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Questions on mid-fats for New England skier

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
Hello,

I am new to the forums and just bumped into this great collection of information. I am looking to buy new skis this Winter and I am trying to wade through a lot of the literature and reviews. I have been chatting with Jared at SierraSkis.com and he had a lot of good input already.

I am a 37 year old male, 5'10" 165lbs. I am very fit, an advanced skier, and live upstate NY. Most of the skiing I do is in Vermont, a couple of weekends a year in Tuckerman's Ravine, and one or two trips to Colorado a season to ski at places like A-basin, Breck, and the likes. If I had to pick my favorite resort where I have skied, it would have to be A-basin. I love the combination of steep wide open terrain, the technical descents on the East wall, and the tree runs in the Alleys.

At every resort I have skied I can tackle any inbound run groomed or not. I am not the prettiest looking skier on the mountain but I get down most terrain that doesn't involve over 5 ft of mandatory air. Bumps are my weakness, I don't particularly look for big bump runs but here on the East Coast and in Colorado they are a fact of life.

I typically get between 10 and 20 days of skiing a season, depending on the year. For the past five seasons I have been skiing Volkl G3 Energy (170cm) skis with Diamir Fritschi Freeride bindings and I have decided that it is finally time to break into the 21st century ski gear. I use alpine ski boots most of the time (Salomon Falcon 9) unless skinning up is involved.

I have been reading up on and fondling mid-fats and am trying to figure out which would be a good choice for me.

Here is a short list of skis I have put together:

Atomic Snoop Daddy
Line Prophet 90
Line Prophet 100
Scott USA Mission
Scott USA Crusade
Volkl Bridge

Some of the specific questions I have are:

1) Performance on soft and hard snow
2) Performance in short and medium turns
3) Stability at speed in choppy conditions
4) Specifically regarding the Prophet 90 and 100, the Line website reports that the turn radius at the same length of the P100 is smaller by a little bit than the P90. Also, the weight of the P100 is reported lower than the P90. Is this a mistake? I would have expected the P100 to want to run straighter with more stability than the P90 ...

Thank you for any insight you might be able to provide!

Cheers,

Luca
post #2 of 20
Thread Starter 
One more thing ... anyone out there in my size (5'10.5" 165lbs) skiing the 172cm Prophet 90? I am leaning towards the shorter size to keep them a little more maneuverable but I wouldn't want to make them too twitchy.
post #3 of 20
I am a bit smaller than you, (about 5'7 155) and I have Prophet 100's in a 172. I feel like they are too short, and if I had to buy them I would get the 179 without even thinking about it. You may also want to consider the Movement Thunder, although it may be a bit stiff for what you want, they are certainly stable through crud!
post #4 of 20
Twips tend to ski short because...uhhhh....welllll, they ARE short (or at least the running surface is). Hence in most of the models, you mention, like the P-90, a 172 would be a tad tooooo short. Of course the bennie you get from that is additonal manuverability. The price you pay is that you get less stability.

The P-90 and Bridge are very good skis with differing personalities due to the shape and flex. The Bridge has a firm tail and is an all mountain flex with a big taper tip-tail. The Prophet is softer in the tail and has less taper so it is a little closer to a park shape and flex than the Bridge is. Grip is similar.

SJ
post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SierraJim View Post
The P-90 and Bridge are very good skis with differing personalities due to the shape and flex. The Bridge has a firm tail and is an all mountain flex with a big taper tip-tail. The Prophet is softer in the tail and has less taper so it is a little closer to a park shape and flex than the Bridge is. Grip is similar.
SJ: Could you elaborate on the effect of the different tip-tail taper geometry and flex on the snow? I haven't bought skis for a while and am not sure I get the nuances you are referring to.

The Movement Thunder looks like a great ski. There are no Movement dealers near where I live but I might be able to find one in Burlington, VT.

Another ski that I have been looking at is the Armada ARV in 175cm, it seems like it would split the difference between the 172 and 179 P90.
post #6 of 20
First, don't buy a ski just because it comes in a length that sounds good. The personality of the ski is more important than a few cm either way in length. I'm 190# so I've got some weight on you but almost every twip that I like, I prefer in the mid 180's (184-185)

Taper refers to the difference between the tip and tail in width. generally more taper (Bridge) will allow a ski to break free from the carve more easily and feel more "slithery" (technical term) in conditions like moguls for example.

