or Connect
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › "I'm self righteous and condescending, bow before me!!!"
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

"I'm self righteous and condescending, bow before me!!!" - Page 2

post #31 of 97
If I were in the east after an ice storm, I would want a 65mm wide ice skate. And I wouldn't be stoked on skiing anything else. And if I were planning to go out and ski bumps all day, I would probably want to be on something like my old K2 Mods.

My quiver seems to grow every season. In general the ski I choose has lot more to do with what I want to do that day. Having a quiver is about making choices. Some people just go out and ski, and having a small quiver makes that easier. I sort of like having some different tools to work with. But I don't plan on dragging the whole quiver across the country with me. Thats just crazy.
post #32 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyond View Post
Couldn't do it with two. Maybe four. Comes from living on the icy coast and increasingly into schizophrenic pleasures: racing or trees back here; powder, trees, and BC anywhere else. Maggot, curious if your lightweight peak bagger has to be a classic AT climbing ski, 75-80 mm etc, or is this just about weight and if so, have you ever considered DPS or BD to do that plus take care of your BC needs? The modern bullet noses with front rocker seem better equiped to not load with snow on approaches. But I'm newish at OB, using beaten old Mantras, so could be totally missing several points...
Me too, it takes four pair to cover what I think I need:
195 Praxis Powders for da deep stuff
191 Movement Goliaths for bombing 6+ inches in the resort
187 Movement Thunders for bluebird to 6 inches of fresh
179 Nordica Nitrous early season and bumps
post #33 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by volantaddict View Post
Agreed.



What "will do" is subjective, as is what is a "hassle", some revel in complexity and some in simplicity. These statements are a projection of your values as being objective truth, and as such, are dismissive of the values of others, hence self righteous and condescending.



Um, so what? So a smaller quiver works better for you, what does that have to do with the price of tea in China, or what someone else finds useful?



I do live at the bottom of the hill, and having a dozen or more pairs makes perfect sense for me. I didn't start with a bunch of skis, I had one pair, and it didn't suffice, so i added more.

Oh, and I think I probably know more about living with less than you do, having lived out of a backpack and slept on the ground for years. These days however, I feel quite pleased with my collection of sticks. Why do you need to suggest there is something wrong with that?



I had an epic season without leaving Missoula last year, I will do the same this season, weather permitting.

Again, if you were really content with your decision to have less, you wouldn't feel the need to try to disprove the value of the choices others make, it smacks of envy. I'm sure many find you to be an easy going guy, and you probably see yourself that way too, but to me you read as passive aggressive, dissatisfied, and seeking to justify a choice you are not fully in alignment with.

Anyway, if you make it to Montana with your two pair quiver during your epic travels, I'd be glad to show you around our mountain and buy you a cold one apres.
I must have my definitions of "self-righteous" and "condescending" all screwed up because those are the very words that sprung to mind after reading this response.

Also, I refer y'all to the title of the thread: "I"m Self-Righteous and Condescending..." One really shouldn't expect any less from me given the subject matter, right?

I guess I should insert an emoticon, but I always hate those things.

At any rate, of course my observations are subjective. How could they not be? They are my observations based on my experiences. The people I ski with tend to only have 2 pairs of skis in their quivers. The people I ski with are all excellent skiers (at least in my humble opinion, but several of them are ex-racers, patrolers, and in some cases instructors). I'm not bragging about the company I keep, it's just that when you connect with people on the boards (either Epic, TGR or wherever) and you travel outside your home hills you tend to bump into some interesting characters. I've had the good fortune to click with some of these folks and they have afforded me the opportunity to share turns with and learn from the. When the bulk of these characters are only using a finite number of tools and they're still killing it on the slopes one has to wonder about the necessity of more tools when 1 or 2 seem to be doing the job quite nicely. My 2-Quiver buddies tend to either have a ski in the 72-78 range and then another in the 80-95 range OR something in the 90-100 range and then another in the 115 - 130 range (most likely reverse camber). And yes, a lot of this is going to change depending on where you ride predominantly and how often. But for those of us in Cali and Utah, Colorado, Wyoming, I would say that you can easily get by with a 2 quiver set-up.

Hey, if you want/need/enjoy having 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 skis in your quiver, that's cool. I've just come to the conclusion after 2 years of having a 5 ski quiver that I don't really need more than my 99 waisted "every day" ski and my 125 waisted reverse camber powder ski.

