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binding ????

post #1 of 17
Thread Starter 
ive been out of skiing for about 20 yrs.... went the other day with my daughter, who loved it.... what a shock.... the skies are diff. shape (and easier to use) !!! My ???? is, what is this deal with integrated bindings??? they used to be screwed to the ski, what is this all about, and why is it better??? Forgive me, but i didnt know much back then, but i know NOTHING now!!! thanks, Craig
post #2 of 17
It's supposed to be better because it allows the ski & binding to flex together and provide a better interface between the two.
Consider it like this: A "screwed on" binding has a flat toe and flat heel piece. Each is only a few cms long but still, the base of each is flat. When you flex a ski, the ski wants to go into a curve, but at the toe and heel pieces, it either has to stay flat (cause it's attached to the binding), or it has to try to go into a curve and pull away from the binding. Neither of these is an ideal situation, so by mounting bindings on rails (which is the most common way of doing it), the interface no longer has to remain flat.

...of course this could all be completely wrong, but I believe that is what the marketing departments say is the reason for it.
post #3 of 17
The toepiece and heel piece try to come together when the ski is flexed in a turn or compression, which can cause the old style bindings to pre-release. The new bindings are better in that respect too.
post #4 of 17
Whole idea about free flex bindings and plates (ok plates have some other function too) is, that skis can bend evenly through whole length, and you get nice arc.
If heel and toe are mounted straight on ski, skis don't bend evenly, but they bend infront of toe, and behind the hell, but space between toe and heel remains flat. It does make difference for racers, but normal people won't really see this difference. Afterall, skis don't bend all that much as someone would expect, and 30 flat centimeters under boot won't make you worse skier... especially after 20 years break
post #5 of 17
Thread Starter 
thanks guys.... just trying to catch up on things... been a long time
post #6 of 17
The current trend is back to more skis sold "flat" that you mount any binding you wish. My read is that the advantage of the integrated bindings is more hype than anything else. I suspect you would be hard pressed to tell the difference skiing the same ski back to back with each unless you tested skis for a living.
post #7 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimH View Post
The current trend is back to more skis sold "flat" that you mount any binding you wish. My read is that the advantage of the integrated bindings is more hype than anything else. I suspect you would be hard pressed to tell the difference skiing the same ski back to back with each unless you tested skis for a living.
Yup, bindings already have some elasticity in them, so in theory the ski can flex just as well as something like a railflex.
post #8 of 17
Well, that, and:

As the result of a consolidation phase in the '80s and '90s, virtually every brand (or brand family) includes both skis and bindings.
post #9 of 17
Thread Starter 
So, do i stay away from a ski that has a integrated binding, or stay away from a mounted binding ski??? Remember, havent been on skis for 20 yrs, was intermediate + then.....doubt i could tell the diff. between either honestly. Can you get certain skis only with int. bindings and certain ones that must have screw on bindings???? Sorry for all the questions guys thanks.
post #10 of 17
Most new skis for hard snow come with a particular binding standard and you don't have to worry about it.

If you have a choice of binding, there are some good ones out there, like the Tryolia FF17+.

I would say get either a binding that incorporates a rail of some sort, or get a ski that includes the rail as part of it's built-in binding system.

There is a difference that most would find hard to notice in terms of ski performance, but more importantly these bindings do not have to take up flex when you get into a compression messing with your forward pressure. Ergo fewer pre-releases.
post #11 of 17
Thread Starter 
I see alot of the skies come with bindings now, unlike the old days. I seen a pair of Volkl AC20 (i think) that were for int-adv skier, with binding allready. Would this be too much ski, i want something that i can ski with but will also let me improve (if i do). If that makes sense.
post #12 of 17
Hi Monkers,
For specialty skis (off piste, race, freestyle) you will want a flat mount binding system.

For all-mountain skis, you will be fine with integrated systems.

I left the ski biz last year, so I'm not up to date on what is available. If you are the ability that you claim to be, the AC20 should work for you now and as you progress. I'm assuming that you will be spending most of the time on groomers with occasional forays off piste.

There are probably other skis that can be recommended.

Dennis
post #13 of 17
Thread Starter 
99% will be groomed, hope i dont sound too stupid here, but what is "off piste" powder? Im sure there are a bunch of skies, ive seen these in a couple local shops, id like to stay local if i can , for the boot fitting etc.... if there is a problem....trying on gear etc..... i know you can get them cheaper on line, but if i can buy at the end of this yr, beg. of next yr (this yrs ski) i may be able to get a good enough deal so i can stick local. I am in no way set on one brand or anythng like that, want good quality, something i can progress on.
post #14 of 17
There is so much shape on the AC 20 that it will work well on groomed snow.

The term "off piste" is used for anywhere but the groomers. It's a pretty broad term.

Dennis
post #15 of 17
There are 3 different things... Skis with integrated bindings, and skis with mounted bindings. Skis with integrated bindings (mounted to rails integrated into skis) are normally lower level (I have no idea if this is right word, so sorry for my English), while racing skis come with free flex (or whatever specific company calls them) bindings mounted on plates. Then there's third option, old style bindings mounted to skis, and this option is the one where ski doesn't bend under boot.
Nowadays pretty much all store skis come with binding mounted. Normally it's either integrated binding or free flex bindings mounted on plates.
But as JimH said, you won't really see difference between each of this options. Difference is so small, that people who were never into top level competition skiing, won't notice that.
post #16 of 17
Integrated bindings can also increase resale value and make it very easy to loan your skis to friends, for better or worse.
post #17 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManDown View Post
Integrated bindings can also increase resale value and make it very easy to loan your skis to friends, for better or worse.
For e.g. Railflex, you can easily have several pairs of skis and a single set of bindings. Good for your pocket, good for travelling with several pairs of ski.... some people actually do it too (as opposed to just appreciating the theory).
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