An all mountain flex (Bridge) is going to be balanced or somewhat softer in the tip. The stiffer tail of the all mountain flex allows the ski to maintain the load near the end of the turn and finish the turn better without washing out. (keep in mind that this is not something that twips are great at anyway)

A more park oriented flex is going to give up a little tail stiffness in return for more forgiving feel in switch landings etc.

It may sound as if I like the Bridge better than the Prophet and actually in my own case, I don't. Both are good skis and I like both about the same. However, if you are going to have a ~~90mm twip as a New England ski, I would choose the Bridge. Out west it wouldn't matter as much.

SJ
post #7 of 20
No Heads??? How about some 88s? They seem to be a very ideal ski for east coast slop, while still being able to carve like the best of them. Its a one ski quiver pair.
post #8 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
No Heads??? How about some 88s? They seem to be a very ideal ski for east coast slop, while still being able to carve like the best of them. Its a one ski quiver pair.
Reasonable answer to a question the OP was not asking.

SJ
post #9 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by SierraJim View Post
Reasonable answer to a question the OP was not asking.

SJ
Just trying to be helpful.

post #10 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
No Heads??? How about some 88s? They seem to be a very ideal ski for east coast slop, while still being able to carve like the best of them. Its a one ski quiver pair.
Tell me more about them ... why do you like them?
post #11 of 20
Taking advice from a guy that skis 5 days a year at Flatton, Okemo and Mt Snow and hasn't tried anything else but likes the colors so every post is about Heads .

Check out the review of this years topsheet elsewhere.
post #12 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucaM View Post
Tell me more about them ... why do you like them?
Well I like them enough to have bought them. I bought them based on what I have read about them.

I have read many, many reviews of these ski and they seem to be exactly what I needed, which is basically what you are looking for. Do a search here for the Head monster 88's, there are several tests on them.
post #13 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by snofun3 View Post
Taking advice from a guy that skis 5 days a year at Flatton, Okemo and Mt Snow and hasn't tried anything else but likes the colors so every post is about Heads .

Check out the review of this years topsheet elsewhere.
Hey dumb, dumb, I have tried many other skis (Atomics, Rossis, Salomons, Dynastar, Elan, Hart).....guess what? I like Heads better (Atomics close second).
post #14 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucaM View Post
Tell me more about them ... why do you like them?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
Well I like them enough to have bought them...
Umm, he asked WHY you like them... not HOW MUCH you like them. What did you read that you liked? Have you skied them? What did you like about them? What did they do differently than all the other 90ish skis you demo'd? (Atomic, Rossi, Salomon, Dynastar, etc. etc.)




Quote:
Originally Posted by LucaM View Post
The Movement Thunder looks like a great ski. There are no Movement dealers near where I live but I might be able to find one in Burlington, VT.
The Ski Rack in Burlington sells (AND DEMOS!) movement skis, so does First Trax in Montgomery (although I'm not sure if Donny demos them or not...) Also, I believe that EMS is carrying Movement skis this year too, so even if your local shop doesn't have any they could probably order them for you.
post #15 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
Hey dumb, dumb, I have tried many other skis (Atomics, Rossis, Salomons, Dynastar, Elan, Hart).....guess what? I like Heads better (Atomics close second).
"(Atomics close second)". Gawd.

I needed to torque your nuts about Heads since that is the only thing you know to suggest, even if it's only by reading reviews, but Atomic!!?? Now I know you're kidding.

Well, I suppose they do have nice colors too (a topsheet review coming?), or were you reading 3 year old reviews about Metrons when they were cool.

Head, then Atomic . I need a laugh - what's your number 3?
post #16 of 20
I only tried Atomic's race skis. But yeah I happen to like Atomic's colors too. My point was that I have not only skied on Head's, not that I have tried every 90ish ski around. But that being said the Head skis that I have tried thus far have all been fantastic...better than their comparables in other brands. They inspire confidence with their stability and edge hold. You can go fast and do so without getting tossed around like a puppet. I wouldn't say that they are forgiving, but if you like to attack a run, they are the perfect weapons. Now I acquired the 88s because along with the usual features that I have come to expect from Heads, I also get enough width and heft to blast through crud and float through the powder we get here in the East while still being ready for the inevitable ice patches and groomers.
post #17 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
I only tried Atomic's race skis. But yeah I happen to like Atomic's colors too. My point was that I have not only skied on Head's, not that I have tried every 90ish ski around. But that being said the Head skis that I have tried thus far have all been fantastic...better than their comparables in other brands. They inspire confidence with their stability and edge hold. You can go fast and do so without getting tossed around like a puppet. I wouldn't say that they are forgiving, but if you like to attack a run, they are the perfect weapons. Now I acquired the 88s because along with the usual features that I have come to expect from Heads, I also get enough width and heft to blast through crud and float through the powder we get here in the East while still being ready for the inevitable ice patches and groomers.
Just fyi - I've been on Heads too. I think they're good - sometimes excellent, and I also live in the East (but try not to ski here - life's too short).

