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Salomon Falcon-shell boots--recommended!

post #1 of 90
Thread Starter 
For those of you who have this anatomy: medium-narrow forefoot (98), narrow heel, low instep, I highly recommend you try one of the Falcon-shell line of boots (CS 90, Gun, Falcon 10, Falcon CS Pro, Falcon Race). These start at about a 90 flex and go up to 120. I'm notorious for being hard to fit (just ask Jeff Bergeron) and have gone from a Lange, to a Head, to a Krypton Pro, to a Fischer plug boot, and nothing has quite worked until now. Before this series, Salomon boots were generally too wide for me, but this new shell was new last year and is totally different. Really smooth flex and a feeling of being really planted down into the boot, close to the snow. Perfect fit anatomically in all the typical problem areas (6th toe, toe box, heel fit, etc.) Highly recommended!
post #2 of 90
I agree, although my instep isn't real low the boot still fits.
post #3 of 90
I own the 10, the Gun, and race plugs. Love all of them; my foot is also narrow in the heel/ankle but actually fairly wide across ball. Gun worked fine out of the box, 10's and (obviously) plugs required some minor shell work to dial in. Being lightish, best thing about the whole lot is the lateral stiffness/quickness combined with reasonable and progressive forward flex.
post #4 of 90
I have a similar foot, except for the instep, and the 10 & CS Pro were 2 of the boots Jeff recommended for me IF I was able to fit into a 29 shell (their max size). I wasn't, so this left me with the 98 mm lasted Lange & Rossi models to choose from.
post #5 of 90
I have Falcon 10s. I needed some work done in the forefoot--so worth it! I bought 'em because I can't stand the slightest bit of play in the heel/ankle. One quick session with my bootfitter....struck gold! The Impact 10 is also a good boot with a little extra forefoot width.
post #6 of 90
i, too, have falcon 10s and love em..skinny foot so they worked right out of the box...

fantastic heel and ankle hold...
post #7 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_m View Post
For those of you who have this anatomy: medium-narrow forefoot (98), narrow heel, low instep, I highly recommend you try one of the Falcon-shell line of boots (CS 90, Gun, Falcon 10, Falcon CS Pro, Falcon Race). . . . Really smooth flex and a feeling of being really planted down into the boot, close to the snow. Perfect fit anatomically in all the typical problem areas (6th toe, toe box, heel fit, etc.) Highly recommended!
I agree 100%. In addition to that foot anatomy, I'm a severe pronator, so a custom footbed is essential. I was concerned that there wouldn't be enough room for my 12-year-old Peterson's. Not a problem. They work perfectly with this boot.

They fit me so well that I made 3 mistakes applying my experience with other boots that didn't fit so perfectly:

#1 - I immediately adjusted the canting outward and moved the 2nd buckle higher over the instep. Didn't help. I put them back the way they were.

#2 - I had them hot-formed. Although they felt great after 4 days skiing on them, I thought that would make them better. It didn't. They have since reverted and I'm not going to hot-form them ever again.

#3 - Before doing a steep & tight tree run with some friends at the end of the day, I cranked the buckles up one notch. Big mistake. My right instep and big toe were numb for the last 6 weeks of the season. These don't have to hurt to be tight enough (old beliefs die hard!).
post #8 of 90
hot forming a salomon liner doesnt really do all that much...you would break them in more skiing on them for 1 day than you would heating them...not sure what you mean about them "reverting"..
post #9 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by broad View Post
hot forming a salomon liner doesnt really do all that much...you would break them in more skiing on them for 1 day than you would heating them...not sure what you mean about them "reverting"..
Having gone through it, I'd have to agree. But note that page 51 of the 2007-2008 Salomon Shop Practices Manual indicates that there are 2 thermoformable zones; page 52 shows how it's done.

