What, no hockey fans? - Page 58

If I were Lucic, I'd be watching my knees. That was a cheap, cheap shot on Miller. Not saying that a goalie out of the crease isn't fair game for some contact but the guy isn't expecting to get hit when he has easily played the puck clear of his position. Wasn't like there was a race to the puck and a scoring chance. 

This isn't like a kicker on the football field or a quarterback after an interception. The equipment is designed differently. In particular, the goalie's headgear is not designed to protect him against a high hit and the subsequent fall to the ice. The NHL has to take some kind of action on that one.

Edit---- I stand corrected. From SI.com:

Rule 42.1 on charging (Rule 47c in the old book) states, “A goalkeeper is not ‘fair game’ just because he is outside the goal crease area. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an opposing player makes unnecessary contact with a goalkeeper. However, incidental contact, at the discretion of the Referee, will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside his goal crease provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such contact.” 

Nothing? That's pretty amazing, and just plain wrong. 

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=601357&cmpid=nhl-rxl-twt

Every goalie in the league should be tomahawking this guy if he gets anywhere near the crease. Better get some pads for the backs of those calves, Milan...

Uh, yeah, sorry about that Giroux show last night. (Well, not really...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by crgildart 

The Pens had it rolling last night in the 3rd for sure!

I loved the post game interview w/Staal....when asked what they will do when Sid is back, considering all the success they are already having he said

"we'll find a spot for him somewhere" 

This could be quite a year for the boyz  

Colossal Flyers CHOKE last night.

Colossal AVS Choke!

Quote:

Originally Posted by crgildart 

Colossal Flyers CHOKE last night.

Wait. I'm confused. Beat Canes Mon night, play Coyotes tomorrow night. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by keniski 

Wait. I'm confused. Beat Canes Mon night, play Coyotes tomorrow night. 

My bad, was thinking of the Avs choking to Pittsburgh DOH!  Maybe they need to go by the "AV NOTS" for awhile?

6 in a row for my not well liked Bruins. Looking pretty good over that stretch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daveski7 

6 in a row for my not well liked Bruins. Looking pretty good over that stretch.

speaking of not liked.....Lucic vs. Miller 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossi Smash 

speaking of not liked.....Lucic vs. Miller 

 

I admit that the hit may have been questionable but it is not like Lucic has a history of  taking liberty on other players either. I am also sure that Miller has never whacked anyone on the back of the legs and got away with it either. I definitely think when the goalie is behind the net with his back to the play, he should be off limits, when you skate out full speed towards the puck as Miller did, you should not expect a free pass IMO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by crgildart 

My bad, was thinking of the Avs choking to Pittsburgh DOH!  Maybe they need to go by the "AV NOTS" for awhile?

Youngest team in the league, and playing like it. Some periods are brilliant, others they don't show up. Chuck freakin Kobasew  is the only player between 28 and 34 on the whole team ... only 3 guys in their 30s ... and a coach who isn't exactly a veteran either ... yes I want to pull my hair out half the time ....  It isn't quite choking, though. I keep telling myself, patience, patience, patience ... 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daveski7 

I admit that the hit may have been questionable but it is not like Lucic has a history of  taking liberty on other players either. I am also sure that Miller has never whacked anyone on the back of the legs and got away with it either. I definitely think when the goalie is behind the net with his back to the play, he should be off limits, when you skate out full speed towards the puck as Miller did, you should not expect a free pass IMO.

The puck had long since left Millers stick before Lucic burried his shoulder into him. And Miller got a concussion.

I really don't see how he didn't get at least 3 games off for this....Shanahan set the wrong message here

Tenders headgear offers no protection againt anything but the puck

SARCASM ALERT:

Yah. Looks like he tried to avoid him to me. I don't know what you're talking about...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossi Smash 

The puck had long since left Millers stick before Lucic burried his shoulder into him. And Miller got a concussion.

I really don't see how he didn't get at least 3 games off for this....Shanahan set the wrong message here

Tenders headgear offers no protection againt anything but the puck

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by keniski 

Yah. Looks like he tried to avoid him to me. I don't know what you're talking about...

 

It does look like Miller tried to avoid him........Lucic on the other hand did not. Watch the video a few times!

Sorry I though my sarcasm was communicated by the smiley. I already posted above that I thought it was horrendous and Lucic should have been suspended. Also that the rules completely protect the goalie in that situation, contrary to popular belief. There is no way anyone can look at that picture and tell me Lucic was trying to avoid him. Plant him in the tenth row, maybe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keniski 

Sorry I though my sarcasm was communicated by the smiley. I already posted above that I thought it was horrendous and Lucic should have been suspended. Also that the rules completely protect the goalie in that situation, contrary to popular belief. There is no way anyone can look at that picture and tell me Lucic was trying to avoid him. Plant him in the tenth row, maybe.

you had a   instead of a 

either way, I think Shanahan dropped the puck big time on this one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossi Smash 

you had a   instead of a 

 

either way, I think Shanahan dropped the puck big time on this one.

