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current PSIA short turn

post #1 of 27
Thread Starter 

It seems that even within PSIA there are old school technique and new school technique. Anyone got a video of both for comparision and even a list of movements that make up the new school PSIA turns? Any contribution will be much appreciated.

 

 

post #2 of 27

To me there really isn't an old school and a new school method within PSIA.  What most people think of as "old school" is really self taught defensive skidded skiing and it exists everywhere today.

 

PSIA often gets tagged with the "Old School"  or "Traditional Teaching" label. The hords of PSIA instructors who ski and teach this type of defensive skiing do not help that image one little bit. At least in the last 25 years PSIA has not advocated this type of teaching or skiing.

 

With this in mind, what are you looking for as a answer?

post #3 of 27

at my L3 I asked what was acceptable.

 

everything from short swing short turn, to a really turny pivoty short, to a SL race turn was fair game according the examiners. they are looking for skills blending and movement patterns not whether or not you can only ski how they ski.

post #4 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre View Post

With this in mind, what are you looking for as a answer?

My objective is to know what is the current PSIA short turns. Since as you said there are no old-new issue I probably should look for what is a good authentic PSIA short turn. I ask because I like to see the particulars and decide if I can go ahead to learn it and make it one of my turning method.

post #5 of 27
post #6 of 27

The idea that there isn't a singular PSIA short turn is nice.

 

That video from BigE has some real old school vibe going on with the bumper stancewidth and so on.

post #7 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post

The idea that there isn't a singular PSIA short turn is nice.

 

That video from BigE has some real old school vibe going on with the bumper stancewidth and so on.

 

eh not really old school IMO, great skiing.

post #8 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post

The idea that there isn't a singular PSIA short turn is nice.

 

Yeah... its means everybody is right, everyone wins, and even the losers get a trophy. Its easier to throw out the measuring stick than to let everyone know how low the bar really is.

post #9 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA View Post

eh not really old school IMO, great skiing.

I like the skiing, but I still think it has an old school vibe.

post #10 of 27
Thread Starter 

Thanks for the link. Want to briefly describe how these turns are made?

post #11 of 27

In the video that BigE posted, there is nothing old school about it. These are not windscreen wiper push the tails out short radius turns. Watch carefully!!! In particular at the early edge angles!!

 

 

Compare and contrast:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrDol3F22a0

 


Edited by veeeight - Wed, 04 Feb 09 09:22:57 GMT


Edited by T-Square - 2/7/2009 at 03:05 pm
post #12 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by veeeight View Post

In the video that BigE posted, there is nothing old school about it. These are not windscreen wiper push the tails out short radius turns. Watch carefully!!! In particular at the early edge angles!!

 

 

Compare and contrast:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrDol3F22a0

 


Edited by veeeight - Wed, 04 Feb 09 09:22:57 GMT

 

yes, this looks like back seated skiing.

post #13 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by veeeight View Post

These are not windscreen wiper push the tails out short radius turns. Watch carefully!!! In particular at the early edge angles!!

 

I don't think that requires very much careful viewing to understand.  It is generally modern skiing.  OTOH the Hungarians don't have the 1998 world cup moguls stance width going on.  They both have some pluses and minuses.  The question is what the PSIA's taste is.  So I googled "psia demo team" and got this page as a result:

 

http://www.psia.org/psia_2002/education/lending_library/library_t.asp?mode=lending_library&category=PSIA/AASI%20National%20-%20Alpine

^I guess there are some cool vids out there from 1991 that could totally clear this up.


Searching youtube for "PSIA Demo Team" came up with pretty much everything but.  So now I'm pretty familiar with demos from Canada, Australia, Japan, Italy, but not the US.  Apparently PSIA fails at the internet.  Those guys BigE posted look Canadian.  Surely the Americans don't wear such funny hats.

