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Skiing too close to another skier

post #1 of 27
Thread Starter 

Skiers need space to arc it, change their line as their whim strikes and snow dictates, have their joy in the mountains. Don't crowd, push, overtake or cut-off other skiers. Period. (acess road/trails with caution and consideration)

 

I have a theory why it happens around here. Many of the skiers from the nearby metropolitan center are road cyclists. In road cycling, it is the standard to ride very close together for a number of reasons. For racers and avid riders, it is practically second nature. So they ski that way, hike the ridge that way...huddled together as if to beat the wind.

 

In the mountains, I prefer to experience the elements for myself, and without another skier crowding my space.

 

Any other theories as to why some skiers just don't get this; it's a huge mountain. spread out.

 

post #2 of 27

Most skiers are intermediate, and will tend towards terrain that is intermediate in difficulty.  However, in any mountain, there is only a limited amount of intermediate territory.  Thus, you will get crowding in this territory.  There is no way to avoid this.

 

If you are an advanced skier, you will most likely be skiing in an area that has no crowds.  However, to get to this area, you must often traverse across crowded territory.  Of course, most of the skiers in this crowded territory will ski slower than you.  So you will naturally try to dodge them all as you overtake them to get to the lift quickly.

 

This is just how things work.

 

 

post #3 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrzinwin View Post

 

...., to get to this area, you must often traverse across crowded territory.  Of course, most of the skiers in this crowded territory will ski slower than you.  So you will naturally try to dodge them all as you overtake them to get to the lift quickly.

 

This is just how things work.

 

 


 

this would be my reference to acess roads/trails, where courtesy is an unavoidable method.

 

of course this kind of comment comes up for me during President's day/Ski Week when the hill is full of ...well....new faces

post #4 of 27

huddled together as if to beat the wind. Heard instinct? Don't see higher level skiers/boarders do this or get/slide nearby when your stopped,ect. I've noticed most do not look uphill when taking off or entering a run.

post #5 of 27

personally, I enjoy dogding skiers as I over take them.  It's kinda like a little strategy game--trying to find a strategic path through a sea of obstacles.

 

The key is to cut people off BEHIND them (not in front).  Another tactic is simply to straight line down the right side of the trail yelling "right" as you overtake people.

 

 

 

 

post #6 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by slider View Post

 

huddled together as if to beat the wind. Heard instinct? Don't see higher level skiers/boarders do this ....

nor do I.

 

but I see, feel, encounter lots of wannabe experts do this for a variety of mostly un-wholesome, ego- based reasons: I'm faster, I'm cool, watch this, I own this line, I was gonna ski that line first, look I'm right next to you, and so on....
 

post #7 of 27

Most of the cool kids skid. A carver does not annoy me because I don't get that vibe from them.

post #8 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by davluri View Post

 

Skiers need space to arc it, change their line as their whim strikes and snow dictates, have their joy in the mountains. Don't crowd, push, overtake or cut-off other skiers. Period. (acess road/trails with caution and consideration)

 

I have a theory why it happens around here. Many of the skiers from the nearby metropolitan center are road cyclists. In road cycling, it is the standard to ride very close together for a number of reasons. For racers and avid riders, it is practically second nature. So they ski that way, hike the ridge that way...huddled together as if to beat the wind.

 

In the mountains, I prefer to experience the elements for myself, and without another skier crowding my space.

 

Any other theories as to why some skiers just don't get this; it's a huge mountain. spread out.

 

My theory is that skiers are like magnets.  Throw a handful down the trail and they just go towards each other.  It's bizarre but it always happens. Just stand on the side of a trail and watch and people come by in packs. 

Same with cars on  a highway.

If you need space to arc you've got to wait and time it.

post #9 of 27

I don't see the connection to cycling. After all, if you stop all those skiers I bet 1% of them ride a bike!!!

 

On the other hand, we're herd animals. Just look at the cars on highways. They travel in "bunches", with plenty of space between the "bunch". Well, unless you think drivers learn to drive from road cyclists. Fat chance!

post #10 of 27

I really don't mind the sheeple. Even on crowded weekends there are lifts where you don't stand in line. Ones with no maze where there is normally a clump that alternates, but the gapers all line up on one side. Can ski right onto the lift even with 20+ in line.

post #11 of 27

I think there's some element of target fixation as well.  People watch one another, intending to be careful, but instead are drawn to the thing they're looking at. 

 

post #12 of 27

We make a point to ski every week on ski club night.  My GF is a teacher and many of our friends are teachers who are involved in ski club.  We usually go off and do our own thing but make a few runs with the group.  Many of them only ski once a week on ski club night for the six weeks that it runs.  For some reason they tend to ski in a large group carrying on a conversation all the way down.  If the group starts to break up they all stop, regroup, ski and carry on the conversation.  Drives me absolutely crazy!  It's only 700' vertical for crying out loud! 

post #13 of 27

Sounds like you guys need to hire a sheep hearder, me, to take care of the sheep.

Think that they all need haircuts?
Cause, I'm getting aufly poor.

post #14 of 27

How do you ski and carry on a conversation at the same time? I'd worry about running into something.

post #15 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by slider View Post

 

How do you ski and carry on a conversation at the same time? I'd worry about running into something.

 

I don't know if it matters at the speed they are going.

post #16 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tog View Post

 

My theory is that skiers are like magnets.  Throw a handful down the trail and they just go towards each other.  It's bizarre but it always happens. Just stand on the side of a trail and watch and people come by in packs. 

Same with cars on  a highway.

If you need space to arc you've got to wait and time it.