 

I should have used a .

meh.  miller was so relaxed because he was prepared to flop when Lucic brushed past. But Lucic actually hit him full on,so Miller went flying and it looked worse than it should have been. Had Miller braced himself, not much. Still a penalty, that  covers the discipline; the only supplemental discipline needed was a beating from one of Miller's teammates. Lucic  didn't deliver a headshot, looked like whiplash was the culprit. 

That said, I am more of a Miller fan, don't care about Lucic. I'm also a fan of more middle ground when goalies are way out of the crease. it's not fair that Miller could have hit Lucic but not other way around. I don't really want more rules or more lines on the ice, though, soooooo..  not sure. 

I hear ya, but I think Lucic saw the chance to plaster him and took it. He's probably got a good 50 lbs on Miller and a good head of steam going so I don't think bracing himself would have done anything. If Lucic had tried to avoid him and Miller flopped, I'd be all over him, just like I hate it when goalies take hard cheap shots with their sticks at guys who just happen to be passing through their vision instead of planting illegally in their crease. It's really not a matter of our opinion or the hockey code, though, and it's not like taking a shot at a quarterback or a kicker on a football field who aren't paying attention. Nor is it a question of head shot or not, the way it is for regular skaters. It's pretty clear that this wasn't really a bang-bang play and that Lucic "finished" his check. That picture doesn't lie. It's also pretty clear that the rules are written to protect the goalies against exactly what Lucic did, and Shanahan just chose not to punish him. Like I posted earlier, if I were a goalie in the NHL, no matter what team I played for, I'd be looking forward to the next time Lucic came near me away from the play, and I'd have my stick sharpened.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by segbrown 

meh.  miller was so relaxed because he was prepared to flop when Lucic brushed past. But Lucic actually hit him full on,so Miller went flying and it looked worse than it should have been. Had Miller braced himself, not much. Still a penalty, that  covers the discipline; the only supplemental discipline needed was a beating from one of Miller's teammates. Lucic  didn't deliver a headshot, looked like whiplash was the culprit. 

 

That said, I am more of a Miller fan, don't care about Lucic. I'm also a fan of more middle ground when goalies are way out of the crease. it's not fair that Miller could have hit Lucic but not other way around. I don't really want more rules or more lines on the ice, though, soooooo..  not sure. 

How about the MN Wild leading the NW division?! Totally unexpected. I had better scale back my expectations so the later games won't be a crushing blow. Besides, high school hockey is so much more exciting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keniski 

SARCASM ALERT:

 

Yah. Looks like he tried to avoid him to me. I don't know what you're talking about...

 

 

Not a fan of goal tender immunity out of the crease

Not a fan of the way interference is called these days either

This is a contact sport, this isn't baseball or basketball.  Speaking of baseball..

Quote:

Originally Posted by segbrown 

meh.  miller was so relaxed because he was prepared to flop when Lucic brushed past. But Lucic actually hit him full on,so Miller went flying and it looked worse than it should have been. Had Miller braced himself, not much. Still a penalty, that  covers the discipline; the only supplemental discipline needed was a beating from one of Miller's teammates. Lucic  didn't deliver a headshot, looked like whiplash was the culprit. 

 

That said, I am more of a Miller fan, don't care about Lucic. I'm also a fan of more middle ground when goalies are way out of the crease. it's not fair that Miller could have hit Lucic but not other way around. I don't really want more rules or more lines on the ice, though, soooooo..  not sure. 

segbrown

Not sure they had someone that could do that! I guess the point is to at least try.....

he's one tough hombre

So what was Shanny's option? a charging penalty had been called. that was rule 42, or whatever. Lucic didn't lead with elbow or hit Miller's head first... 

A goalkeeper is not “fair game” just because he is outside the goal crease area. The appropriate penalty should be assessed in every case where an opposing player makes unnecessary contact with a goalkeeper. However, incidental contact, at the discretion of the Referee, will be permitted when the goalkeeper is in the act of playing the puck outside his goal crease provided the attacking player has made a reasonable effort to avoid such contact.

Option? We don't need no stinking option!

They are basically punishing for dangerous plays with possibility of resulting injury. Whether we agree or not, what they are trying to do with their disciplinary actions is limit injury from unnecessary roughness.

(Aside-- I actually do agree, because there is just stuff that is unnecessary. And it filters down to the lower levels of hockey, where a lot of serious head injuries are occurring from boarding, and running goalies, and cross-checking, and all the stuff that the pros do. I have two girls that play and the refs let them play even there, where only "incidental contact" is allowed. Some of the stuff that goes on results in permanent injury and the only punishment is a 2-minute penalty. So I admit I am biased against some of this stuff in what has otherwise become my favorite sport.)

