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Is this normal? Boot marring

post #1 of 7
Thread Starter 
I took my new boots to a epicski recomended bootfitter a couple days ago (not naming names since I don't want to deal with getting flamed).  I had a hotspot on one foot but otherwise seemed to fit the qualifications that I've seen on website after website and wiki, faq, etc... here at epicski.  I thought I had gone into the whole deal a well educated consumer and evidently was the opposite.

He measured my foot and I knew it measured 1 size smaller than the boots I had bought.  Admitedly I bought the boot somewhere else.  The bootfitter is not local.  I drove 300+ miles to him because of his recomendations here.  I bought the boots localy to #1 support my local ski shops and #2 try on boot after boot till I could meet the aforementioned qualifications.

Basicly, once my foot measured one size too small for the boot and they weren't from his shop, he was done dealing with me.  He did fix the hot spot on the lower foot.  However it looks like someone heated it up and then beat on it with a ball peen hammer several time.  Is that normal?
The price was very low, but that kinda makes me think again it was just to get rid of me and hoping I don't bring them back after seeing what the side of the boot looked like.   I have something else that needs to be addressed that showed up after skiing them the next day, but I didn't dare go back into his shop.

I know that I probably got a boot that was a little too big.  I'm a recreational skiier that spends most of my time on greens following a 5 year old.
I was really pumped about going to a good boot fitter.  I had saved up money for it and scheduled this vacation specificly around this bootfitter.  I was just very very disapointed in basicly getting a wave off after investing a lot of time, money and effort into this guy.

I guess I'm just wondering if this experience is normal and if taking care of a hotspot on the lower foot normally causes the shell to be beat up.

Thanks agian guys.


edit: just to make sure things are clear.  I'm not try to rail on anyone at all (thus the no name or shop).  I'm purely asking for clarification.  I may very well be completly in the wrong.  I'm not angry.  Just dissapointed and confussed.
post #2 of 7
mm, not sure where to start on this one

the boot being a size too big is one thing that winds boot fitters up more than anything normally because it really shouldn't happen but it happens at boot sellers on a daily basis, you say you were supporting your local store, but what support did the local store offer to punch the shell??.....just a little background story>>> i had a customer recently who had boots from us, wore them once for an hour and decided that they were too tight, he returned not wanting me to stretch the boot as he only did a week a season wanting a bigger boot as he had been told by a local shop that what he had was too small for him, after much trying of various things he had the size up from where i had him, IMO a size big but he said he had a good firm hold around his foot and didn't want anything tighter... i asked him to sign his fit record to say that he had gone against our recomendation and we would not take the boot back if it was used, he did so and left happy... is it right..not IMO but he is happy.....



now on the shell looking beat up, it can depend on the plastic of the shell, stretching a shell can and often will change the cosmetic appearence of a boot, some plastics (especially on the cheaper boots) scarr more easily than others, i normally warm people that there may be some scarring but in most cases comfort is far more important than looks and many times if a fitter is busy they forget to say simple things like this
post #3 of 7
As CEM said boots that are too large stop us in our tracks.  It is very difficult and sometimes impossible to fit boots that are too large.  Punches are difficult because your foot doesn't stay in one place, rather it is free to roam the boot at will.  So if I make a 5th met punch here, in the middle of the run your foot will be somewhere else.

Also oversize boots cause overtightening.  I can't count the number of people that have come into the store, said their boots are too small and they are killing them.  We see they are two sizes too large.  Ask them to put them on and buckle as they would when skiing.  They clamp so tight it is a wonder their foot isn't permanently deformed.  The boots aren't killing them their buckling technique is.

Put that same person in a smaller boot which requires almost know buckling over the instep and their foot is held in place better and there is no pressure.  Now we work on other shops boots all the time, but if they are too large we definitely emphasize the need to tone it down.

