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Speed Control

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
A great skier flows down the slope over powder, groomed, moguls, and snowboarders. Sometimes skarving, sometimes only tapping "the brakes" with a check. His/her movements seem so efficient and accurate with just the right amout of effort.

'Learners' tend to tense up and put so much effort into braking with much less effect. The outside leg is often straight, they tip over in powder trying to brake on one leg, they need a seat belt restraint in the bumps.

Can you good people explain the correct and most efficient ways to control speed ....

1. When carving - on a steep slope leaving two clear tracks behind I eventually pick up too much speed and have to traverse out. Should I skarve at some point (heaven forbid), should I put a check in somewhere, should I just keep on carving up the slope (hitting a sp*** turner head on), should I buy a parachute, or should I only constantly carve on moderate slopes?

2. In the bumps - Should I take the speed out on the side of the bump. If I go over a bump should I retract my legs to offer very little resistence and try to take out some speed on the backside of the bump? Where's the best place to take the speed out (whilst remaining upright)?

3. In the powder - I should be using both ski's close together as one platform, braking with both feet, right? Too much braking and I'm sunk, too little and I'm on my tails (and shortly afterwards my head). Should I just take up golf? Help!

In short whats the secret to efficient, accurate braking and speed control?

Thanks in advance

Dangerous 'Desparate' Brian

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ December 23, 2001 01:45 AM: Message edited 1 time, by DangerousBrian ]</font>
post #2 of 10
DB,
1. ALL of your options are good. Except for the parachute. That's just silly.
2. Unless you a really good in bumps, just allow the skis to skid the whole time. The key word is "allow". Don't force them.
3. NO BRAKING IN POWDER!! You must use the shape of the turn if you want speed control.
You can turn the skis in the transition if you want a shorter turn, but it's alot of work to unwieght enough to do much of that.
Take a powder lesson.
edit: I just saw the part about the snowdoarders!


<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ December 23, 2001 09:20 AM: Message edited 2 times, by milesb ]</font>
post #3 of 10
I find stopping on snowbaorders quite easy. It's also good to practice on piste, before you go into powder.

To practice on piste, find a wide open run which goes from a flatter to steeper section. Stick to the middle of the slope, and go straight over the lip onto the steeper section. You'll find a bunch of snowboarders skulking under the lip, out of site. If you go into them at an angle, you should be able to stop by the fourth one. My record is the second, but the first one was pretty big, and took most of my speed.



S

P.S. I hope the boarders reading this have a sense of humour.
post #4 of 10
Excellent question, and one I can't answer- only add to. Yesterday I was skiing at Alyeska for the first time this year. Conditions were fairly choppy with windblown/crusty powder hacked to death with intermittent death cookies.

I was trying to complete my turns to control speed, but the bumpy nature of the runs started me bouncing more and more and threw me into the backseat. Granted, my powder skis weren't the right tool for the conditions, but someone I was skiing with (an instructor) seemed to be bulletproof and was making nice, round, controlled turns and always seemed to be centered on his skis. He was on powder skis as well, but it didn't seem to matter. What's the trick?
-Mike
post #5 of 10
>>>. What's the trick?<<<

Skill [img]smile.gif[/img] ...Ott
post #6 of 10
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DangerousBrian:



1. When carving - on a steep slope leaving two clear tracks behind I eventually pick up too much speed and have to traverse out. Should I skarve at some point (heaven forbid), should I put a check in somewhere, should I just keep on carving up the slope (hitting a sp*** turner head on), should I buy a parachute, or should I only constantly carve on moderate slopes?

In short whats the secret to efficient, accurate braking and speed control?

Thanks in advance

Dangerous 'Desparate' Brian
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, DB it is certainly possible to have great speed control AND leave two cleanly carved tracks. It depends on turn shape. To do it, some departure from the traditionally understood technique of committing only to the outside ski will need to occur. This doesn't mean to weight your inside ski more, more weight on the outside ski occurs naturally anyway.

To make it as simple as possible, try the following...

Focus on flexing your inside ankle (instead of your outside ankle) to shape your turns. The deeper the shape, the deeper the flex of your inside ankle. Apply this focus from the start, through the finish through each turn. (your outside ankle will automatically flex in this situation, moving your whole body with the skis (& more importantly, feet)).