Back to the point. The hit was unnecessarily violent. Regardless of the technicalities of the situation, whether anyone believes a goalie out of the crease should or shouldn't be protected, etc, no one can tell me that it was not his intent to plaster Miller as hard as he could once it became clear to him that there was going to be contact, and he knew that he could probably get away with it or at the most take a two minute penalty. The weight forward high arm extension pretty much seals that. That is not the posture of a guy trying to avoid or minimize the force of contact. Shanahan could have ruled to suspend him or not suspend him, and could have applied whatever rule interpretation he wanted. He just chose not to. I don't think its going to set off a spree of goalie checking or anything like that, and I am well aware that goalies get away with all kinds of crap down in the crease, but I think he should have suspended him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by keniski 

Option? We don't need no stinking option!

 

They are basically punishing for dangerous plays with possibility of resulting injury. Whether we agree or not, what they are trying to do with their disciplinary actions is limit injury from unnecessary roughness.

 

(Aside-- I actually do agree, because there is just stuff that is unnecessary. And it filters down to the lower levels of hockey, where a lot of serious head injuries are occurring from boarding, and running goalies, and cross-checking, and all the stuff that the pros do. I have two girls that play and the refs let them play even there, where only "incidental contact" is allowed. Some of the stuff that goes on results in permanent injury and the only punishment is a 2-minute penalty. So I admit I am biased against some of this stuff in what has otherwise become my favorite sport.)

 

Back to the point. The hit was unnecessarily violent. Regardless of the technicalities of the situation, whether anyone believes a goalie out of the crease should or shouldn't be protected, etc, no one can tell me that it was not his intent to plaster Miller as hard as he could once it became clear to him that there was going to be contact, and he knew that he could probably get away with it or at the most take a two minute penalty. The weight forward high arm extension pretty much seals that. That is not the posture of a guy trying to avoid or minimize the force of contact. Shanahan could have ruled to suspend him or not suspend him, and could have applied whatever rule interpretation he wanted. He just chose not to. I don't think its going to set off a spree of goalie checking or anything like that, and I am well aware that goalies get away with all kinds of crap down in the crease, but I think he should have suspended him.

Well, it was a dickhead move, but I didn't find it all that violent. It was a normal hockey hit. He wasn't still moving his feet, he didn't leave his feet, whatever. As I said, I thought it looked worse than it was because Miller did the stock goalie maneuver of going limp while someone brushed past him. Except Lucic didn't.

I think it's tough ...  I agree that the head shots have to go. (Why don't they make the elbow and shoulder pads softer? I think that's been discussed, don't know where it went.) Adding the instigator penalty, and now the Shanny supplemental D, it seems players aren't exactly sure what is what anymore. I would bet good money that Shanahan was thinking, "This isn't my purview ... I would have been the first guy with my fist in Lucic's face." Oh well. I guess it will be sorted out eventually.

Quote:

Originally Posted by segbrown 

 I would bet good money that Shanahan was thinking, "This isn't my purview ... I would have been the first guy with my fist in Lucic's face." 

That's for sure! I would bet Lucic is fair game for the rest of the season if anyone has the guts to run him.

Good win for the Flyers tonight to beat Phoenix, with Bryzgalov stopping 30 of 31. Late late goal by the Bemidji boy Read. Then a huge spinning bear hug from Bryz. I just love a goalie on the edge...

7 in a row for the B's. Did not post further on Lucic because everyone sees things their own way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daveski7 

7 in a row for the B's. Did not post further on Lucic because everyone sees things their own way.

So you're actually celebrating them beating the worst team in the league?           Yeah, nice win...  

Lucic has some "hockey karma" heading his way.......

7 wins in a row is pretty good hockey, I know you hate my Bruins so I guess I shouldn't have expected anything different. I thought there was a reason why we all like our own teams, didn't think that expressing an opinion deserves a negative comment EVERY time, but carry on.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossi Smash 

 

So you're actually celebrating them beating the worst team in the league?           Yeah, nice win...  

 

Lucic has some "hockey karma" heading his way.......

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daveski7 

7 wins in a row is pretty good hockey, I know you hate my Bruins so I guess I shouldn't have expected anything different. I thought there was a reason why we all like our own teams, didn't think that expressing an opinion deserves a negative comment EVERY time, but carry on.
 

No, it's about being thrilled that your teams 7th win was againt a team with what 8 points this year. Hardly reason to celebrate no mather who your team is. I know I couldn't.

And drinking the Boston Kool aid is no reason to not see the problem with Lucic's actions. You're a Boston fan not a fan of hockey....