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Have at my Slow Turns, y'all

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
Preface: I had no intention of posting this for critique when I was skiing. Just me and Miles, end of the day, heading home. Then I thought, "why not?" My ego is immune to whatever onslaught comes, so be thorough. I ask only that you aim for being constructive.

Skis are, by the way, 191's and wide and stiff. Not an excuse just a little context.

So far I've heard "dragging the poles," "not tipping," "hands falling back," and a few others. I am openly soliciting dissection. Thanks.

Slow Turns

be thankful i didn't post my "bumps" video.

[ January 15, 2004, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: ryan ]
post #2 of 18
Hmmm...

I noticed that your turn on the steeper section (a turn or so before the end) was very dynamic, nice athletic stance, good angles, etc. Earlier, the turns looked to me like end-of-day, easy-does-it turns to the bottom. I'm glad you missed those two other skiers!
post #3 of 18
First, get a camcorder with steady shot. A little too much bouncing to really see clearly.

It doesn't look like you are dropping your arms after your pole touch, maybe your hands are a little low but you bring your pole forward with wrist movements. If you are comfortable with this arm position , I think it's fine for this terrain.

I would open up the stance a little, I learned at last year's ESA that a little wider really does enable you to begin your turn by tipping your inside (downhill) ski to it's outside edge and tipping the new outside ski to it's inside edge.

It does look like your turns are a little lazy, reminds me of me. The terrain isn't too challenging and speed isn't a concern so you make a direction change but you never really complete your turn. This is fine for noddleing around but if your not careful you'll develope a habit that's hard to break.

Your skiing looks pretty good and to paraphrase you from another post, it's the little things that will take you to the next level.
post #4 of 18
I like your lazy turns, Ryan. They're round, you're turning both feet and I really don't see a hand problem. The terrain doesn't look like it would require being more dynamic. That would be just wasted energy.

How come someone your size is on such a long, stiff ski? Was this for powder or something? Doesn't look like there was that much powder that day.

I don't see any signs that you're struggling to turn those skis, so I imagine something shorter, softer and shapier would be easy for you.
post #5 of 18
sen~or,

you edge your skis too late into the turn, causing some heel thrust to get you 'round... you can see the puffs of displaced snow at each heel thrust.

slow down, widen your stance, and make only LATERAL movements, not a twist/steer. I suggest railroad turns or gorilla turns to learn the laterality. for the "early edge" I suggest the wedgie smear, as I call it. yoda has his own name for it. I'll show you at the Academy, as long as the ESA Faculty don't kill me for it!
post #6 of 18
Thread Starter 
Kneale,

just decided to take those skis for a ride. real nice through crud, etc., and a hoot on screamer-cruisers when i wanna go fastlike and make big turns. (28-degree turn radius.)
generally i'm on 177 mid-fats.

gonz, i won't be at le academie, you can Do the Yoda for me in wyomingland.

[ January 16, 2004, 06:13 AM: Message edited by: ryan ]
post #7 of 18
ach, mensch...

The wedgie smear is a series of linked traverses to turns. You do them on mild to moderate blue runs with no bumps or only small ones (under 6" amplitude, i.e.).

The downhill ski is edged normally. the uphill ski rides with only about 10-20% of your weight, in an exaggerated wedge but smearing the snow rather than edged and skidding... like spreading peanut butter with a sandwich spreader.

As you near the side of the run, start to switch your pressure to the uphill ski while letting the downhill ski flatten and do its own little "reverse smear". The uphill ski should begin engaging almost instantly, and you can increase the pressure/edge angle to control the radius. Ride the turn around until it faces slightly uphill, then resume the traverse position.

Repeat at opposite side of run.

continue through for at least 15-20 turns to get the feel.

early edge, here you come!
post #8 of 18
This is the first time I see you ski ryan (I missed skiing with you and milesb last year at the Snowbird gathering). You are a better skier than I thought, which reflects the fact that you are rather modest.

I tend to agree with gonzo that you have a very slow engagement of the outside edge (although it ain't so bad for the terrain), but you definitely do not initiate the turn with a strong inside foot movement (not much tipping of the inside foot going on). In fact you tend to drag the new inside foot in a slight wedge as the turn initiates (your very first turn shows this fact very clearly). This is the result of a slight up stem that you are doing after you complete your turn. That upstem leaves you with no choice but to drag the new inside foot back.

Otherwise your turns are nice and round, even if they are skidded.

I would work on 2 things:

1) When you complete your turn, use your new inside foot to initiate the new turn with strong tipping action (tip the knee as well if you have to). This should eliminate the tendency to upstem in order to transfer your weight to the outside foot. This will also give you a much earlier edge engagement.