Whether in bumps, pow or carving, the secret is turns shape. Checking, scarving etc. are all great tools to have, but they equate to fairly quick changes in velocity which tend to upset balance and require major muscle group involvement to some degree. Turn shape is more flowing and allows a skier to remain supple and relaxed.
post #7 of 10
The turn end hook should always be relative to the pitch and the desired whole run speed.

Scarv is fine, Carve is fine, relaxing into the turn end uphill hook is the key.

Get the skis out from the under the body onto the edge and relax as the CM passes over. Add leg dynamics to suit the situation.

Oz
post #8 of 10
Thread Starter 
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> By Alaska Mike
Excellent question, and one I can't answer- only add to. Yesterday I was skiing at Alyeska for the first time this year. Conditions were fairly choppy with windblown/crusty powder hacked to death with intermittent death cookies.
I was trying to complete my turns to control speed, but the bumpy nature of the runs started me bouncing more and more and threw me into the backseat. Granted, my powder skis weren't the right tool for the conditions, but someone I was skiing with (an instructor) seemed to be bulletproof and was making nice, round, controlled turns and always seemed to be centered on his skis. He was on powder skis as well, but it didn't seem to matter. What's the trick?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Mike,

Someone gave me a tip (which I haven't tried yet) to tighten the ankles a bit by pulling the front of the feet upwards when skiing over unpredictable terrain. This should stop the ski's wandering and help prevent against you ending up in the back seat.


<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>By Miles,
NO BRAKING IN POWDER!! You must use the shape of the turn if you want speed control.
You can turn the skis in the transition if you want a shorter turn, but it's alot of work to unwieght enough to do much of that.
Take a powder lesson.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Miles,
I suspose there's a fine line between braking and speed control. Your're right, I should of said speed control not braking.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>By Roto
Focus on flexing your inside ankle (instead of your outside ankle) to shape your turns. The deeper the shape, the deeper the flex of your inside ankle. Apply this focus from the start, through the finish through each turn. (your outside ankle will automatically flex in this situation, moving your whole body with the skis (& more importantly, feet)).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you talking inside leg steering or just up-down flexing of the feet? I do weight both feet but try to control turn shape with both feet. If the speed is being taken out more gradually I can see how this is more efficent as it takes less energy from the skier over a longer period of time.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>By Man from Oz
The turn end hook should always be relative to the pitch and the desired whole run speed.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oz,

I been thinking (it had to happen again sometime ) that the most efficient way to take the speed out of the turn is to use the mountain (and not my legs). Are you saying that timeing the end hook uphill phase of the turn just right should achieve this?


Thanks for the replies - much appreciated, please keep em coming. I'm off skiing in a couple of hours so will catch up with this thread in 2002.

DB

Fröhliche Feiertage und einen guten Rutsch ins neue Jahr
post #9 of 10
DB,
Using the mountain is the most efficient way of stopping. Not even an end hook of the turn but just keep turning until you are at the speed you want to be at and then release your edge and start your new turn. You can do this with very even round turns.

Think of it this way, every turn you make should begin and end at the same speed (whatever speed you are comfortable with) when you begin your turn, take note of your speed. As you enter the fall line you will pick up speed. keep steering and turning until you are at the same speed as when you started your turn and then begin your next turn. If you want to go faster, begin your turn a little earlier, slower begin later..

Practice this on a nice easy wide groomed slope and then slowly move the practice to steeper and steeper stuff.
post #10 of 10
Hi DB...not to get confused, this is *steve* in another account_LiFe(?..guess I didn't log in since wayyyyy back when...)

ANYWAYS, great advice as usual from everyone...I've been going thru the *get rid of* thing too...little things that were adding up to a loading up of my ski's tail plus a second or two here & there of holding the big bowling ball uphill while my skis, feet, and legs were on their way downhill..all contribute. Balance...being aware of our center of mass's Momentum, together with directional control of the hips & shoulders with/opposed to our skis...and our hands working our shoulders balance-wise....all add up...one way or the OTHER!
I've been on a local *hill*..without instructors, so the next larger mountain trip will attach a lesson...to get some feedback.

$.02
[img]smile.gif[/img]
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