 

edit: To be clear, there is some sarcasm in this post, but I was 100% serious earlier when I said I think it is nice PSIA apparently doesn't have a singular aesthetic standard.  Skiing seems like a results driven activity to me, so I like the idea that results matter more than formula.


Edited by Garrett - Wed, 04 Feb 09 14:11:12 GMT
post #14 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post

The idea that there isn't a singular PSIA short turn is nice.

 

Yeah... its means everybody is right, everyone wins, and even the losers get a trophy. Its easier to throw out the measuring stick than to let everyone know how low the bar really is.


 

Precisely my thinking. 

 

I did have some examples of PSIA demos on my signature line once.   

Edit: Here they are: http://www.v1sports.com/academy/psia/


Edited by BigE - Wed, 04 Feb 09 16:12:49 GMT


Edited by BigE - Wed, 04 Feb 09 16:14:46 GMT
post #15 of 27

Thanks for the link.  Just the kind of thing I was looking for.

post #16 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE View Post

I did have some examples of PSIA demos on my signature line once.  

 

I had a signature line once...

post #17 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE View Post

I did have some examples of PSIA demos on my signature line once.  

 

I had a signature line once...

 

I remember. The physics thing. :)

post #18 of 27

Noo Skool ....

 

Ol' Skool .....

 

Yada .... Yada ..... freakin' ..... Yada ..

 

 

Did it hit any of you Gran' & Exhalted L-3's that ...... you bring the right tool to the job?

 

Not one discussion or comment on the radius or type of ski?

 

Or, am I missing somethin ....

post #19 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by carver_hk View Post
 

I remember. The physics thing. :)

 

Actually, that was DD223's signature (which was a quote of something I said in a thread about carving on ice).

 

Mine was: All-Mountain: A common descriptive term for boots or skis that are designed to perform equally poorly under a variety of conditions and over many different types of terrain.

post #20 of 27

Give 'em a break Yuki, the old skool comment came from me, the peanut gallery.

 

Radius implies a turn shaped like a curve, which is kind of a stretch for some of those up there.  Me likey the ones where the turns are like turns instead of highly refined speed scrubbing in the fall line, but again I'm the peanut gallery.

post #21 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeluvaSkier View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by carver_hk View Post
 

I remember. The physics thing. :)

 

Actually, that was DD223's signature (which was a quote of something I said in a thread about carving on ice).

 

Mine was: All-Mountain: A common descriptive term for boots or skis that are designed to perform equally poorly under a variety of conditions and over many different types of terrain.

anyhow, i respect u as one can ski and eager to learn.  :)

post #22 of 27

I was just kidding about the old ... new.... and all of that.

 

However!

 

The radius of the ski is still the key here ..... period and end of topic.

 

If you increase the speed or angles of edging ... on a "GS radius" ... or "fat" .... what do you get, if the idea is to stay within a given track (radius) .... ? ? ?

post #23 of 27
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki View Post

The radius of the ski is still the key here ..... period and end of topic.

When the radius of short turn is like less then 1 meter. I wonder what does radius of any skis matter? 

 

post #24 of 27

"Just like a Wop.  Brings a knife to a gun fight" .......

 

Malone in the (1987) Untouchables

 

post #25 of 27

watch the sogard video on the link and realize I have seen him ski much more dynamic and more angulated than that.

 

Rob in my opinion is one of the people who can save the PSIA, and looks tons better than the so called 'SL turns" that are up higher in the page.

 

 

post #26 of 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by BushwackerinPA View Post

Rob in my opinion is one of the people who can save the PSIA, and looks tons better than the so called 'SL turns" that are up higher in the page.

 

Rob's skiing was the only clip in the stuff that BigE linked that wasn't worthless, you're right.

post #27 of 27

veeeight,

 

Thanks for the video.  At 25 seconds in there is a great and interesting exercise.  Bouncing wedge while extending the outside lege to turn.  Then move the legs closer together and finally you end up in a short radius turn.  I'm going to need to try that sometime.

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