2) Don't get into the habit of angulating with the head only.

I would love to see your bump video!
post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
i'll see what i can do about the bumps video. and will drop it in this thread rather than starting a new one.
(you'll see why when you see.)

i need to change vid formats first.

thanks all for the feedback.

[ January 16, 2004, 09:20 AM: Message edited by: ryan ]
post #10 of 18
Hey Ryan,

I'll concur with Gonzo and Tom. Overall, I think they are pretty decent turns (Good Work!) I also saw a late edge set and a little bit of a "push" at the end of the turn. Turthfully, they looked a little bit like you were skiing for the camera...(But I done that before too in that situation (relax, it's just a camera)) [img]smile.gif[/img] If that's the worst thing I can say about your turns, that's pretty good [img]smile.gif[/img] I think Tom and Gonzo have given you good stuff to work with. I'm just gonna blend what both are saying. Basically the same stuff with different verbage.

The movement of "releasing" the downhill edges (esp the new inside ski) and flattening them (or tipping them as Tom describes it) to the snow starts the edges moving toward the inside of the new turn. As you flatten the ski (as Tom mentions) continue that movement progressively towards the inside of the new turn to smoothly engage the edges. The smoother and earlier you can "get the edges on" the better. This with a little steering from the feet should help you shape your turns really nicely.

Lonnie

Oh, 1 more thing. Next time you take the camera out get some shots from the side. A stationary camera with a skiing towards, a side view, and going away shot works really nice....

One other thing. I have really enjoyed this tread (so far.) For me, movement analysis is one of the areas where I feel really need to step up my game. I'm OK, but I want to have the super keen eye that some of my peers have. Anyone else got any video for us to look at? Post it baby. If you need web storage space shoot me a PM. I've got plenty with my broadband account...

[ January 16, 2004, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: Lonnie ]
post #11 of 18
Thread Starter 
well, i'm about to FINALLY nab myself a digital camera with video capability. you can be sure there'll be plenty of stuff to dissect, for those of you who enjoy that.

in fact, anyone going to the gathering who wants some vid of their turns, i'd be happy to shoot it.

[ January 16, 2004, 10:31 AM: Message edited by: ryan ]
post #12 of 18
Quote:
Originally posted by Springhill Crazie:
First, get a camcorder with steady shot. A little too much bouncing to really see clearly.

[quote]Originally posted by Lonnie:
Oh, 1 more thing. Next time you take the camera out get some shots from the side. A stationary camera with a skiing towards, a side view, and going away shot works really nice....
[quote]

Hey, c'mon cut me some slack! This was intended to be a little photography fun with my little Canon ELPH.
post #13 of 18
Turns look good to me but, then again, I'm not an instructor. I have shot a lot of video while skiing though. Not that you asked but here's a tip. Practice pointing the camera without looking through the viewfinder. Just keep the telephoto lens on wide and point in the general direction of your subject. It will take some practice to keep the subject in the frame, but the video will be much smoother for a couple of reasons. One, you can better see where you're skiing. Two, holding the camera lower and in front of you allows you to use your body and arms as steadying shock absorbers.
post #14 of 18
Thread Starter 
crank, thanks. i'll keep these tips in mind when i shoot some stuff in jackson hole.

[ January 16, 2004, 02:04 PM: Message edited by: ryan ]
post #15 of 18
Hey Miles,

No worries ! I was just giving a little feedback so we can get a better look next time. It was just a little tough to see everything from behind. No big deal....

Lonnie
post #16 of 18
milesb, how goes the stike? I read where secret talks broke down. How are you coping, I mean besides skiing? At least the strike gives you time to ski.

As for my camera work criticism, [img]tongue.gif[/img] .
post #17 of 18
[quote]Originally posted by milesb:
Quote:
Originally posted by Springhill Crazie:
First, get a camcorder with steady shot. A little too much bouncing to really see clearly.

[quote]Originally posted by Lonnie:
Oh, 1 more thing. Next time you take the camera out get some shots from the side. A stationary camera with a skiing towards, a side view, and going away shot works really nice....
Quote:

Hey, c'mon cut me some slack! This was intended to be a little photography fun with my little Canon ELPH.
Yea guys, cut Miles some slack!! If the roles were reversed, I'm sure he'd do the same for you. NOT!!!

[ January 16, 2004, 05:49 PM: Message edited by: Coach13 ]
post #18 of 18
Trouble here...?..Milesb, your camera-work is without peer!! : ...
Just watch out for your banking , especially when on slightly oversized boards...during the late-afternoon conditions(as underneath layers harden up..)..on any degree of pitch. It's when accidents happen, usually caused by the "other" skier/boarder.
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