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my comments on Expert 2 - Page 2

post #31 of 78
Apparently even teenage girls like Bethany can grasp that concept.
I'm begining to think this whole argument is futile. As I said in a fitness post, there will always be people who need to follow a demagogue. Free thinkers will continue to follow other free thinkers.

Be Braver in your body, or your luck will leave you. DH Lawrence
post #32 of 78
I think you are onto it Bethany, it is much easier after all to find and believe in all the answers in one place. It takes far more energy, courage and dedication to search for your own answers!
post #33 of 78
Thread Starter 
That was a good post.

"If it doesn't work for you, fine. But, it's working for me and it's working for others"

and now I see a hint that It may not be for everyone.. Sounds much better.
Also the specifics of why it works for you is helpful. The one thing at a time... same coach... These are good selling points and make sense for I would guess many beginners intermediates..
post #34 of 78
Wacko makes a good point here for begining skiers. The problem with a lot of begining skiers is they have little consistency. They take a group here and there very far apart. Then maybe nothing for awhile.
post #35 of 78
Hey Whacko, nice post! Good to hear some logic and reason. It even makes some sense.

In your last post, you said "I also understand that expert skiers like Gravity and others have little motivation to try this system. And, I understand their reservations. Harb is basically telling them they're not skiing as well as they could be and that's a tough pill (impossible?) to swallow for expert skiers."

I don't think it's because better skiers are being told they still have stuff to learn, because I think true experts, in any field, understand better than anyone, that they still have a lot to learn. I think the problem is that it IS only one way of doing things. One thing you learn as an instructor, are that there are many ways to teach and many ways to learn, and some people will learn using one style better than others. Expert skiers, because of the level of refinement they are looking for, need multiple ways to experience new sensations, moves, feelings, etc, to get them ingrained properly. So having many different sets of eyes watching you, and many different methods to try to make adjustements and corrections can only help.

On another note, to address your "single teacher" theory; there is no reason any student couldn't have a single PSIA instructor, and stay with them for years. This will accomplish the same objective, but work for people who need to have other ways of being taught, as the instructors will have multiple methods of getting the student to learn.
post #36 of 78
Thread Starter 
have you also considered that some people and their learning styles, body types, or ability may not lend itself to that teaching system? Maybe even gone beyond that system. My dad (71) went to the Lito clinic last year (which takes a lot from PMTS) and there were some improvements but also some things that were not working for him either.

Also unlearning? I hope not. learning new skills and replacing old skills with not new skills but more skills yes. otherwise that would be saying that 100% weight transfer (or lift/lighten to tip) is a bad skill and you have to unlearn it to do weighted releases taught in the undergraduate program that also is promoted at the next step in the progression.

hmm lots of new stuff since I started this post.

PSIA certification gives us a "standard" also but it may not be as rigid as PMTS. A level 3 cert will pretty much give you the same kind of consistancy. unfortunatly the ski schools don't seem to be able attract them with the pay scales they are putting out.

Also I would suspect that even though PMTS is "the same" you will not get exactly the same instruction. the instructor will use what skills he has to teach you what you need. SnoKarver has said this in his post. His own experience plays into his teaching. He may use more and more of the PMTS instruction and methods but he also has a wealth of experience to use too.<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by dchan (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #37 of 78

you don't REALLY do that tap on the shoulder thing, DO you?
i mean, is there a particular way of discerning snobs from non-snobs?

that's a nice little boulder
ya gots on yer shoulder.

also, that's a lot of "dusting," too, 'cause there ain't no shortage of snobs at resort-type mountains, right?

(don't get all sensitive on me now, either. i suspect we're a lot more alike than it might seem. i might just have a more active "editor."
and i didn't get the "swim like a fish" thing.)
post #38 of 78
Thread Starter 
Food fight!....
post #39 of 78
wacko. if you ever saw Gravity ski you would have to take back many of your comments.
post #40 of 78

Deep yogic breaths...
post #41 of 78
Paul, I've long suspected it, and now I know for sure. You are a mental case.
post #42 of 78
Wait a minute...must jump in...must restrain, must hold back...must jump in...with 2 feet...

I ski at Vail, my brother and all of his friends live in and ski at Vail and I know plenty of others who ski at Vail who are not snobs.

What is your definition of a snob?
--Perhaps you are experiencing feelings of inadequacy??--
There are plenty of cool folks there! Open your eyes.

Also, if you don't like the people on the mountain, then you do have the option of skiing elsewhere. There are plenty of "locals" mountains.
Who stole Wacko's meds? He was doing so well???

