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Ski Traffic

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
Lately I seem to be involved in many near misses from other skiers/riders on the groomed runs. One second there's no one around and the next instant someones almost rear-ending me. I know they see me so why can't they avoid me. It's to the point now that I am starting to look back over my shoulder as I start to carve my turn. I ski on 150cm race carve skis,which have a short turn radius,would that have something to do with it? Maybe I need to get some rear view mirrors. :
post #2 of 22
I started to look over my shoulder a few years back. I try to hold my line when I'm skiing around people. If I'm going to make a big direction change I'll try and either look back or at least point to where I'm going kind of like a turn signal when driving.

I have seen to many people that think they are skiing all by themselves and no one else is on the hill.

Kind of like the driver who makes a right turn from the left lane.

As fast as I ski, there is always someone else faster.

Yes the down hill skier has the right of way. But when I'm above you and I'm skiing down the right side and your on the left side if you all of a sudden decide to make a big change, it would be nice to make sure you at not going to turn into someone who is on the other side of the trail, just because you decided to make a big carve.

Oh yea, Look up hill before you take off.
post #3 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by slider:
Lately I seem to be involved in many near misses from other skiers/riders on the groomed runs. One second there's no one around and the next instant someones almost rear-ending me. I know they see me so why can't they avoid me. It's to the point now that I am starting to look back over my shoulder as I start to carve my turn. I ski on 150cm race carve skis,which have a short turn radius,would that have something to do with it? Maybe I need to get some rear view mirrors. :
I hear if you throw a baby in a backpack, then the mountain clears out of the way for you. Those guys NEVER have near misses! [img]smile.gif[/img]
post #4 of 22
I dang near got taken out by an out-of-control boarder at mammoth last weekend. i'm coming out of the trees and out of the corner of my eye i see mr. boarder in a high-speed direct line toward me. (I had the undisputable right of way.) Whether he purposely laid it down or his minimal control totally evaporated, I don't know, but he went zinging by and behind me toward same trees and was darn lucky to come out of it intact. Dude had no clue.

(Miles, thinking I'd taken HIM out, skied up to me and said "good job.")
post #5 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by ryan:

(Miles, thinking I'd taken HIM out, skied up to me and said "good job."

[/QB]
I think those of us here would expect nothing less.

ps Ryan, nice try, I'm sure you'll get him next time out.
post #6 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by CAPBOY:
I hear if you throw a baby in a backpack, then the mountain clears out of the way for you. Those guys NEVER have near misses!
Sore Loser! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
post #7 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by Carvemeister:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by CAPBOY:
I hear if you throw a baby in a backpack, then the mountain clears out of the way for you. Those guys NEVER have near misses!
Sore Loser! [img]tongue.gif[/img] </font>[/quote]Not sore, just a loser! [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]
post #8 of 22
What occurs to me is that there is a pretty significant question of trail compatibility between carvers and traditional skidders. The latter tend to "ski" borderline straight runs with uncontrollable skidded "turns", effectively making directional control difficult at best.

Meanwhile, modern technique carvers are ripping turns from edge to edge (pun intended!), effectively making the two groups mutual obstacles.

Time to add "Carving Zone" to the list of runs at an area? :
post #9 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by CAPBOY:
] hear if you throw a baby in a backpack, then the mountain clears out of the way for you. Those guys NEVER have near misses! [img]smile.gif[/img]
CAPBOY you just cracked me up [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]
post #10 of 22
Thread Starter 
Time to add "Carving Zone" to the list of runs at an area?

ssh is on to something. [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] Thanks for ALL the replies. Maybe I should just get a backpack and a doll.
post #11 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by ssh:
What occurs to me is that there is a pretty significant question of trail compatibility between carvers and traditional skidders. The latter tend to "ski" borderline straight runs with uncontrollable skidded "turns", effectively making directional control difficult at best.

Meanwhile, modern technique carvers are ripping turns from edge to edge (pun intended!), effectively making the two groups mutual obstacles.
This is a problem not only with rec skiers. In my last few clinics, I've noticed (and gotten really annoyed with) a real incompatibility between skidder and carver instructors, and even have had a couple of near misses. :

I quickly realized that the safest place to be was 1st in line behind the clinician. If I started further back in the groups, I usually found myself in the midst of a bunch of very talented, very high speed skidders. In that case, about my only choice was to either go into a straighter-line skidding mode myself, or else make lots of short radius carved turns. The latter also keep me in a narrow corridor, but are pretty energy intensive.

Even if the mountain is deserted, near collisions with other members of your own group are a real concern. The reason is pretty funny - nobody wants to be the slowest skier, so everybody winds up skiing at about the same speed, and even if there are only a half dozen people in the clinic, everybody stays tightly bunched up on an otherwise empty run. Arghhh.

