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Spring Snow Base Preparation
Last edited: 4/24/11
- Waxing Hot Touch Crayoning And SmearingLast edited: 4/23/11
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- Waxing Hot Touch Crayoning And Smearing
silicone spray on skis?
I've been looking for any actual honest-to-god research addressing this question, and for some reason, I have not found any, so I regard the question as still unsettled. But it's peculiar that there has not been any, since it seems like such an obvious question to ask.
And the research on how long they last was conducted by which magazine or organization?
Things I would be concerned with:
- Solvents causing break down of glues
- Lack of longevity/durability
- Offers no physical abrasion protection
- Base drying...after its gone, things might be dryer than before
Look into the pluses and minuses of silicone as used in automotive applications (vinyl, paint, and tire treatments).
I recall some old timers not liking to use silicone based preps, like Armorall, because they left a residue that clogged the pores in vinyl, thereby not allowing the material to breath and absorb any more fresh preparations, leading to premature breakdown of said vinyl. Instead they opted to use pure lemon oil.
Well, I would expect that you are going to find wax is best, but I have not tried silicon. Since your going to experiment, might as well make it interesting.
As a suggestion, you could wax one of your skis (as your control/benchmark/baseline) and then experiment with the other and see how they feel in various conditions when skied (documenting those conditions).
If you want to go crazy, you could try:
1. Silicon - as you suggested.
2. Armour All or similar - vinyl or rubber protectant, restorer
3. PAM - cooking spray
4. parafin wax
5. Turtlewax - car wax rub on stuff
6. Nu Finish - non-wax "space age polymer" stuff for cars, plastics, boats
Do one ski with silicon and the other with the proper wax. Wax at least every other ski day.
At the end of the year take a true bar to the bases and let us know what you find.
Wax has some substance and at least lasts many racers used silicon and floro drops between races and it was very expensive stuff.
Not bad to keep in the bag for when you forgot to wax and the skis started to drag. All of these quick cures work well for like ten minutes and they are gone.
QFT and +1
OP,what do you think skiers have been doing for the last 60 years? you're the first one with a brain, right? unbelievable! arrogant, foolish way of thinking. waste of time.
Easy, guys... the OP question is legitimate at least on the surface of it, however, wax does work better, but more important, it stays longer. Any spray will not stay attached to the ski base for any reasonable period of time, that's why spray-on waxes are worthless. Same thing with silicon spray. Also, a spray is a liquid so it will tend to forma very smooth coating on the base, which will lead to stiction; this is precisely why ski bases have structure. So, yeah, that thing called wax does work pretty well ;-)
Pilots have been known to spray silicone on the leading edges of thier wings to get a little better margin before encountering icing. But it does not prevent icing on the wings.
I sprayed silicone on the tops of my skis to shed the snow from the top and it worked reasonably well. My buddy did one top with wax and one with silicone spray - the waxed ski had less snow on the top.
My skis go too fast for me so why would I wax or silicone the bases? Maybe clister?
Last years thread though. Ah, what the heck.
Competition pilots wax and tape seams to get distance is sailplanes. I used to silicon/floro the top of my skis to keep junk off with what was left from slicking the bottoms.
What can I do? With every breath, I add to the CO2 in the atmosphere. I just can't help it......
I did plant a pair of peach trees in the yard last week!
Edited by Cgrandy - 4/17/11 at 6:40pm
Well kids, Everything we put on our skis eventually ends up in the water/food supply. Think about it; do you ultimately want to drink that crap? Do you ever wonder where all the chemicals that cause our cancers come from and how they get into the food chain?
Try some bacon grease, its environmentally friendly... and everything is better with bacon.
as has been said, the sprays will work... just not for very long. Wax works because it gets into the pores of the base. and as friction warms the base, a little more oozes out and replenshes that which was on the surface. bases are made of PE which is pretty resiliant material, the higher molecualr weight of the PE molecule the friction is reduced. UHMW PE is close to teflon in CoF, but is much tougher. Particles are also dispersed in some base material to also enhance the properties. Being in the plastics business, I have made some of my own mixtures of oils and teflon particles for my bicycle and added some fine teflon powder to my ski wax. It does work well. I dont claim to have made something better than the scientists at the wax compnanies, just it was real cheap to grab some left over teflon from work and mix it with my wax.
I use silicone to lubricate my ski bindings, to protect boot shells from sunlight & sometimes on ski base to clean & or for slide in warm conditions. ( just like wax must be put on with thin coat)
I have read that ski bases are porous & wax protects them, I have also read that bases are none porous & hot waxing will make your ski slide slower after the wax wears off based on what temp the wax was designed for. (big money invloved in waxing so who can be trusted)
I kinda think the bases is none porous now days. Try putting a drop of water on to ski base & see if it soaks in. ( I cant see it soak in ) With old piece of ski base could check better if water is soaked up
I have older skis that have been waxed & not based on a scientific test but just feel they seam slower to me then skis I have never waxed & only used silicone on the bases.
I often ski in spring conditions ice in the morning which scrapes wax off then corn & or mashed potatoes in afternoon & will never spend money & time to breath in fumes from waxing. Skis are made to slide & if your not a good scientist or a racer is the waxing going to be worth the money & time spent ?
I really highly doubt that ski bases are porous. But I do not doubt that the surface on a macro and microscopic level has enough surface irregularities to capture and hold wax....similar to car paint. You wouldnt call car paint porous (unless its flat or matte), yet when you wax it, the paint soaks up the wax, that is, the wax fills in irregularities making it slick and protecting it from the environment, also prevents dirt from getting in those irregularities and the wax also reducing the surface area exposing less of it to harm.
One of these days I will ask to use the scanning electron microscope at my grad school, and see for myself.
Sintered implies pressed together , gaps between material...porous is a relationship.....
Sintered bronze (yes metal) holds oil and releases it under combination of heat and pressure. Ski bases work the same way.
There are lesser base materials (extruded), but sintered bases are the at the top.
I see no reason why silly-cone spray would not act much the same as wax in coming to the surface after "soaking in", If the previous wax would let it in ;-)
Unfortunately, silicon's lubricity is about equal to that of water...
Nothing to see here, move along...
There are very few "plastics" that absorb water...most won't even allow water to wet the surface...bead up and run off.
Different liquids are needed to discover porosity. Where is the gore-tex when you need it?
All ski bases are not created alike.
Those light weight Volkl SL's .. nice on soft snow but sucked on ice, terrified of the stuff they got nervous and pissed themselves. Anyhow, after a season the bases of the ski beneath the boot were so worn down. They saw periodic wax (for weekends), and coats of floro in between (Swix pads), so they were always slick. After a single season I sent them off to South America with a visiting instructor who fell in love. He couldn't ski for schizz but was in love .. how romantic. They were cupped under each boot.
Those bases were probably even open enough (low density matierial), and would sponge up stuff like floro or Pam.
Stockli graphite race bases are like iron. They got a bit more wax time (my son started doing it), but after years they never, never needed a grind. I just gave away the 155 SL's from 2002 and they were good with about 6 hard seasons on them. You would probably have to work even "hot boxing" to get them to open up.
- silicone spray on skis?
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