Deep yogic breaths...
post #43 of 78
Thread Starter 
and to think I could get a calm discussion about this book, it's merits and failings... Silly me.
post #44 of 78
Paul, I certainly have my share of issues, however I have found that life goes much smoother for me and those around me if I curb my anti social tendencies somewhat. And I would say that challenging unwitting and probably unwilling bystanders in an uncompetitive environment is anti social behavior. I have found that online computer games such as Unreal Tournament or Age of Empires are an appropriate arena for such behavior. Taunts and boasting and "schooling" are well accepted in those communities.
post #45 of 78
Thread Starter 
You'll get your chance. It went out in todays mail I put a bookmark in for you.
post #46 of 78
How come nobody commented on that "you dare make one more . . . " thinly veiled threat? I mean that guy legally threatened AC, now he is physically threatening members?
post #47 of 78
come ON!!!!! i mean, really.
post #48 of 78
Loki-Because we are all practicing the "ignore him and he'll go away" theory and letting it roll off our backs. (at least that's my story and I am sticking to it!)

Deep yogic breaths...
~Minker<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by SkiMinker (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #49 of 78
Thread Starter 
quack - quack - quack
post #50 of 78
Good idea, except we are NOT ignoring him - simply by participating in this! Can't we just teleport him to RSA where he would fit right in?<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by Loki (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #51 of 78
A. he had a moment of niceness
B. I had a weak moment

slap on the wrist for me.
Deep yogic breaths...
<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by SkiMinker (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #52 of 78

last time it got this, uh, colorful, was the powder bomb, and it WAS a full moon. (ah, the memories...)

well, just checked. no full moon.

post #53 of 78
Wack? Wack? You still there? Come in, Wack. (I have a question about the phantom feets.) Can't wait till Gravity gets the book and starts HIS post about it. Then Jonathan. Then....
post #54 of 78
For you Ryan...

I looked for a duck for you DChan, but only found a chicken

<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by SkiMinker (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #55 of 78
duh...which way did he go, which way did he go....
post #56 of 78
Do you find any difference in effort/execution in, for example, "deep" powder (versus the groomed)? I ask as someone who does NOT (yet) ski deep powder very well. Answer any way you prefer; I'm genuinely more interested in YOUR early experiences taking PMTS off the groomed and into trickier terrain. Maybe something like...breakthroughs YOU had in skiing powder.
The one-footed skiing (Harb's terminology refers to the "stance" ski) was GREAT for me on less challenging terrain but when I took it into deeper stuff, I had the float/sink problem. Still do, though less pronounced. When I "built a platform," though, with two skis and thought to myself "ski (and weight/unweight) with BOTH skis, it helped. I'm not saying this contradicts (or agrees) with Harb - I'm not sure anymore - but I'm wondering if all the PMTS stuff just transferred easily and automatically to the non-groomed.
Thanks.<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by Mescalero (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #57 of 78
I don't really get the snob thing. When I am skiing I notice the terrain and obstacles man made or otherwise. My wife once asked me if I notice women when I am on ski trips with the guys. My repy was "only if they ski as fast or faster and come into my field of vision." O the chair I'm thinking about where I'm going to ski next or talking to my friends.
As far as trying to smoke people, I only care about that on the race course and only if I had a good run. Maybe it's self-centered, but I care more about how I ski than those around me unless I am teaching.

Does gdubs have an older brother?
post #58 of 78
yeah, Rubba Dub Dubs.<FONT size="1">

[This message has been edited by ryan (edited May 16, 2001).]</FONT>
post #59 of 78
Thanks for replying.
post #60 of 78
Ahh, Ok. I will jump in...

My powder/crud skiing improved with the adjustments I got by learning PMTS moves...

And I had a chance to experience it two days after doing a three day PMTS clinic. I was already a pretty strong crud and powder skier.

Most of the improvement, for me, was keeping a narrower stance, and the EASE of making the turns. And quicker turns too, if desired.

As I think I have mentioned before, I have not achieved as much change in my bump skiing. Not sure there will be, but I will keep learning.

My groomer and steep skiing has, however, changed.

I went to the Cert clinic to cert as a teacher, so a LOT of emphasis was on instructor things... biomechanics, student directed teaching, etc. And I must say, the green certification was MUCH tougher than the PSIA's.

As such, we did not work on upper level skiing as much, and concentrated on lower level drills and skills.

Next year, I'll be back for more, I assure you!

¯¯¯/__ SnoKarver snokarver@excite.com
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