I'm begining to get a sense that a lot of my condescending and self-righteous tone might be perceived as envy, but it's not. If i can afford a 7 ski quiver, but choose not to have one, what do i need to be envious about? Personally I find the whole "look at my quiver" or quiver appreciation thread mentality to be kind of ridiculous and show boaty. I'm not a huge fan of the whole "I've got more toys than you" mentality. At the end of the day it just means you have more toys than me, which really means what? Sure it's fun to talk about gear and share information, but when it turns into a competetion over who has the most stuff, it really detracts from the ultimate reason that we're all here in the first place: the art and act of skiing.

i think i'm done ranting. this isn't healthy in the least (and in and of itself it's quite ridiculous).

i'm a fan of the less is more approach to quivers after having been a proponent of the more is more approach. that's all there is to it. and it's all based on me, where i ski, and whom i ski with. beyond that everything else is moot.

i'm off to find more people to bow down before my greatness now.
post #34 of 97
Other than the times I crash and burn I generally have ONLY a two ski quiver. One on the left the other on the right.
post #35 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by tromano View Post
If I were in the east after an ice storm, I would want a 65mm wide ice skate. And I wouldn't be stoked on skiing anything else.
Man, I don't think I'd be stoked skiing after an ice storm no matter what was on my feet.
post #36 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer View Post
Man, I don't think I'd be stoked skiing after an ice storm no matter what was on my feet.
Why not? There is something amusing about skiing pitches and watching the snowmaking crew fail to climb them on their sleds.

Besides, most times the snow is really grippy hero ice crystals after freezing rain. Rock hard spring refreeze is more antistoke for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey
you can easily get by with a 2 quiver set-up
If you don't ever do anything else outside of your realm. Are the park people supposed to use their floppy noodle center mounted twins as one of their two pair? Are people that take skiing moguls seriously supposed to ski a 90mm bump ski, or are they supposed to use a real bump ski and then turn their other pair into some kludge for everything from rock hard days to blower days? Is the guy that wants to ski in a beer league supposed to show with a ski 3cm too wide just to stay pure?

It is good that you are coming round to realizing you don't need a billion pair of skis to be happy, but don't go off the deep end to prove a point.
post #37 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer View Post
Man, I don't think I'd be stoked skiing after an ice storm no matter what was on my feet.
I was skiing in the mid atlantic until last year so I guess I have practice being stoked for marginal conditions. Full on ice can be fun. Specially on the right skis. Definitely better than sitting around at home. But falling hurts, alot.
post #38 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey67 View Post
Hey, if you want/need/enjoy having 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 skis in your quiver, that's cool. I've just come to the conclusion after 2 years of having a 5 ski quiver that I don't really need more than my 99 waisted "every day" ski and my 125 waisted reverse camber powder ski.
Dookey, I think you made your point, and it is a good general rule. Places I have skied in UT, 2 skis is all you really need for the majority of ski season. Specially if you just go out and ski around casually and that's it.

But there are exceptions... If you want to focus on technique, teaching, or competing at some level (GS, SL, bumps, park) those all require gear that is fairly specific to be able to work at a high level. And also there is the touring and BC aspect which may or may not fit in well with the 2 ski quiver. Dukes sort of give a person some additional flexibility, but depending on how into it you get you still might want a separate touring setup. So it really depends on what you want to do in your skiing.
post #39 of 97
I didn't sense Dookey claiming that his way was the "only way" or that anyone else's choices were wrong. The whole point of an internet board is dialogue and expressing an opinion. I didn't read it the way VolantAddict did. Sure its an opinion and sure its based on his subjective view of the world but he was very matter-of-fact about what works for him. Maybe he's working out his point of view by writing about it...whatever..it doesn't matter. If someone else has a different view, then they can just respectfully disagree and that's that...happy day everyone.

No one has a monopoly on the "truth" here...not Dookey..not me...not Tromano..etc..etc....etc...we're all just kind of figuring out what works for each of us.

To that end, I've decided to have a 1 ski quiver with the skis that Liberty is going to make that are 200mm at the waist...I'll using them for carving and bumping exclusively...
post #40 of 97
Dookey you are a funny man!!!
post #41 of 97
Thread Starter 
I do my best, I do my best.


That said, I went to Mammy a couple of weekends ago. Took along 3 pairs of skis, mostly because a buddy with the same boot size wanted to try my semi-retired AK No Ka Ois and King Salmons.