Ummm no you seem to have gottin it wrong, it's Bazzer that happens!!! (take care all in JH this week (have fun))
 

post #17 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by davluri View Post

 

I have a theory why it happens around here. Many of the skiers from the nearby metropolitan center are road cyclists. In road cycling, it is the standard to ride very close together for a number of reasons. For racers and avid riders, it is practically second nature. So they ski that way, hike the ridge that way...huddled together as if to beat the wind.

 

 

Any other theories as to why some skiers just don't get this; it's a huge mountain. spread out.

 


 

here is the reason. They are taught to ski close together, or in a line, but the lame ass instructor. The instructors teach bad habits like not looking up hill before starting to ski, stopping when you can't be seen from above, meeting  thier friends inside of the lift maze, in everyones way, instead of outside the maze where they should. Most bad behavior i see on the hill is taught by the instructor.

post #18 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by lloyd braun View Post

 


 

here is the reason. They are taught to ski close together, or in a line, but the lame ass instructor. The instructors teach bad habits like not looking up hill before starting to ski, stopping when you can't be seen from above, meeting  thier friends inside of the lift maze, in everyones way, instead of outside the maze where they should. Most bad behavior i see on the hill is taught by the instructor.

This is only partially true. For example, most instructors have their own lanes & hence are not responsible for teaching rude maze cluttering behavior & random cutting. That task is usually left to the appropriate pros - the race coaches.

post #19 of 27

They just naturally pick the same line around elevation features. 

Evidence of this can be seen near the end of the day, at least on eastern runs.  Even if the skiers are not on the hill at the same time they will be turning in many of the same places, leaving nice ice patches where there skis scrape out their turn and snow piles to the side.

post #20 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acrophobia View Post

 

I think there's some element of target fixation as well.  People watch one another, intending to be careful, but instead are drawn to the thing they're looking at. 

 

 

I think this is truely the problem. New skiers see a person they don't want to hit and because that's all they are looking at, hit them.

 

If more people skiied the trees...

post #21 of 27

Just wanted to share part of a TR from this past Friday at Vail. 

 

At the end of the day, my friends and I come out of the trees to a section of catwalk and take a look at the most crowded ski slope in the history of the world.  Basically it was everyone from the back bowls of Vail making there way to Vail Village at the end of the day.  All I could think of was a bunch of rats fleeing a flood or fire.  Once we managed to get into the stream of people I kept imagining this is what a salmon must feel like.  I was hugging the side of the run trying to stay with the flow of traffic.  It was commical at how many people were on this one run...

just curious if anyone else has had a similar experience.

post #22 of 27

That is probably not true.  I actually do teach defensive skiing.  I make a point of it.  The only thing that scares me in skiing are the other skiers.  That's the element I can't control.  One of my biggest pet peeves is the skier who locks into a big sweeping turn across a whole slope without looking and then complains about being hit, or almost hit.  Like driving....  You must check before changing lanes.  The "I was the downhill skier" argument doesn't cut it when you do something stupid.  If you are stopped, you MUST look up hill when starting and yield to the skier who is in motion.

post #23 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewski180 View Post

All I could think of was a bunch of rats fleeing a flood or fire.  Once we managed to get into the stream of people I kept imagining this is what a salmon must feel like.

 

Um...never mind.

 

post #24 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetonpwdrjunkie View Post

 

......Like driving....  You must check before changing lanes.  The "I was the downhill skier" argument doesn't cut it when you do something stupid.  If you are stopped, you MUST look up hill when starting and yield to the skier who is in motion.


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drewski180 View Post

 

.......I was hugging the side of the run trying to stay with the flow of traffic.  It was commical at how many people were on this one run...

just curious if anyone else has had a similar experience.

when the run is an all mountain acess trail, the problems do resemble those of a multi-lane road. be aware, project your intentions, predictably travel a lane. of course, it takes some ability, but if only those who can barely ski were unpredictable, we'd probably be OK. 

 

when the run is a wide open face, there is no excuse. think of skiers as being like an open-wheeled race car: they don't mix it up very well. you're in the huge mountains (hopefully). Please, leave the urges to rush around, shout loudly, and crowd another's space back in the 'burbs.

 

most of us know everything I could ever point out, but my intention is to bring up things that can be spread by word of mouth to people who might need to hear them, in the end making skiing more enjoyable.

post #25 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by davluri View Post

Please, leave the urges to rush around, shout loudly, and crowd another's space back in the 'burbs.

 

How am I supposed to practice for the 'Super G'?

 

 

 

post #26 of 27

I have a different theory.  Here in DC, on the Metro escalators, everyone stands on the right and walks on the left.  Then a tourist comes to town, doesn't know the rule, and stands on the left.  What I've noticed is that several seconds after that one person has reached the end and gotten off the escalator, a "knot" of people in the left lane remains.   

 

I think an analogous thing happens in skiing: you reach place on the slope where one or more skiers feel they need to slow down.  Others skiing down to that place see it to be more crowded so they slow down too.  Everyone at that place then moves on, but now in more of a "knot" than they were before.     

post #27 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by drewski180 View Post

 

Just wanted to share part of a TR from this past Friday at Vail. 

 

At the end of the day, my friends and I come out of the trees to a section of catwalk and take a look at the most crowded ski slope in the history of the world.  Basically it was everyone from the back bowls of Vail making there way to Vail Village at the end of the day.  All I could think of was a bunch of rats fleeing a flood or fire.  Once we managed to get into the stream of people I kept imagining this is what a salmon must feel like.  I was hugging the side of the run trying to stay with the flow of traffic.  It was commical at how many people were on this one run...

just curious if anyone else has had a similar experience.

Ack that was you standing on the side of the run in our line last friday>??
 

We thought we had outsmarted the masses on Riva Ridge by staying to the side when all of a sudden there where these people just standing to the side laughing and pointing!!!(you didn't see us cause we hid in the trees after that!!)

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