Tom / PM

[ January 16, 2004, 03:15 AM: Message edited by: PhysicsMan ]
post #12 of 22
Slow zones are the problem. Everyone gets all bunched up. Just ski down and get out of the way. Slow people go slow - fast people go fast. A-holes get kicked out.
post #13 of 22
i would hate to see some of these people drive--entering a highway without lookng to see if traffic can allow you in!!!
post #14 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by PhysicsMan:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by ssh:
What occurs to me is that there is a pretty significant question of trail compatibility between carvers and traditional skidders. The latter tend to "ski" borderline straight runs with uncontrollable skidded "turns", effectively making directional control difficult at best.

Meanwhile, modern technique carvers are ripping turns from edge to edge (pun intended!), effectively making the two groups mutual obstacles.
This is a problem not only with rec skiers. In my last few clinics, I've noticed (and gotten really annoyed with) a real incompatibility between skidder and carver instructors, and even have had a couple of near misses. : </font>[/quote]Tom/PM, I have seen the same thing. During my hiring clinic, I got hit once and had my skis skied over a number of times by one of the other candidates (who was hired). Last week, in level II clinics, one of the other students actually ran into the clinician and stopped pretty close to the group multiple times. I've been shocked by the lack of safety sensitivity that many instructors have.

I'm to the point where I'm either the first down behind the clinician or the last down. I don't mind being the slowest! It's actually more challenging for me to ski the slow line fast while managing my speed at the low end of the spectrum, anyway.
post #15 of 22
THIS is the very reason why we don't need to "grow" skiing. In fact, we could do with a little culling of the weekend warrior goofballs who are mere scenesters. Pistols at 10 paces?

[img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img]
post #16 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by nancie2k:
i would hate to see some of these people drive--entering a highway without lookng to see if traffic can allow you in!!!
That 1 went right by me. The skier below you has the right of way. Reguardless of his or her direction of travel. Unless he or she is starting or entering a run. Skidders are unable to make precision direction changes.
post #17 of 22
Quote:
Originally posted by slider:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by nancie2k:
i would hate to see some of these people drive--entering a highway without lookng to see if traffic can allow you in!!!
That 1 went right by me. The skier below you has the right of way. Reguardless of his or her direction of travel. Unless he or she is starting or entering a run. Skidders are unable to make precision direction changes.</font>[/quote]Yes... But... Part of the Skier's Responsibility Code is to look uphill when entering a trail or starting out. In my experience, somewhere around 10% of skiers/riders do this.
post #18 of 22
A couple of years back I use to get clocked a number of times during a season. The crowds have not changed so it must be me. I do not face down the hill as much as I use to and that allows me to look uphill. I carve more and I am faster. I have far better control over my line and can change the shape and size of my turn at will. This could have something to do with the fact that I have not be hit hard in two seasons, knock on wood.

I think the real problem is skidders combined with park and ride carvers and boarders with the heal side blind spots. Carving has increased speeds and things happen fast.

[ January 16, 2004, 05:26 PM: Message edited by: Pierre ]
post #19 of 22
Maybe I'm used to it, but the only near miss I've ever had was some a hole blowing by me at about mach 2 with no control at all. Not only did he almost knock me over with his backblast, but he almost speared me through the head with his damn poles (which he of course had tucked like he was bode-freaking-miller or something). I screamed something along the lines of HOLY S*** THANKS FOR THE WARNING A**HOLE! Luckily, the only place where congestionbecomes a REAL problem, the trails are at least 50 yards wide, sometimes more. I've seen many convincing arguments to the contrary, but I'm still of the belief that no matter what happens, if you hit somebody downhill of you, its your fault, unless of course, it's at an intersection and they didn't look for skiers uphill of them. I have on many occasions (at least 10 a day) turned to avoid crossing the line of somebody who I know would hit me.
post #20 of 22
Has anyone else observed that a wide trail is no promise of a wide berth? I have had multiple occations in the past few weeks (in clinics with 10 or so other people!) when boarders or skiers (most often boarders) would ignore the other 80% of the trail and ride behind us (on the two feet between our skis and the woods) or come within a foot or two of the people closest to the trail (even though we were way off to the side). :

What's up with that?! : : :

[ January 16, 2004, 05:39 PM: Message edited by: ssh ]
post #21 of 22
It seems skiers use the hill in a different manor than boarders.

I got hit once by a boarder but I was partly to blame. I pulled up quickly right in the middle of the trail to check on my kid. The guy who hit me was tracking straight down the hill, balls out! He just could not react like a skier can and so he gave up and went straight - into me.

He even said he was sorry and he was quite a good boarder - though primitive.

Boarders have a blind side and tend to go across the fall line while skiers like to stay in the fall line.

I like Mad River I guess because I am a segregationist.
post #22 of 22
Thread Starter 
I think the real problem is skidders combined with park and ride carvers and boarders with the heal side blind spots. Carving has increased speeds and things happen fast.

I maybe guilty of the park and ride carver but I am still in the learning stages of changing my turn radius at will. Since last season when I posted a picture here of me skiing and Pierre made a few comments he has been a big influence in my continuing quest to improve my skiing. Perhaps it's time for a lesson.
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