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my comments on Expert 2 - Page 3

post #61 of 78

Glad you're back. From your post the only concrete thing I can take is you're using a narrower stance. Is it this narrow:

-love that photo!

Anyway HOW has this new stance helped in crud etc.?
Also you mention that pmts moves have helped a lot. What pmts moves have helped, and how have they helped?

Then, from back a ways in the thread.
wacko keeps repeating a phrase that must be all over the pmts material.:

"the skis really do turn themselves"- wacko

Let's say you get the side cut of your skis down to 14m with flexing. That's still a pretty large turn. You just tip, weight and move and the skis "just turn themselves" into short radius turns?

What do you do if you want to change the radius of the turn in the middle of it?

Response was good. (it's Mescalero, not mescaline. Doorway to the past? )

You said:

"What I am vehemently opposed to is perpetuating sterotypical myths that only serve to make terminal intermediates, the very thing he preaches to help"

could you elaborate on the myths?

cheers<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by Tog (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #62 of 78
Would that be more of a linear system with set excercises etc.?

look at my post above for questions, and don't skip that link, you'll love it!
post #63 of 78
Thread Starter 
wow. who would have thought a simple "review" would create so much chatter.
100 posts in less than 48 hours..
I can't wait to see what kind of review and insight we get from Gravity.
post #64 of 78
better hurry up before AC kills this 3 page topic!


You wrote, in reply to my post, "But what if the student moves? How will they continue their training? With this system (no religion here, and no salesmanship either), if I move to Alaska, all I have to do is find a PMTS certified instructor. The terminology will be the same, etc. The new instructor in Alaska will find out where I was in the system and we'll pick up exactly where I left off.

Here's an analogy. What made franchises like Dominos and McDonalds so successful? It's because I'm guaranteed to get the exact same pizza or burger no matter where I am.

The terminology PSIA uses IS consistant throughout the country. Your first paragraph doesn't distinguish one system from another. BTW, if you move to Alask, you're really screwed, because I don't think there are any PMTS schools there.

Your second paragraph did nothing but shoot holes in your feet. Hey... if Harb want's to be the MickeyD's of skiing, that's fine with me. But skiing, especially at the upper levels, is about as close to one-size-fits-all, as a McD's burger is to a Ruth's Chris Fillet Mignon. Is there a burger out there worse than McD's? And this is your example? McD's is successful because it's cheap and fast. Not because of quality.

I thought you were looking for quality, by stating HH's system is "best". If "best" in your books means force one-size-to-fit-all, then we need to stop the arguing. What's best for everyone, is a variety, so that you have the choice to find what suits your needs. Saying one system is best because it is limited is not worth arguing about. And that's what you've gone and done.

Ahhh, forget it! How can I argue with logic like that?
post #65 of 78
You could not be more wrong...
Having consumed McPukes in many different countries I have come to the personal conclusion that not all Big Macs taste the same. The US ranks at the bottom of the scale, what do you people put in your burger????
If HH named his son Harrison, i believe i read that somewhere in this drival, that is all the information I require to discount his thoughts on pretty much anything.
post #66 of 78

JoC, one would get the impression, perusing an inventory of your posts, that you're not a big fan of the U.S.
Glad you've found a suitable outlet.
(get a life.)<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by Mescalero (edited May 17, 2001).]</FONT>
post #67 of 78
Thread Starter 
Yes his son's name is Harrison, Harry's son... It's in his second book along with a picture.

Also I agree on the McDonalds not being the same. Go to China and the McDonalds shakes are made with Soy milk. There's a shocker if you are not ready for it! Anyone remember in "the Santa Claus" when Tim Allen picks up the milk the little girl leaves out for him and drinks it. "its Soy milk, last year you said you were lactose intolerant"
post #68 of 78
Johnh, you bring up some points that I find a little spooky. There's a trend in fitness to develop programs such as Power Flex and Bodypump that would involve uniformity. No matter where and with whom the participant takes a class, it will be identical. The industry's rational; instructors should be interchangeable, AND instructors are not creative enough to develop their own programs. As someone who develops something new every week, I find this offensive.
They are breaking some major rules of program design and kinesiological principles, but since it has been marketed as a "system", nobody, including people who should know better, are questioning it.
What the heck is going on?