By "reverted" I meant that they eventually went back to the way they were, if not better. I guess they broke in as they would have anyway. Bottom line: don't thermoform!
post #10 of 90
im still not following..

most boots have 2 thermoformable zones...around the ankle and the tongue..salomon is no different..anyone interested in seeing what the boot will fit like after break in (ie customers who doubt the fact that the boot will get considerably larger inside) is a candidate for thermoforming. its also great for more demanding customers who are looking for some sort of value added service...for a lot of people though its just a waste of 20 mins..

the point i was making is that by skiiing a day on them you break them in more permanently than heating them in a store. if you skiied 4 days on a liner and then molded it after i would be surprised if there was any real change whatsoever to it....as much as you might think heat molding them does anything its really a negligible process..

also liners wont really "revert"..once a liner has started to compress and break in itll generally only get roomier inside, not smaller and less broken in again...

id also be concerned about your toe and instep being numb for 6 weeks from one run with a buckle done up one notch too tight...that leads me to believe that there is something seriously wrong with the way your boots fit you...
post #11 of 90

Falcon 10 Boot

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_m View Post
For those of you who have this anatomy: medium-narrow forefoot (98), narrow heel, low instep, I highly recommend you try one of the Falcon-shell line of boots (CS 90, Gun, Falcon 10, Falcon CS Pro, Falcon Race). These start at about a 90 flex and go up to 120. I'm notorious for being hard to fit (just ask Jeff Bergeron) and have gone from a Lange, to a Head, to a Krypton Pro, to a Fischer plug boot, and nothing has quite worked until now. Before this series, Salomon boots were generally too wide for me, but this new shell was new last year and is totally different. Really smooth flex and a feeling of being really planted down into the boot, close to the snow. Perfect fit anatomically in all the typical problem areas (6th toe, toe box, heel fit, etc.) Highly recommended!
I have been in the Falcon 10 for 2 seasons now-it fits my wide forefoot,narrow heel quite well.

I have found that it has packed out quite a bit and I am glad that I did not get the shell punched as per usual-I have the 6th toe syndrome, but the fit is pretty good now without the punch.

The shell does seem to hit pretty high on the calf (wish it was not as tall a profile) and the none replaceable soles are a drag as well.

Other than that it has been a good boot-I love how light and simple the design is.
post #12 of 90
Have to agree with the OP. I've also been in the Falcon 10's for 2 seasons and they are the first boot to ever fit my ultra-low instep like it's been shrink wrapped. Wow - what a boot.

OTOH last year a ski buddy of mine with EE width high instep feet bought a pair of the 10's. I told him he was crazy and would regret it. He loves them! 'Splain that to me
post #13 of 90
Hi,

These boots fit me well and I may buy a pair.

How much flex is ideal in the store.

I tried on the Falcon and was blown away by the fit and feel around my feet, ankles and lower leg.
They indicated I could remove two screws and make them softer flexing. The Salomon web site says the same thing.

Do the boots flex more when you ski them versus the flex in the shop when you try them on and flex forward?

Is flex due to skiier weight or, terrain and snow conditions and skier style or skill?

Rob
post #14 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by robmitchell View Post
Hi,
I tried on the Falcon and was blown away by the fit and feel around my feet, ankles and lower leg.
They indicated I could remove two screws and make them softer flexing. The Salomon web site says the same thing.

Do the boots flex more when you ski them versus the flex in the shop when you try them on and flex forward?
My experience is that you can't really tell how boots will really flex based on how they feel in the store (where they are warm and softer, and not experiencing the same dynamics as that during skiing). Therefore, as a guide, you should determine what flex rating works best for you (even though this rating is not very consistent between manufacturers - my old Rossi's with a 90 flex rating were slightly stiffer than the Falcon 10's with a rating of 110).

Since you may not know what flex rating is best for you here's my $0.02. If you don't weigh a lot (under say 140lbs) and/or are not a hard-charger there's a chance that the Falcon 10's will be too stiff for you, they were for me (I weigh 130lbs.)....

The good news is that I removed the cuff screws (as you noted above) and they are now PERFECT! I had to special order the plastic plugs for covering the screw holes (they didn't come with the boots contrary to what the boot's user's guide said), but my ski shop did this at no charge.

I hope this helps!
post #15 of 90
Just bought some CS Pros entirely based on everyone's here recommendation. No, not really.

They're still too wide for my feet - especially the front half, but I couldn't take another year in my ancient Langes that put pressure on my surgically repaired ankle.

