.powdermag.com/cgi-bin/u...c;f=1;t=021356
Now you'll probably read that thread and find some way to put the posters down. Fine. But Meathucker has raced at a very high level over the past few seasons. If the term "reaching short turn" is used frequently in the racing world, as Bob claims it is, a NOR-AM racer with points in the 70s training summers in South America would have heard it at least once or twice.
|Originally posted by sportscoach13:
2) some idiot trying to convince the world that Bob doesn't know his stuff. Maybe I should start a poll.
Is there something I've said in this thread that you find particularly idiotic? Maybe you could track it down and give it a specific rebuttal.
I don't doubt that Bob knows his stuff. What I object to is his philosophy of Jargon Uber Alles; that someone who has understanding of both the jargon and the technique is superior to someone who understands only the technique. That's textbook self-congratulatory elitism.
|Originally posted by Lostboy:
"Ugli Pupferknick" is not a swedish name nor is "Umlaut" a place in Sweden (it is, however, those ".." that appear over certain scandinavian and german language vowels).
Please do not disparage my nationality and and my ancestral home of Umlaut. It is true that the Pupferknick clan is not of Swedish stock but my fair-haired, sullen, socialist countrymen have embraced each of us, including my beloved bride and cousin Püpli, as one of their own.
|Originally posted by Pierre:
I have to figure that you are young and work in a field that does not use jargon, say "Wal Mart". Couldn't be Mickey D's, they use too much jargon.
Clean up in aisle 7! Would you like fries with that?
The field I work in actually uses jargon frequently and consistently. But unlike skiing, in my field the jargon and knowledge of the techniques it describes are very tightly integrated. If you know the technique, you know the jargon; it's universal. In skiing, this is clearly not the case.
|Originally posted by Roto:
It's no secret that really good instructors avoid using jargon while teaching, but they will still be well up on what it all is/means etc. as they will likely be keeping current.
|Originally posted by Pierre:
If asked to define a jargon word I will do so gladly.
Thanks to the posts in this thread by Roto and Pierre, I understand that in some applications jargon is necessary and useful, otherwise instructors talking to each other would be saying, "You know that type of turn I'm talking about? That turn, you know?" all too often. And Pierre, thanks for your offer, I might take you up on that someday.
I came to this forum to get to the bottom of a strange distateful feeling I and many others get when reading the long, rambling, back and forth threads on technique, coupled with the notion espoused by many people here that every skier, of all abilities, can learn soooo much by reading Epic.
I hunted around through a few threads here and there, and everything made sense, though the discussions often had an "angels dancing on a ski tip" quality to them.
Until Pierre mentioned the "Clean carved round reaching short turn." As you all know by now, the reaching part confused me, and I wondered if, A., there had been some new wondrous advance in technique that I wasn't aware of, or, B., some of the Barking Bears were advocating some really goofy skiing movements.
Now I know that it's neither -- it's just a matter of jargon.
Some people see jargon for what it is -- a useful tool in some circumstances, confusing in others -- and will patiently and unpatronizingly explain what it means. Others are strident in their defense of jargon as a universal truth, knowledge to be valued above and separate from the technique it describes, and it furthers their sense of superiority. It's these posters who give Epic a bad name. They send non-technobabbling expert skiers running away screaming, and they probably confuse the hell out of intermediate skiers, some of whom think they're drinking from the font of knowledge as they learn the jargon but none of the technique, and then run around telling people that every skier, of all abilities, can learn soooo much by reading Epic.
So that's my point in a not-so-tidy nutshell. Take it for what it's worth. And as you have already done so in a forum that prides itself in its maturity, you can call me an idiot who couldn't possibly have any "mates" (Sweden's not Utah, I only have one of those), a closed-minded elitist, or ignorant, or a Wal-Mart stockboy, a racist, not a real racer, not a real skier, or, worst of all, a lost pom. Go ahead, I can take it. [ August 29, 2003, 09:50 AM: Message edited by: Ugli Pupferknick ]