Be Braver in your body, or your luck will leave you. DH Lawrence
post #69 of 78

I think it's part of this mindless, instant gratification, money gubbing society.

Mindless because the instructor doesn't need to think. Hell, you don't even really need an
instructor. A video tape at the front of the room will do (see any similarities to PMTS here?).

Instant gratification, because the public will be lead to believe (as Whacko does), that anyone can learn from this method, and there is no need to go searching for a method that works for you and finding an instructor you can learn from.

Money grubbing because it's obviously cheaper for the developer, since they can hire instructors with less (or no) experience, and pay them less (or make a video, and spend way less). It's also cheaper for the student, since everyone in the US seems to buy based on cost almost exclusively (some will buy the MOST expensive, but only for "show" items such as houses and cars, to be conspicuous consumers).

It does a disservice to those of us who care about what we do, and those students who have a true desire to learn. However, it provides a service to the McDonalds culture by providing a cheap, low quality product, that claims instant results with no effort on your part.

Hey, how about these commercials on the radio for some new GNC pill that burns fat! Hey, sit on the couch, watch that tv and eat more Ben and Jerrys Chubby Hubby (my favorite!). You can just take a pill and burn fat! Get frickin' real!

**Due to the power shortage, the light at the end of the tunnel will be turned off indefinitely.
post #70 of 78
Thread Starter 
post #71 of 78
John H, I feel your pain. Did marketing make so many of us this way?

JoCanadian, I happen to really like Canada and most of the people who live there. You seem to have a real complex about the US. What's up with that?

Speaking of power shortages, a local utility had to raise their rates because the people did such a good job of conservation that the utility was not making their regular revenue.
Talk about Catch 22.<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by Lucky (edited May 17, 2001).]</FONT>
post #72 of 78
Skiing is far to invidualized and dynamic for there to be any one system or school of thought. The best school of instruction i have found is observation, and the cheapest.

As a few of you read conspiracy and conflict in everything that is written,
I will post the order of big mac quality, I have experienced, by country.

1. Argentina
2. UK
3. Greece
4. Canada
5. Belgium
6. Singapore
7. Indonesia
8. USA

It is always interesting to see how American culture is presented in other countries, thus the fast food chain visit.

Having spent a great amount of time in the US both visiting and working i have discovered many things I like and some I dislike. I apologize if i have dwelled on the negatives.
post #73 of 78
The Big Mac at the McD's in Rome was much better than here too. I won't eat them here-ick.

Deep yogic breaths...
post #74 of 78
John H. You have just explained something that I see is at the root of almost every message you have posted on any board. Unfortunately, the reason that i see it, is that I can relate to it.
It seems that you have invested a good deal of your own intellectual, emotional and financial resources in being the best that you can be. While doing that, you have always respected those who are more knowledgeable, but in that respect, you have exercised your well deserved right to question them.
And in doing so, you have developed a style of teaching that is uniquely your own, and will continue to devlope as you learn more.

But other than the satisfaction of watching your students suceed, and their gratification, unfortunately, the skiing industry does not always give its teaching stars the financial renumeration or the respect that it deserves.

And if thats not bad enough, it is SO darn easy for a SYSTEM to become bigger, more important, more respected than an individual, even if that individual has put EVERTHING into being precisely that: an individual, not a cog in some system.

Hope all this was'nt just projection, on my part.

Be Braver in your body, or your luck will leave you. DH Lawrence
post #75 of 78

You tryin' to psychoanalyze me?

