EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › General Skiing Discussion › Yellowstone Club files for Bankruptcy
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Yellowstone Club files for Bankruptcy - Page 2

post #31 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiteroom View Post
The skiing is great, so's the food. You don't need to be a millionaire to ski there, I'm proof of that... friends DO help.

But it sure helps if you're an EpicSki Boot Specialist...
post #32 of 59
We've got a couple of other locals in this thread on both sides of this issue.

Compare the way Blixseth approached development v. Lee Poole (in terms of environmental impact). Big difference. Blixseth is a tool.

There is a lot of local animosity against the Club for the wealth it flaunts. I don't care. I don't blame the homeowners. It's their money: they either earned it or did something smart to keep it. It's all Blixseth's total lack of respect for the place, the local community, etc. And I don't know too many peope who return to work a second season.

The skiing is nice. Dead easy to poach. Drop in from Big Sky and you can be sure you'll find a bro bumping chairs. I once did laps there from lunch to close and saw only one other skier the whole time.

But I'll raise a glass to Greg for calling out Blixseth and exposing him for what he is. (I guess that glass better be an old fashioned glass full of Patron, )
post #33 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by faber View Post
The skiing is nice. Dead easy to poach. Drop in from Big Sky and you can be sure you'll find a bro bumping chairs. I once did laps there from lunch to close and saw only one other skier the whole time.
How do you get there from Big Sky? (and how do get back and not get caught poaching?)
post #34 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiking4 View Post
How do you get there from Big Sky? (and how do get back and not get caught poaching?)
Well, you have to start tunneling in the summer...

(seriously though....Big Sky and the Club share a long boundary, from Hippie Highway all the way along the back side of Andesite--pick your spot, ski, ride the shuttle out with the employees, and buy a round at Milkie's)
post #35 of 59
post #36 of 59
post #37 of 59
Sounds like the season may be saved. At least the outcome does not require divestiture and dismantling the assets. I think ownership in a private ski area is a fantasy shared by many members, but YSC just shows the price of entry is beyond the reach of most of us.
post #38 of 59
My question is: How does Yellowstone even keep it running? They're running a huge resort with few people having entry!
post #39 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiking4 View Post
My question is: How does Yellowstone even keep it running? They're running a huge resort with few people having entry!
If you talk to some of the guys who bump chairs there, they'll tell you that they go whole days without skiers. Depending on the time of year, 3-4 days at a time.
post #40 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by faber View Post
If you talk to some of the guys who bump chairs there, they'll tell you that they go whole days without skiers. Depending on the time of year, 3-4 days at a time.
Haha, so then how DO they keep it running?
post #41 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiking4 View Post
Haha, so then how DO they keep it running?
Good question.

I think people from outside the area have this image of this place as a normal ski resort, but a gated one with zillionaires carving corduroy by the droves.

It's actually pretty dead. There are always more patrollers than skiers on the mountain. Most of their instructors also work at Big Sky or Moonlight and scoot over in time to try to catch an afternoon lesson after their morning lineup sends them back empty. Off-duty instructors and employees are not allowed to ski there.

Just a weird, quiet place....that's ruined the environment that created it.
post #42 of 59
In a sense, all the members already paid for the lift ticket whether they show up to ski or not. It's only those who depend on the BODY showing up to ski (instructors) who care about the fact that no one is skiing.

But, boy that stinks that off duty instructors can't ski there. I like it empty but not so empty that no one finds my body!

It would be interesting to find out if the members who do ski go there or go elsewhere when they do.
post #43 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by sibhusky View Post
In a sense, all the members already paid for the lift ticket whether they show up to ski or not. It's only those who depend on the BODY showing up to ski (instructors) who care about the fact that no one is skiing.

But, boy that stinks that off duty instructors can't ski there. I like it empty but not so empty that no one finds my body!

It would be interesting to find out if the members who do ski go there or go elsewhere when they do.
Full-time employees get season passes to Big Sky. The message is clear: don't be seen if you're not working.