They never left the truck as I rode my Libbys all day with no problemo. I'm really beginning to dig Magnetraction and am coming to believe the (still largely ignored amongst skiers as snowboards have been reaping its benefits for years) hype surrounding it.
post #42 of 97
Dookey, since you're popping in for a visit. Can I ask you a question about a snowboard I bought for a girl.
Its a gnu, and it has the same technology that your lib techs have.
What, if anything, do you know about gnu?
post #43 of 97
My first and only quiver from 7-8 years ago and living in CA was a Fischer RC4 Aircarbon Ti for groomers (104-64-92) and the original Head Monster (117-85-107) as my fatty. It seemed HUGE at the time. I mostly just ended up skiing the Monster as my everyday ski.

Then I moved to KC and only get to CO a few days each year.

I just added the Watea 84 for this year. Hoping I can then get something 100+ for fun. It's funny that in 2001 an 85 waist was considered huge and meant for powder, and now I just bought an 84 waist as an everyday ski, and still wonder if I should have gone with the 94!
post #44 of 97
After reading this thread, I need to learn a little self-control too.
post #45 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trekchick View Post
Dookey, since you're popping in for a visit. Can I ask you a question about a snowboard I bought for a girl.
Its a gnu, and it has the same technology that your lib techs have.
What, if anything, do you know about gnu?
i have never been on a snowboard and don't know a soul who rides Gnu (or even Lib-Tech), so I have no answer for you.

i would suggest contacting Gnu or maybe getting on a snowboard forum and asking around.

i would presume that if it has "magnetraction" then it's made by Lib-Tech (i.e. is Gnu a subidiary of Lib-Tech)?

all i can say is that i am digging the skis and they seem to hold an edge as well as anything else i've ridden.

that and i have been seeing a grip of the new Banana boards on the slopes thus far this year, so it would appear that either Lib is doing a whiz-bang job of advertising/promoting or the boards have a loyal following.
post #46 of 97
Thanks Dookey.
I posted in the snowboard section here, where a couple of the guys had some good things to say.
I thought of you and a conversation we had about your lib techs.
Is there anything special to know about tuning equipment with magnetraction?
post #47 of 97
2 skis is about right, unless you work at a shop. If that is the case, then why not try them all? I only owned 1 pair of skis last year, but there were always demos around that I could try. 3 pair would cover 1) hard snow/groomers 2) everyday ski that can do things pretty well 3) wide ski for big dumps. This sounds about right to me (it is always fun to have a set of race skis laying around for #1, but some people are weenies and will only ski when it snows). For me, that is something 1) 65-80mm underfoot 2) 85-95mm underfoot 3) 110mm plus
post #48 of 97

Quiver

Read every post.

Screw you self righteous, condescenting AH's. I am not selling any of my 5 pairs of ski's so you can pick them up at bargain prices.

If good skiers have 2 pairs of skis-then with 5 pair I am 2 1/2 times better-now that math makes sense.

Saying l pair of skis is better than a quiver is like saying a glass of beer is better than a pitcher and no one believes that. If you show up at our Montana/IDAHO Bar with that self righteous condescending pompous attitude - you get NO beer.

WELL-unless you're Dookey anyone with a handle of Dookey is worth a beer just to hear the story.
post #49 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trekchick View Post
Thanks Dookey.
I posted in the snowboard section here, where a couple of the guys had some good things to say.
I thought of you and a conversation we had about your lib techs.
Is there anything special to know about tuning equipment with magnetraction?
haven't tuned either of my Libby's yet. rode my demo beaters the other weekend at Mammy and the did quite well on the firm, and that was after taking a beating on the granite and talus @ Saddlebag back in Sept.

One Ball Jay makes a tool, the "Magne-Tool" or "Magnetraction Edge Tool" that I am planning to purchase shortly.

Other'n that, the guy I bought my demos from tunes Libby's and says that the wavy edges "scare" most shops but that they're not much different to tune. He said that if a tech knew what they were doing they could run 'em through a machine even. i'm prolly gonna sport the $$ to have this guy do a serious tune on both my pairs and then learn how to do basic tunes on 'em myself. also if i end up taking them to a shop proper, i'll make sure they're a Libby dealer.
post #50 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey67 View Post
One Ball Jay makes a tool, the "Magne-Tool" or "Magnetraction Edge Tool" that I am planning to purchase shortly.

.

there just has to be a story behind 'ole One Ball Jay........
post #51 of 97
The local shop here carries the Lib Techs and said the wavy edge can still hold an edge while carving even if the edges haven't been tuned in a while. So if you play in the park and dull your edges down but then want to rip some groomers you'll still get some good bite.

