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Inside half

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
I don't know if this is the right place to put this, but I would like to hear from the Pros on this question.

What does the phrase "a strong inside half" mean to you?

Thanks in adance,

JF
post #2 of 22
It means the inside ski, foot, knee, hip and shoulder are all slightly--or more than slightly, depending upon application--ahead.
post #3 of 22

stong, stable

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kneale Brownson View Post
It means the inside ski, foot, knee, hip and shoulder are all slightly--or more than slightly, depending upon application--ahead.
and (in my world)
strong, stable, sometimes almost isometrically contracted to resist excess rotary forces.

it's a focus i like.

cheers,
holiday
post #4 of 22
And in my mind not only leading but also higher, with the inside hip higher, and the inside shoulder higher. So in my mind the leading and lifting need to happen together to create a strong inside half.
post #5 of 22
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the insights guys.
Could you also add that edge angle of the inside ski is equal to the outside, with no diverging or converging?
JF
post #6 of 22
To me a strong inside half is exactly what it says. The inside half of your body and inside ski could suddenly take your full weight with little shift in position should the outside ski lose grip.

This means that you have the inside ski under you and the inside half of your body is leading the outside half.

There is a whole laundry list of things that skiers do to compromise the strength of the inside half of their bodies in turns.

I personally don't like catch all terms like "Stong Inside Half" as they mean little to ski instruction. Even ski instructors are not sure what they mean and I avoid them when working with ski instructors unless asked for the meaning. All these terms are is a cop out for a real explanation.
post #7 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre View Post
I personally don't like catch all terms like "Stong Inside Half" as they mean little to ski instruction. Even ski instructors are not sure what they mean and I avoid them when working with ski instructors unless asked for the meaning. All these terms are is a cop out for a real explanation.
Thanks Pierre, This is probably the reason I asked the question in the first place.
Maybe I should ask:
What are some of the indicators of a Weak Inside?

JF
post #8 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ster View Post
Thanks for the insights guys.
Could you also add that edge angle of the inside ski is equal to the outside, with no diverging or converging?
JF
It is all about posture and alignment as opposed to specific outcomes at the snow. Think of it as a visual cue to effective skiing. Is it a catch all phrase that suffers from misunderstanding? Yes. Does it have value a point of reference or discussion? I think it does. You can feel it when you personally have or don't have a strong inside half and you can see it when some does or doesn't have strong inside half.

So then it comes down to the question of do I teach a strong inside half? Yes and no. I teach the movements, posture, and alignment that will synergize into a strong inside half. Hope that helps.
post #9 of 22
I asked Shawn Smith (ex PSIA demo team coach) this question last week. He started with a long answer, but we all knew that answer. I wanted a short answer I could give to my newbie instructors. He came up with: rotate 1/2 of your core (from hips to shoulders - scrunch up one side of your body). Feel that functional tension? That's a strong inside half. Although this does not tell you what a strong inside 1/2 is used for in skiing, you can feel the strength. Core strength is a key component of balance.
post #10 of 22
In addition to the above ref's to the ahead and higher representation, a strong inside half to me also implies what it is and is not.

Functionally fulfilling it's role of creatively mixing the D.I.R.T. of the desired movements, so that the outside half can more simply provide structural support of stance and balance while following the inside 's lead.

Actively leading, not passively trailing.

Inside saying "let's go here" vs outside saying "get out of my way"

Creating the body shape that the outside half fits into.

Working in concert with, not conflict with, outside half.

Functionally aligned to the inside ski, not the outside ski.

Skiers who have developed their skill set to be able to ski as with same functional body posture and mechanics on their inside ski as outside have probably have it, those who bank and rotate on inside ski probably do not.
post #11 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcmeister View Post
Working in concert with, not conflict with, outside half.
^
^
^
Nice Ric, Rusty & Arc. Thanks.
post #12 of 22
4ster, it's a phrase i don't use much. It's one of those expressions that sounds new school, knowledgeable and insightful,,, that leaves listeners impressed but scratching their heads.

What I do speak about is driving the inside hip forward and inside (10 o'clock, 2 o'clock to) to create counter and edge angle,,, not dropping the outside hip back to 4 and 8. I talk about lifting the inside hip and shoulder to help a skier angulate and stay balanced on the outside foot. And I talk about keeping a bit of rotational tension in the inside hip/leg/ankle, to power the inside ski through edge angle discrepancies and keep the inside ski traveling in directional harmony with the outside ski.
post #13 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4ster View Post
Thanks for the insights guys.
Could you also add that edge angle of the inside ski is equal to the outside, with no diverging or converging?
JF
While those are general guidelines for people who are struggling with chronic A-framing, or stemmed entries, or diverging turn finishes,,, they (non-parallel skis and unequal edge angles) are also tactics or occurrences that carry situational usage in high level, dynamic skiing. Their presence does not necessarily conclude "weakness" or deficiencies in what the inside half of the body is doing.
post #14 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
I talk about keeping a bit of rotational tension in the inside hip/leg/ankle, to power the inside ski through edge angle discrepancies and keep the inside ski traveling in directional harmony with the outside ski.
Thanks Rick.
JF
post #15 of 22
Hi 4ster

An exercise I use to really feel a strong inside half is to have another skier stand below you on the hill as you both stand across the fall line. Then have the skier below you tug on the baskets of your poles while you try to resist him pulling you down the hill. You will feel your edges dig in to the hill as well as your hips and will notice that your upper body is counter rotated to your lower body in order for you to keep your balance.
post #16 of 22
One key to the "tug o war" drill's ability to demonstrate inside half strength is to compare the ability to tug while the uphill person's shoulders are square to the side of the hill vs square to the fall line. It sometimes helps to have the more experienced person demonstrate the difference from the uphill position first.

Safety note: always have the pointy end of the poles point at the more experienced person (the baskets are meant to prevent snowboarders from sliding all the way up the grips, not skiers).
post #17 of 22
Quote:
(the baskets are meant to prevent snowboarders from sliding all the way up the grips, not skiers).
... I see.

Then, that half of the ski pole still sticking out would be called the Outside Half..?

.ma
post #18 of 22
Good point therusty! (No pun intended!)

Thanks for giving me a name for this drill too!
post #19 of 22
Quote:
What are some of the indicators of a Weak Inside?
Rumbling, heartburn, nausea, gas....

On skis, it might look like this:



(from the Tamarack website.)

It's interesting that photographs of skiers with a "weak inside half," characterized by an upper body rotated and banked into the turn, with the outside arm forward, have become very popular in mainstream media. They're on ski magazine covers and resort ads everywhere. Photographers clearly tend to have a better eye for composition than ski technique!

Best regards,
Bob
post #20 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Barnes View Post
Photographers clearly tend to have a better eye for composition than ski technique!

Best regards,
Bob

Remember Patrick Russel & JC Killy started the era of jet stix, sitting back & Hot Dog skiing from one photo. Let's hope this is not a trend in the magazine photo world.
Thanks BB, this is a good illustration.
JF
post #21 of 22
"Remember Patrick Russel & JC Killy started the era of jet stix, sitting back & Hot Dog skiing from one photo."


The Frenchies didn't start those fads. Folks misinterpreting photos of brief moments in their races started those fads.
post #22 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kneale Brownson View Post
"Remember Patrick Russel & JC Killy started the era of jet stix, sitting back & Hot Dog skiing from one photo."


The Frenchies didn't start those fads. Folks misinterpreting photos of brief moments in their races started those fads.
Exactly what I was trying to say. Just as the ski porn movies make the public believe that skiing is all about straightlining, hucking cliffs & outrunning avalanches.
JF
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