You have no idea how much I'd like to make a living through skiing. But because of the way that ski teaching is set up by ski area management, I'd have to take about a 70% pay cut, and live in a trailer. I was able to do okay, for a college kid, at Breck in the late 80s, but pay has gone up about 20-30% since then, and housing has gone up about 200-300%. I like the fact that I can afford to have my wife be a stay-at-home-mom (and that she wants to be). Unfortunately, I've been raised in the 'burbs, and I like being fairly comfortable and knowing where my next meal is coming from, and that I have money in the bank in case we should have a need for it. I envy people like BobB and Gravity, and the few others who have been able to be successful at it. And now that I have gone to teaching part time, I have become part of the problem, since I don't need to make "real" money through it.

Living around a city like DC, I have learned to despise the instant gratification, I-want-it-for-free crowd. A few months ago, I saw a cube truck with some writing in the dirt on the back of it that said "If you can't win it, steal it". I didn't know whether to cry or go postal. All I could think was "why not actually work for it and earn it?" It gets me very depressed. I guess that's what I get for coming from a funcional family that taught me the value of work, ethics, education, morals, etc.

I'm depressed now. Is it ski season yet?

**Due to the power shortage, the light at the end of the tunnel will be turned off indefinitely.
post #76 of 78
No psyhoanalysis. Every see Star Trek, Next Generation. Mark calls me Counselor Troy. The Empath.
When I first started teaching fitness, many, many years ago, I was making $1.85 an hour. I had to deal with the same issues you are dealing with now. It took many years, but at my level, I can earn a living at this. I guess it kind of helps that I can do this year round. But there are still issues. If I was'nt married, I would not have health insurance, and as a freelancer, I don't have sick or vacation pay. Plus, most of what I make goes into my continuing education, and a good deal of it goes into skiing.
So I get pretty enraged myself when I pay out at the top limits of what I can afford for skiing, only to find out that the instructor is getting bus boy wages.

But again, it comes back to my constant rant about the lack of value our society gives to any sort of teacher. And if someone comes up with a quick fix for anything, this is what will get people excited.
I am also a little hypersensitive about "star syndrome". So often, on many types of message forum, there will be a few teachers participating, who will be giving out brilliant information. Then someone will recommend a book by some "pop author" that is really sort of superficial, compared to what has been given out. And everyone is so thrilled.
Thats what I love about EpicSki. We don't do that.

Be Braver in your body, or your luck will leave you. DH Lawrence
post #77 of 78
John H- Housing in Colorado? I would guess more in the range of 500%. In Boulder county 25%/annum has been the norm. I guess it is a dual edged sword. My house has doubled in value in two years. I hope to live in it two or three more and retire for a second time to an area where housing is cheaper and I can ski. I have no idea where that might be. I have friends here from D.C. and housing costs were similar. Don't know what you do 9-5, but you might consider Boulder/Golden. You can commute to Summit County or teach at Eldora and enjoy better skiing.
post #78 of 78

That % I threw out was for chaep rent for a ski bum. I went into Summit County for the first time since I lived there, a year and a half ago. I couldn't believe how built up it got. Especially into the front range. There were NO "neighborhoods" there, when I lived in Frisco.

I'm considering Denver. I work for a federal contractor, and we do have a fairly large office in Denver. I also have a good friend that will probably be moving out there within the next 3-12 months. He may go work weekends for BobB. If I lived out there, I'd definitely have a lot of places to choose from. I'd probably need to do some interviewing to find out where I'd want to work, but Copper would be near the top of the list, simply because of BobB. As it is, I'm used to driving 90-120 minutes to my ski area, but I keep an apartment there, that I stay at on the weekends. I'd probably want to do the same out there, but it would depend on the cost. If it was way too expensive, then I'd have to look into closer areas. My wife is pretty up on the idea, especially since she just read that Denver was listed as one of the top 10 places to live. But we're about to have our first baby, and we just moved, so we aren't ready to pick up and leave just yet.
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