Any truth to that?
post #52 of 97
Cangrats on kicking the addiction! I used to be a horrible gear whore. Now i'm in recovery. I really think that America likes us to be consumers and drives in that direction from birth. I used to always want new gear because it was new and different. Now I just get new when something wears out or something significantly better comes along. I now have a 2 ski quiver. 2 alpine, 2 tele, 1 snowboard, 1 skate ski, 1 rock ski... I guess thats more than 2, but only 1 or 2 in each catagory. One off shoot of my "new" attitude is that I no longer follow the industry as closely as I did when I spent more time in gear stores or reading gear reviews. I no can no longer identify skis or packs or whatever on sight and don't know all of the current industry jargon. This helps with the deprograming. Now if I could only stop wasting time on the internet.
post #53 of 97
I'm with Shannon Hoon on this one... "Three, Oh- It's the magic number! Yes it is!"...

Any more than that is awesome, but not really necessary IMHO...
post #54 of 97
I've moved up to three pair, and really it's only two pair. K2 Outlaws for powder days, K2 Recons for groomer days, and K2 XP's with a sharper bevel for rock and ice days. If someone gave me a pair of Auras for free, I'd use them on really deep powder days, but I don't have the funds to get skis for those rare two foot and more days and the Outlaws will do.
post #55 of 97
Thread Starter 
i'll "concede" to 3, but it all depends on where you ski and how good of a skier you are.

i guess my initial thrust on the subject is that there seems to be a lot of people out there trying to buy themselves a turn. while some equipment will definitely aid borderline skiers, ultimately it's how good you are that counts and not the equipment.

so, having like 20 pairs of skis, one for every conceivable condition change, is pretty ridiculous.

i think 3, at the most, is probably optimal, but then again it all depends on where you are riding.

i predominantly ride Tahoe, Colo, Utah, and Wyoming (with the odd venture to BC and Oregon) and over the past 3 seasons i've gone back to the same 2 skis over and over again: Lib Tech NAS Freeride @ 93/99mm in the waist and somewhat stiff and Spatulas (125mm in the waist and RC).

likewise the bulk of the folks I find myself skiing with, many of whom are far better skiers than myself, tend to rock 1-2 skis at the most. they are generally skiing something like a Bro (99mm waist) and then a fatter powder ski. Some of them even use the Bro for everything. And sure, they might have a beater rock/early season ski, but that gets shelved once the goods pile up.

again, my "self-righteousness" was primarily directed towards those who seem to have an obession with purchasing gear every season, even if they don't need it, and attempting to buy turns by having a ski for every possible snow condition.

my thoughts on the subject were based purely on my experience of having gone through 2 5-ski quivers over the past 3 seasons.

anyway, i'm rambling on repeat, but just wanted to say that i would give somebody 3, but more'n that seems redundant, obsessive, and excessive.

think about it, back in the day folks had one pair that they used for everything. hell, up until 2005 i only had 1 pair of skis, 198cm Rossi 7S's that i used for everything. granted once i broke the 20 days a year mark they became a little restrictive and that's when i began plundering the multi-ski quiver action.

i will admit that i still visit the shops and check out the new skis, but with each passing year there is less and less drive/temptation/need to jump in and purchase more skis.

i need to improve my riding and if i'm switching skis every several runs or changing my quiver ever year i feel like i'll be spending all my time re-learning the gear rather than actually enjoying the snow and improving my steeze, per se.
post #56 of 97
Dookey, if you had 20 wine bottles in your cooler, would they be 3 labels max?


I don't think you really credit the folks who, having quivers, take each one pair out as though it was the only skis they have on that day and enjoy them as much as they can wherever they happen to be fun (or not).

Picking a ski for the day is then just as much fun as picking a bottle to have with dinner.
post #57 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by dookey67 View Post
think about it, back in the day folks had one pair that they used for everything.
Don't worry, man, I've got your back.
Your pal, Pedro.

What's all the flibbledy-floop about 'shapes' and 'free-ride' and 'rocker' that the youngsters carry on about these days? Quivers were for racers or racer wannabes. There were exactly 3 variations on a theme. You had one pair of skis per discipline--sl, gs, and dh--and you loved it. If you didn't race, you figured out your general ski style, settled on a brand, and stuck with it. If you wiggled your ass a lot, you got slalom skis (probably VR17s). If you were constipated, you skied on Kneissl Red or White Stars. If you were a Presbyterian, you skied on Head Comps. Period.

Maybe, just maybe, if you lived in Utah you would have a pair of Rossi Haute Routes or Miller Softs for that pesky powder that they had out there. But that was the exception that proved the rule.

