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Transitions? - Page 2

post #31 of 40
Another thread that has good points on the topic of transitions:

RACING A TRAIN THROUGH THE TRANSITION FROM ONE TURN TO THE NEXT
post #32 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl R View Post

I guess we are. But what's in a transition? :)
Kinetic energy management? Relaxation? Edge change? Posture changes? 


Yes, but I'd say that the skis are loaded with less than HH's weight during the transition.
This means that even thou a skiers skis are completely unloaded, the skier is weightless, the skier has moved upwards, it's still not up unweighting?
I can buy in on it but it's contradictory in many ways.

A retraction turn is going to work the legs more than a cross over. These could have been done more effciently, but I chose to look at the results as being more important because I assumed this was a drill.

Yes, the third clip will involve "float" through the transition. In that sense you could say it's upunweighting, But the more traditional use of the term is to describe a vertical movement (aka a pop) instead of a pendulum movement.
post #33 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by therusty View Post

A retraction turn is going to work the legs more than a cross over. These could have been done more effciently, but I chose to look at the results as being more important because I assumed this was a drill.
 

Retraction turns don't have to be more energetic. The quads aren't required to support the weight of the torso in transition. The legs can simply relax during transition, permitting them to flex while the torso travels across to the new inside of the turn, the only effort involved is when you extend your legs to pressure and stand on your skis after transition, which is done in all dynamic turns.

Releasing via an up-unweighting action, as in a cross-over transition, requires a force at some point prior to release to cause the CoM to move up. This can be the virtual bump or it can be an active pressing the feet, similar to how you jump while standing. The latter requires effort in addition to the effort of supporting the skeleton, the former lets the turn do the work and permits the legs to relax sooner and extend a bit to cross-over.
post #34 of 40
IMO retracting and extending your legs every turn even though there is not much pressure under skis is still a physical muscle movement. Not something that needs to be a show stopper or anything but it requires more effort not doing those movements. On the other hand, you cannot reach the same performance by not woring with your legs in obove mentioned manner. Its like arguing that walking is not as tiresome as running. Just deal with it.
post #35 of 40
Thread Starter 
Tdk6, do you have a video of a perfect retraction turn that is not cross over? I think the transition might be easier on the legs if it's faster than the aforementioned drill. I however need to see it rather than imagining it to really understand.
post #36 of 40
To paraphrase another thread: dynamic skiing is athletic. There is no avoiding getting a workout from a run or a day of dynamic skiing.

On the other hand good technique applied poorly or poor technique simply applied (constantly sitting back to ski powder, for instance) can be tiring and exhausting very quickly.

tdk6, I think I understand your meaning. Don't choose a style of transition or turn for its potential energy consumption but for its effectiveness and appropriateness to the situation. In the long run the right moves will allow you the most efficient use of your energy and the most enjoyment through out your ski days.
post #37 of 40
Thread Starter 
Btw tdk6, care to take a look at this snowboarding clip? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1SYVj4OVX0
post #38 of 40
I agree that retraction turns don't have to be more energetic. But if the torso travels across to the new inside of the turn, I would call that a cross over element of the turn. Regardless, it can be less energetic. It is my observation that most of the time it is not.

A virtual bump can not impart a force.
post #39 of 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by therusty View Post

....

A virtual bump can not impart a force.

True. I got carried away. My responses start with a flow of ideas and then I try to remove anything that I can't substantiate. Missed that.
post #40 of 40
Thread Starter 
I was skiing some gates we put up to the kids yesterday. I couldn't resist. :D
It was huge fun, and I loved that the B5i's took the course with clean arc to arc turns. I first went with the Bandit B1 (directly from the bumps) but I had take very much height and point them a lot towards the next gate before entering the carve in order to make it.

However, skiing it with the B5i gave me some insights regarding transitions. Without thinking much about technique I quickly lowered the COM during transitions. I think that cross through came very naturally in the gates.
Also I changed the way I use my legs in the transition. Since I wanted to exit the turn as close to the fall line as possible I never got the same kick out of the turn that I enjoy so much freecarving. I rather lifted the feet out of the turn (well not lifted but you hopefully know what I mean...) with a kind of pulling motion. Then in contrast to freecarving I didn't wait for the legs angles to build before setting the edge, but rather soon with halfway straight legs I set the edge and increased the force keeping straightening out the legs until the fall line. I was just focusing on getting the skis to turn as soon and as close as possible to the projected path.
I fould it also amusing to notice my own arms being out out out, forward past the gate and then out out out again. Nada pole plant.

This is obvious stuff to most of you, but it opened my eyes having this thread (and the other transition threads here) in mind.
I think that for me, the cross through transition while being effective having to ski a certain path, is not something I'll strive much for using while freecarving. I've realized that when I need to I change pretty quickly, and that works for me. Even thou it means I won't be as good at it as you. :)
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