And, yeah...members have paid for mountain ops, but the lifts spin, patrollers patrol, instructors are on standby, and service workers of all sort just there to cater to the half-dozen or so skiers per day. And on mid-week in between vacation spikes, NO SKIERS.

Considering how they raped the environment, it makes it hard to accept that so few are even enjoying it.
post #44 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by faber View Post
Full-time employees get season passes to Big Sky. The message is clear: don't be seen if you're not working.

And, yeah...members have paid for mountain ops, but the lifts spin, patrollers patrol, instructors are on standby, and service workers of all sort just there to cater to the half-dozen or so skiers per day. And on mid-week in between vacation spikes, NO SKIERS.

Considering how they raped the environment, it makes it hard to accept that so few are even enjoying it.
I don't get it. This "rape the environment" rhetoric is in pretty direct conflict with the facts.... The ski area has practically no human beings at it. The housing is extremely low density since it's all trophy homes. This sounds like the typical sour grapes politics of envy. Sheep can fornicate without being disturbed other'n the riff-raff employees looking on with lust. There ain't much wastewater to deal with. It's a big carbon footprint per person to heat all the trophy homes but it's not like that's any different from anywhere else in the USofA.

The only Yellowstone Club owner I know is a 'more money than god' physician from Long Island. He and his Yellowstone Club brethern could trivially buy out the Club owner with their pocket change. I imagine that point is being made with the Bankruptcy Court judge by both the members and any creditors who are being stiffed. The residential real estate is worth far more than the ski area. The members with the trophy homes will just have to buy one less exotic car each to take the place over.
post #45 of 59
Quote:
I don't get it.
Yep, you don't get it. The ski area itself hasn't been the problem. The problem is the development in the lower elevations that had small streams and wetlands. The Yellowstone Club's drainage is into the Gallatin River, a once pristine river made famous in 'The River Runs Through It'. (The Gallatin has been rated one of the top ten rivers in the world to fly fish in.) By stepping on creeks and wetlands the quality of the water draining from the Yellowstone Club into the Gallatin goes down. For all the money put into the club they could have been much more careful. Moonlight and Spanish Peaks, two other developments in the area with much lower prices, managed to do a much better job.

BTW - This week the bankruptcy judge allowed the Yellowstone Club to borrow enough money to operate the ski are this winter. The property owners have been represented in court and have stepped up to say they are willing to put more money in but not until there is some accounting for where all the money went and most likely not with the current management.
post #46 of 59
At least our paper reported the loan at TWENTY-ONE PERCENT INTEREST! Could that be true????
post #47 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
I don't get it. This "rape the environment" rhetoric is in pretty direct conflict with the facts.... The ski area has practically no human beings at it. The housing is extremely low density since it's all trophy homes. This sounds like the typical sour grapes politics of envy. Sheep can fornicate without being disturbed other'n the riff-raff employees looking on with lust. There ain't much wastewater to deal with. It's a big carbon footprint per person to heat all the trophy homes but it's not like that's any different from anywhere else in the USofA.

The only Yellowstone Club owner I know is a 'more money than god' physician from Long Island. He and his Yellowstone Club brethern could trivially buy out the Club owner with their pocket change. I imagine that point is being made with the Bankruptcy Court judge by both the members and any creditors who are being stiffed. The residential real estate is worth far more than the ski area. The members with the trophy homes will just have to buy one less exotic car each to take the place over.
Well, Rio straightened you out in one regard.

The other: folks around here (or at least me) don't have an issue with the money that the Club homeowners have. Hell, there's money like that all around here (Big Sky, Paradise Valley, Bridger Canyon, etc.)

It's Blixseth.
post #48 of 59
I find it impossible to believe a place like YC can stay broke. The members and/or creditors are just using bankruptcy as a big stick to hit management they don't like.
post #49 of 59
My heart weeps that these rich people might actually have to ski with the rest of us.
post #50 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechWorlds View Post
My heart weeps that these rich people might actually have to ski with the rest of us.
And exactly what is so bad with them doing so?
post #51 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiking4 View Post
And exactly what is so bad with them doing so?
Absolutely nothing. That is my point.
post #52 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechWorlds View Post
Absolutely nothing. That is my point.
Heh. You got me. I don't get it lol.
post #53 of 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blizzboy283 View Post
So these people are a-holes because they have money? Yeah that Bill Gates sure is an a-hole with what his $38.7 BILLION dollar charity. Geeze, you'd think the guy could give some away or something.