Seriously, skis are just so much mo' betta' today, and more specialized, and people have more scratch and free time (or at least they did until a few months ago...). I guess quivers are becoming the norm rather than the exception.

post #58 of 97
trim your eyebrows you freak!
post #59 of 97
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by comprex View Post
Dookey, if you had 20 wine bottles in your cooler, would they be 3 labels max?


I don't think you really credit the folks who, having quivers, take each one pair out as though it was the only skis they have on that day and enjoy them as much as they can wherever they happen to be fun (or not).

Picking a ski for the day is then just as much fun as picking a bottle to have with dinner.
interesting analogy, given that these days wine is more often equated as an alcholic beverage choice of the incredibly affluent.

even though i spent the formative years of my high school days in the Napa Valley and have quite a few friends in the wine industry, i've never been much for the grape. if/when i do indulge it's predominantly reds, preferably cabs and merlots, so even then i'd techically be a 2-varietal person.

but at the end of the day i'm mostly a beer gent and tend to stick to lagers and pilsners.

that said, i don't feel the wine analogy is terribly fitting since an educated wine drinker could possibly buy several cases of mixed varieties for the same price as 1 pair of skis.

also, being able to afford a slew of wines so that you can have a different bottle with every different meal is incredibly affluent and is a luxury and far from a necessity. much in the same way that a multi-ski quiver is a luxury and far from being a necessity.

the bottomline is that nobody needs 5 pairs of skis, just as nobody needs 20 bottles of different wines.

if you've got the money then certainly it's your prerogative to buy as much wine/skis as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that you don't really need 'em.

again, the main thrust of this thread was to point out that every season there's a vast amount of folks on these boards who post the inevitable "What quiver should I get this year" thread, when they just bought new skis the previous season. I've ridden with some of these folks and I can assure you that they're not hucking cliffs and destroying their skis. They appear, rather, to be obsessed with gear and finding that ski that's going to transform them into --insert name of professional, big name skier or your choice here--they seem to buy, sell, buy, sell and continually redefine their quiver once, twice, three times a season and then repeat the next year. Additionally, I'd be hard-pressed to learn that the bulk of these folks in question ski in excess of 100+ days a year. I know some 100+ folks and they ride the same equipment all season and maybe even a second season...they ride the planks until they die. The need to continually tweak, add to, and adjust one's quiver is pretty much not a need, but an addiction/obsession that having fallen victim to myself in the past, i can now see is kind of ridiculous. But that's just my opinion and first-hand observation. It's not fact (except to me) and not absolute (except to me).

So, in recap, i'm quite happy with 2 pairs of skis and a sixer of one brand of beer (another fallacy with the wine analogy is that often one's location and the availability of certain wines is a factor in what he/she drinks....for example, and i'mma flip back to beer instead of wine, if i'm in Germany the chances are far greater that i'll be drinking a classic light bodied lager or pilsner than if i were in Ireland and supping on Guinny.

anyway-hoo, now i'm just rambling because i just finished lunch.
post #60 of 97
Quote:
the bottomline is that nobody needs 5 pairs of skis, just as nobody needs 20 bottles of different wines.
By those terms the true bottom line is that nobody needs to ski or drink spoiled juice at all.

It is a leisure activity, and we're just discussing degrees and flavors of incredible affluence the moment we strap on something to ride or open something to drink.

Judge not the 5-pair quivers lest ye be judged for having one pair, ya know?



Quote:
again, the main thrust of this thread was to point out that every season there's a vast amount of folks on these boards who post the inevitable "What quiver should I get this year" thread, when they just bought new skis the previous season. I've ridden with some of these folks and I can assure you that they're not hucking cliffs and destroying their skis. They appear, rather, to be obsessed with gear and finding that ski that's going to transform them into --insert name of professional, big name skier or your choice here--they seem to buy, sell, buy, sell and continually redefine their quiver once, twice, three times a season and then repeat the next year.
Ah, but you have too look beyond the surface.

If you allow that "It will be good for such and such" can be mere rationalization so that the person can relive new ski excitement over and over, why not let them do that?

Quote:
(another fallacy with the wine analogy is that often one's location and the availability of certain wines is a factor in what he/she drinks....for example, and i'mma flip back to beer instead of wine, if i'm in Germany the chances are far greater that i'll be drinking a classic light bodied lager or pilsner than if i were in Ireland and supping on Guinny.
Doesn't ruin the analogy. You can meaningfully pick flavors of 90mm+ skis because you ski where you do, I can meaningfully pick flavors of 45mm+ skis because I ski where I do.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Ski Gear Discussion
EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › "I'm self righteous and condescending, bow before me!!!"