I wish this boot came in a 95 mm version, as the overall shape is the closest to fitting my foot uniformly.

What's that black front cuff attachment for (comes loose in the box for optional installation)?

AM.
post #16 of 90
I have the Pro Model Gun Spaceframe from the year before the Falcon. It's also a 98mm boot. Can anyone offer any insight as to the difference?
post #17 of 90
the gun is a falcon shell with a 95 flex rating and a rubber bootboard
post #18 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by broad View Post
the gun is a falcon shell with a 95 flex rating and a rubber bootboard
and has a lot of those honeycomb cutouts-but you are right, the shells look very close in pictures

But I am wondering why they got rid of the cut outs-also Falcon 10 riders, am I the only one to see a fair amount of packing out after 50 days, thin liner or not?

The fit over my high instep used to be very painful-with the buckle in the loosest position-now I crank it down to the last stop on the first position with the micros/or first pos on the second stop-also the toe buckle I find needs to be cranked down quite a bit, compared to the old days

Still, a very good performing and fairly comfy out of box fit (still use my Surefoot beds from my old boots, cause I'm cheap))

This boot works quite well with my Mantras BTW
post #19 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski-ra View Post
My experience is that you can't really tell how boots will really flex based on how they feel in the store (where they are warm and softer, and not experiencing the same dynamics as that during skiing). Therefore, as a guide, you should determine what flex rating works best for you (even though this rating is not very consistent between manufacturers - my old Rossi's with a 90 flex rating were slightly stiffer than the Falcon 10's with a rating of 110).

Since you may not know what flex rating is best for you here's my $0.02. If you don't weigh a lot (under say 140lbs) and/or are not a hard-charger there's a chance that the Falcon 10's will be too stiff for you, they were for me (I weigh 130lbs.)....

The good news is that I removed the cuff screws (as you noted above) and they are now PERFECT! I had to special order the plastic plugs for covering the screw holes (they didn't come with the boots contrary to what the boot's user's guide said), but my ski shop did this at no charge.

I hope this helps!
Also I would have to add if you are short like me 5'6", the Falcons may be a bit tall-mine hit me pretty far up on the calf compared to my old Rossi race ones-and this I don't care for-my ankles feel too locked in at times
post #20 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by cal to colorado View Post
...also Falcon 10 riders, am I the only one to see a fair amount of packing out after 50 days, thin liner or not?...
I got about 50 days on them and they still feel like they're shrink-wrapped to my feet (with the instep buckle in the loosest position).

Quote:
Originally Posted by cal to colorado View Post
Also I would have to add if you are short like me 5'6", the Falcons may be a bit tall-mine hit me pretty far up on the calf compared to my old Rossi race ones-and this I don't care for-my ankles feel too locked in at times
Hmm..., I'm 5'5" with real short legs so it must be an anatomy thing because I like the height (not that they seem higher than any other boot I've recently owned and, funny thing, my previous boots were Rossi Race 2's). As they say YMMV.... Take Care!
post #21 of 90
Quote:
Pro Model Gun Spaceframe
you know what...i totally wasnt paying attention when i read that...i for some reason was talking about the difference between the falcon 10 and falcon gun...

nevermind me!!

haha
post #22 of 90
Been wearing my new CS Pros for spells sitting here at the desk. After about 20 minutes, my feet start going numb. I've read a few other posts where others encountered the same sensation. I assume this will subside after a day or two of skiing?

The strange part is that I cannot pinpoint any specific area that is too tight. The boot feels like it just fits my foot uniformly everywhere (Yeaaaaaa!)

This is sounding more and more like an excuse to skip work and drive up to Copper Mountain on Thursday

AM.
post #23 of 90
Quote:
sitting here at the desk.
thats your problem right there ^^
post #24 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski-ra View Post
I got about 50 days on them and they still feel like they're shrink-wrapped to my feet (with the instep buckle in the loosest position).