While I'm a Dynastar fanatic, I also like and recommend other things, notably the Nordica series, and some of the Volkls. In their class(es) they (in my opinion) are often better than Heads, particularly the Monster series.
post #18 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucaM View Post
Hello,

I am new to the forums and just bumped into this great collection of information. I am looking to buy new skis this Winter and I am trying to wade through a lot of the literature and reviews. I have been chatting with Jared at SierraSkis.com and he had a lot of good input already.

I am a 37 year old male, 5'10" 165lbs. I am very fit, an advanced skier, and live upstate NY. Most of the skiing I do is in Vermont, a couple of weekends a year in Tuckerman's Ravine, and one or two trips to Colorado a season to ski at places like A-basin, Breck, and the likes. If I had to pick my favorite resort where I have skied, it would have to be A-basin. I love the combination of steep wide open terrain, the technical descents on the East wall, and the tree runs in the Alleys.

At every resort I have skied I can tackle any inbound run groomed or not. I am not the prettiest looking skier on the mountain but I get down most terrain that doesn't involve over 5 ft of mandatory air. Bumps are my weakness, I don't particularly look for big bump runs but here on the East Coast and in Colorado they are a fact of life.

I typically get between 10 and 20 days of skiing a season, depending on the year. For the past five seasons I have been skiing Volkl G3 Energy (170cm) skis with Diamir Fritschi Freeride bindings and I have decided that it is finally time to break into the 21st century ski gear. I use alpine ski boots most of the time (Salomon Falcon 9) unless skinning up is involved.

I have been reading up on and fondling mid-fats and am trying to figure out which would be a good choice for me.

Here is a short list of skis I have put together:

Atomic Snoop Daddy
Line Prophet 90
Line Prophet 100
Scott USA Mission
Scott USA Crusade
Volkl Bridge

Some of the specific questions I have are:

1) Performance on soft and hard snow
2) Performance in short and medium turns
3) Stability at speed in choppy conditions
4) Specifically regarding the Prophet 90 and 100, the Line website reports that the turn radius at the same length of the P100 is smaller by a little bit than the P90. Also, the weight of the P100 is reported lower than the P90. Is this a mistake? I would have expected the P100 to want to run straighter with more stability than the P90 ...

Thank you for any insight you might be able to provide!

Cheers,

Luca
A pair of 175cm Head IM88's with Marker Dukes would be an excellent all around setup for someone who hikes a bit, east or west. They are very good at all the things you are asking about.

I'm a bit bigger than you, and the 186 im88 has been my primary all around EC ski for the last 3 years, and will be again this year....trees, bumps, powder, carving ice, funky snow...they are good in virtually everything, and are a great performing, high-end race construction ski. Only problem has been breaking them, but the warranty is very good - Head will warranty any breakage resulting from normal freeride use.

The Dukes are a great choice if you need an alpine binding that will see a bit of touring use. If you ski a lower din, it might also be worth checking out the Baron for less weight and a lower price.
post #19 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by snofun3 View Post
Just fyi - I've been on Heads too. I think they're good - sometimes excellent, and I also live in the East (but try not to ski here - life's too short)..
Just curious, how many days will you ski "Not on the East Coast" this year?
post #20 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayPowHound View Post
Umm, he asked WHY you like them... not HOW MUCH you like them. What did you read that you liked? Have you skied them? What did you like about them? What did they do differently than all the other 90ish skis you demo'd? (Atomic, Rossi, Salomon, Dynastar, etc. etc.)






The Ski Rack in Burlington sells (AND DEMOS!) movement skis, so does First Trax in Montgomery (although I'm not sure if Donny demos them or not...) Also, I believe that EMS is carrying Movement skis this year too, so even if your local shop doesn't have any they could probably order them for you.
First Trax does not look to have any demo's this season. But SkiRack certainly does. Yes EMS is carrying Movement this season.

Slowly but surely we are getting them into more shops on the east coast.
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