Lou
post #4 of 7
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CEM View Post

mm, not sure where to start on this one

the boot being a size too big is one thing that winds boot fitters up more than anything normally because it really shouldn't happen but it happens at boot sellers on a daily basis, you say you were supporting your local store, but what support did the local store offer to punch the shell??.....just a little background story>>> i had a customer recently who had boots from us, wore them once for an hour and decided that they were too tight, he returned not wanting me to stretch the boot as he only did a week a season wanting a bigger boot as he had been told by a local shop that what he had was too small for him, after much trying of various things he had the size up from where i had him, IMO a size big but he said he had a good firm hold around his foot and didn't want anything tighter... i asked him to sign his fit record to say that he had gone against our recomendation and we would not take the boot back if it was used, he did so and left happy... is it right..not IMO but he is happy.....



now on the shell looking beat up, it can depend on the plastic of the shell, stretching a shell can and often will change the cosmetic appearence of a boot, some plastics (especially on the cheaper boots) scarr more easily than others, i normally warm people that there may be some scarring but in most cases comfort is far more important than looks and many times if a fitter is busy they forget to say simple things like this


 


Most certainly NOT to arugue, but just to fill in information gaps. 
  • The shop did offer to fit them.  But trying to support epicski people and after reviews and reputation, I opted to make the trek.
  • They're not really expensive boots, but didn't think they would be considered "cheap" boots either.  they were last years model Nordica Beast 10's.
  • He wasn't busy at all.  When I walked in he was just sitting down waiting for someone to come in.  He might easily have just forgotten to warn me though.  We're all human.

Thanks for the clarification guys.  Hopefully the guy back home that I bought them from, can take care of my current problem.  (inner anklebones on shell) enough to make them skiable till I can start boot shopping again.  Too bad it'll be a while.  Single parents don't get luxury items like that very often.
post #5 of 7
Sorry to here about this experience and the surprise you experienced with the boot deformation.  Without seeing the boot shell it is difficult to comment on his work.  I use the phrase "it's not a jewel it's a tool" many times with customers.  Most people do not care what the shell looks like as long as they are comfortable but some do and it is the fitters job to communicate clearly the consequences as well as benefits of stretching shells.  The bottom line is, did the stretching solve the problem?  

Hopefully your boots will get fitted properly and serve you well!
post #6 of 7
lou, and CEM covered the high points.

i would just like to put out there a thought about your local boot fitter and the interaction you had to shed light on the start of your fit problem.

one critical aspect of buying/selling a new boot is the communication skills of the fitter, and their ability to use the best words and concepts to help a customer to understand how the ski boot will feel in the store as well as how the fit will begin to change during the break-in process.

the individual assessment skills of a boot seller/fitter are also a critical part of the equation. on epic we all discuss boots like a 98mm is 98mm and a 100 flex is a 100 flex. read into that statement, we give you impression that via the internet we can somehow get to the fat part of the target with our advice. reading many of the posts on epic it is transparent as to why so many skiers end up in the wrong model, size, and flex of boot. the assessment of you, your foot, your skiing style, your personality, your attitude, your skiing goals are all important pieces of solving the puzzle. knowing every boot in the store in terms of how they differ and how they are the same is also important.  most boot fitters do not possess these skills, no matter how or where they are trained. the best boot fitters out there are the ones that have the technical and tactical skills to approach the work, and they have to have skills like a psychiatrist, shaman, and a fortune teller. along with that they need to be in a store that has the right boot for you. on top of that they must be great communicators as well as great listeners.

find that person and you will have a very different experience the next time around. you will also save time and money and stress.

sorry your experience at either store was average. your story is typical, and it is one of the reasons that the ski industry continues to be flat or declining. you were improperly fit at your local store. there is no fix for that.

once bitten twice shy or something like that.

jim
post #7 of 7
when i said cheaper boots i meant in terms of a range, the softer plastics can scarr much easier than the more expensive harder ones the boots you have are about mid range but i have seen the nordicas mark a little easier than some atomics or langes for example..100% down to the pastic on the particular model rathe rthen the brand

do you have a footbed in your boots, stabilising the foot is the first step to stopping this ankle pain, the other problem may be due to the size of the boot, if the foot is migrating in the shell then it is difficult to stop some amount of contact in the ankle region

good luck
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