Hmm..., I'm 5'5" with real short legs so it must be an anatomy thing because I like the height (not that they seem higher than any other boot I've recently owned and, funny thing, my previous boots were Rossi Race 2's). As they say YMMV.... Take Care!
Maybe it is just a skiing style thing-. I measured the boots and the Falcon is a good 1/2" higher in the back than the Rossis. Makes it tougher for me to initiate a turn (using ankles and feet)-but the Falcons do ski very smoothly don't get me wrong

Just 2 weeks before the local mountain opens here in MT. Have a good season!
post #25 of 90
Been following this thread with some interest. Was in a local shop picking up a few items and shooting the breeze and out of idle curiosity tried on a pair of Falcon CS. It was the only Falcon that was in stock in my size.

I was extremely impressed with the fit, (more so than anything I’ve ever tried on before,) and could only speculate how well they’d feel when I dropped in my footbeds. Got me thinking seriously about retiring my Techinca Icons.

Only concern that I had with the CS was that their flex seemed very soft. I know, I know, I was in a shop on an 85-degree day. Just to compare the flex, my buddy the shop guru threw me a pair of Falcon 10’s one shell size too large for me though, and the difference was tremendous. 10’s are probably too stiff for me out of the box, but aforementioned rivet removal might be just the ticket. Soli web-site states that the CS Pro is even stiffer, so I’ll probably have to rule it out.

I do like the idea of the cs shell, as the only shell work I’ve had done have been a few punches and grinds. Insto-shell-forming does sound appealing, but initial fit felt superb. Have any Bears skied in the CS? Anyone have impressions to share that might sway me to consider them vs. the 10’s?

I’m 50 year old, fit but balding guy, 6’ 155 lbs. Don’t race or huck, (aside from dropping-in off a modest cornice.) Ski most terrain with confidence and good speed. Concerned that I might be able to overpower the CS’s, something I’ve never come close to doing with the Icons. Otherwise, were I to put my footbeds in the pair I tried on yesterday, they might call me “Daddy.”
post #26 of 90
falcon pro cs and falcon 10 are the same boot, minus the CS zones

same flex

having done about 12 pairs or so of both cs and cs pro so far this year, id advise you to avoid the falcon cs...the liner in it is crap. feels like the liner from a junior boot to me..get the cs pro and soften it if you need to...pull the rivets or alter the shell a bit...
post #27 of 90
If I wasn't in a Krypton, this would be the first boot I would go after. Out of the box it fits quite well. I will try to get on it some time this winter.
post #28 of 90
Thread Starter 
The Falcon line (CS 90, Gun, Falcon 10, Falcon CS Pro, Falcon Race) move from up from a 90 flex to 130. The fit is pretty much the same. Try several models until you find the one with the stiffness you like. You probably won't need to modify if you pick the right one.
post #29 of 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by broad View Post



having done about 12 pairs or so of both cs and cs pro so far this year, id advise you to avoid the falcon cs...the liner in it is crap. feels like the liner from a junior boot to me..get the cs pro and soften it if you need to...pull the rivets or alter the shell a bit...

If you want the forefoot area wider than just the heat and clamp method that is used for the CS shell how would you do it?
post #30 of 90
Quote:
Try several models until you find the one with the stiffness you like. You probably won't need to modify if you pick the right one.
while i would agree with you that the fit is more or less the same, there are huge differences in the liners between all these boots...the gun/10/cs pro and race all have the 3 density foam liner...much firmer feel, much better ankle pockets, much better heel hold, much firmer fit all over. as i mentioned, its been my experience (both trying them all on myself and forming several over the last several months) that the gun/10/cs pro/race liner is immeasurably superior to that of the cs...unless price is the deal-breaking issue i would always encourage a reasonably competent skier whos a little on the lighter side to go to the cs pro or 10 and soften the shell a bit. the liners improvement is so great that i would say itd be well worth the time spent...

Quote:
If you want the forefoot area wider than just the heat and clamp method that is used for the CS shell how would you do it?
are you talking about punching the cs boot? you can totally do it...at the canadian product launch we tried to break the CS zone out of the rest of the shell..we almost got it, but theres no way you could do it under normal use...im a 200 lb. plus guy and i was hammering on the press trying to break it and couldnt. we actually punched a golf ball size punch on the CS zone without any serious ill effects.
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