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Forest Service OKs Copper's elite pass - Page 2

post #31 of 37
The whole situation about Beeline passes is analogous to hot lanes on the Capital Beltway. A Virginia company has proposed building additional lanes on the VA side of the beltway and charging drivers to use them. This won’t work. If traffic is slow, everyone will gravitate to those lanes regardless of cost until the situation equalizes. Build it and they will come!

The same is true with the Copper Beeline. If you can save time by paying just $5 more for a ticket, don’t you think everyone will do it? This is a pittance compared to all the other costs of skiing (transportation, food, lodging, precious time, special clothing and equipment). That’s why I think the whole darn thing is doomed to failure and Copper is shooting itself in the foot for even trying to create this system. It is not worth the bad publicity. :
post #32 of 37
Quote:
Originally posted by Kima:
Forest Service OKs Copper's elite pass
By Bob Berwyn, Special to The Denver Post
(partial quote, irrelevant material deleted by teledave..for the entire article see the first post by kima in this thread)

The pass was most widely available through lodging packages at the resort and was also sold as a $1,000 upgrade to a regular season pass or as a $124 premium-price day pass. The resort sold almost 20,000 Beeline passes as part of lodging packages, but only 23 daily Beeline passes and 15 of the season-pass versions.
WV, I think you missed this part. If the pass were available as a $5 upgrade then I don't anyone would have such a problem with it. However, for all practical purposes it is only available to those that stay in Intrawest/Copper Mtn lodging.

For reference, Copper's daily lift ticket is around $50 and season pass is around $199.
post #33 of 37
Quote:
Originally posted by PinHed:
Could you identify at least one of the many variances Copper can't comply with? If you can't, then who's the dirty scoundrel now? You're throwing darts with a blindfold on my fellow ski buddy. Furthermore, those groups are already watching and have been watching for years (31 years.) To date, Copper has an excellent relationship with the Forest Service. I would know, I've worked for Copper for 9 years ...both pre and post ITW ownership. Nothing has changed in Copper's track record as the Steward of Copper Mountain. In fact, I would reason that the larger resort operations are watched ever more closely than the small mom and pop operations.[/QB][/quote]

Pinhead,

I referred to the many minute statutes that clog the environmental directives of this country. Many are considered petty until the right party brings them forward. Many of these things that you so nobly say are 'taken care of' are outside the realm of detection by the general public. Let the 'right' parties move in and start asking the proper questions, and all those heros you work for will start running like rats from a sinking ship. ...It is that way in all industries of this over regulated country, and the guys up top like to keep a lid on the kind of terror it can create.



[ July 19, 2003, 02:01 AM: Message edited by: feal ]
post #34 of 37
Rusty: The Beeline is in place at all of the base lifts and the mid-mountain Excelerator lift.

I know this doesn't help the principle of the matter, but in practical terms, the Beeline has virtually no effect on the speed that others get up the mountain. I watched it in operation some 90 days last year and the year before, and at no time did I see more than about six people in it. Most times it was empty. As a marketing tool, it has not produced much of a result.

[ July 15, 2003, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: mike_m ]
post #35 of 37
People who oppose the Beeline, please consider this:

Beeline is simply another product. A few people will pay extra for it, most will not. It's similar to many other products. If you're willing to pay a higher fare, you can fly first class. If you're willing to pay $75,000 you can drive a Porsche 911 instead of a Chevy. Some people see the perceived value in the first class ticket or the Porsche, most people probably do not. No one is being discriminated against. Most of the places that I ski at Copper have no line anyway, so it makes no difference to me. I wouldn't buy the Beeline, even if it only cost 5 bucks. I need the lift line once in a while for rest time anyway.
post #36 of 37
Teledave:

I did miss the pt. Sorry about that. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Under the system you decribe, I kind of have mixed emotions about Beeline. On one hand, it does violate the egalitarian spirit of skiing, but on the other hand, it seems to be designed for the destination traveler with limited time. Some of my unfortunate friends work 80 hour weeks in law firms and have little time for holidays--two weeks max per year and they need to constantly be in touch with the office via a cell (even if they vacation abroad). For those people (people with no time but lots of $$$), Beeline makes sense. These people, if they are lucky, dream all year of the 5 days they MAY get to ski. I'm not saying that I feel terribly sorry for them given how much $$$ they make but I also don't feel horrible about them giving that cash to Copper--especially if it does not have too much impact on regular lines. Regulars and season pass holders can smile over the fact that in the end, they're giong to bag a lot more vertical during the course of the year than the Beeliners... [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img]
post #37 of 37
Quote:
Originally posted by feal:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by PinHed:

Could you identify at least one of the many variances Copper can't comply with? If you can't, then who's the dirty scoundrel now? You're throwing darts with a blindfold on my fellow ski buddy. Furthermore, those groups are already watching and have been watching for years (31 years.) To date, Copper has an excellent relationship with the Forest Service. I would know, I've worked for Copper for 9 years ...both pre and post ITW ownership. Nothing has changed in Copper's track record as the Steward of Copper Mountain. In fact, I would reason that the larger resort operations are watched ever more closely than the small mom and pop operations.</font>[/quote]Pinhead,

I referred to the many minute statutes that clog the environmental directives of this country. Many are considered petty until the right party brings them forward. Many of these things that you so nobly say are 'taken care of' are outside the realm of detection by the general public. Let the 'right' parties move in and start asking the proper questions, and all those heros you work for will start running like rats from a sinking ship. ...It is that way in all industries of this over regulated country, and the guys up top like to keep a lid on the kind of terror it can create.

[/QB][/quote]

I would like to retract that line of remark. It is a bit like answering a slight disagreement with a mortal blow. --My apologies.

There is an easier way to deal with this situation. It has been stated this a marketing tool, so the 'spin' is what the concept is all about. Skiers who don't like the idea can merely use the 'spin' to the ski areas' disadvantage. ..Pointing out that a ski area has congestion problems that require special pass privileges to attract destination visitors will go a long way toward steering the planning destination skier away from such areas. It won't be just about the concept of preferred line status, but would also point out that lifts running at full capacity translate to high skier density on the slopes.

If many in the skiing public pick up that mantra, it hurts them exactly where they don't want it. --In the pocketbook!
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