Chill, it was a joke. I don't care who skis and where they do it.
post #54 of 59
Bankruptcy in a case like this is a common ploy to avoid a law suit. Anybody can make a company run out of money on paper, yet stay solvent coming out the other side. A new shell company 'buys' the company after the lawsuit and continues on. This may not be the case here, but could be or could be a combination of financing issues and the law suit.

The high interest loan is probably provided by some of the owners and goes back in their pockets.

These people didn't get rich by accident. Most of them anyway.
post #55 of 59
I had a ski day there in 2001 in conjunction with the NASJA annual meeting at Big Sky. http://webpages.charter.net/tcrocker818/yclbguid.htm As presented then, Yellowstone Club was not likely to have a problem growing slowly with new members, and then being self-sustaining.

In 2001 the Blixseths owned all 14,000 acres. Real estate and membership sales ($250K) were supposed to endow a maintenance fund, plus annual fees of $16K per member. They gave us some of the numbers then, and it seemed to pencil out at the time. It was a fairly obvious question for us journalists, 10-20 skiers/day on a mountain that size with 3 high speed lifts. Jon Reveal, in charge of mountain ops, thought he had an ample budget.

We now know the problem was the ill-fated decision to go in to debt to expand into other vacation properties. Then the divorce would have divided the assets.
post #56 of 59
post #57 of 59

Thanks for the link Martin.  That deal seems complex, but perhaps the simplest solution, eh? 

post #58 of 59

There's no way they can have 2200 skiiable acres. The place is only 1400 acres total, and a lot of that is taken up by winter mansions and condos (not to mention the Warren Miller Lodge, which is absolutely behemoth).

 

I've been there, and yes the skiing is good. The problem is that the place is run entirely by out-of-state folks who care little for the plight of the locals working for them. Between slashing benefits (while raising their prices) for employees, providing Sysco crap meals, favoring male employees over females (no promotions for females only males- it's true!), denying raises or bonuses for years while giving themselves trips to Las Vegas and overseas (they spent $14,000 on willow twigs for a member dinner, then told the employees there was not enough money for any kind of raise). The head of operations crashed his vehicle while drunk up there, then made all the security people sign a paper swearing not to tell the police.  They allow construction waste and the 'juice' from their garbage bay to run into their big pond, then tell the members its okay to swim and fish in it. Their animal control officer shot and killed a mama grizzly, orphaning her two cubs, because he didn't realize the shotgun was loaded with live rounds (Note this is his THIRD time doing something similar). Instead of giving the people working for them advancement opportunities, they have given one person the head job openings for four different departments: IT, Human Resources, Outdoor Activities, and Rental Shop (this person has never done a day of Human Resources work in her life, but she's a favorite tag-along of the managers). They purchase very little locally, most of their everyday stuff comes from out of state (their bottled water comes from NY and Canada, while we have water being bottled right here in Montana), the amounts of garbage they produce every day is staggering- not because of so many millionaires, but because of so many employees and what they do for the millionaires- and they don't recycle an ounce of it. The employees are treated like scum: not to be seen or heard, but you better be there to kiss a member's sweet wallet if they demand it.

 

I could go on. Don't be jealous of anything but their snow. They're basically a bunch of jerks squeezing the very unhappy employee group for all they can get. Be glad you're not one of their ilk.

 

PS They recently got sued by a former employee who they fired illegally. Not the first time they've done it, just the first time someone locally stood up to them for once. I'm glad he won- they'll be owing him a-plenty!


Edited by squenny - 7/7/11 at 4:06pm
post #59 of 59

I like Melissa.

 

Fine, I understand you might enjoy hatin' on YC, but there's plenty of resort groups worse than them.  

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: General Skiing Discussion
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › General Skiing Discussion › Yellowstone Club files for Bankruptcy