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Secret Sauce

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
I have read that some mix their own Secret tuning sauce with a 50% water, 50% alcohol mixture. Would the alcohol be denatured or isopropyl for this? (Or plain old vodka? :

Any ideas on adding a little bit of something like a oil or WD40 liquid also for better lubrication- like honing oil for sharpening knives, etc.?
post #2 of 39
Isopropanol with a bit of Windex for color so I can tell it from daily shower spray when it's in a clear spray bottle; the smell is almost identical otherwise. Denatured ethanol evaporates fast.
post #3 of 39
Denatured.

I got that from MoonFlex, manufactures web site. I think it's Somna...
post #4 of 39
Denatured and I am guessing it has some oil of wintergreen for lubrication and assist cutting. At least the one I got made by Artechski does.
post #5 of 39
I get the denatured at home depot and mix 50/50 with water. Keep in a squirt bottle. Never had problems with evaporation. Seems to work just fine. You can also use 40/60 with window washer fluid to help window washer fluid from freezing
post #6 of 39
So far as I know, isopropanol, ethanol and denatured ethanol should all be pretty much interchangeable in this application. The chemical properties are pretty nearly identical for these purposes.

The downside of ethanol (as in Vodka) is that it costs a relative fortune, due to taxes. Denatured ethanol is only made because if you render the stuff undrinkable, you avoid the taxes. What's sold as denatured alcohol often includes some methanol or (I think) isopropanol. Sometimes the denatured alcohol you buy at the drugstore has some scent added too, I guess just to make it more pleasant to smell and less likely to be consumed.

The advantage of Vodka is that you can be pretty confident exactly what concentration it is, and what's in it. The labeling on denatured alcohol can be a bit spotty. Also, of course, it does double-duty: you can drink it if you feel like it, and if you do so by accident, it'll be more pleasant than if you did the same with denatured alcohol, or, really, if you didn't drink anything at all (at least in the short term).

You want to keep the concentration around 50% alcohol (i.e. 100 proof) to avoid flammability danger.
post #7 of 39
I use a plastic cup with a snap on lid and my tooth brush. OK, an old tooth brush.
post #8 of 39
umm, it's a secret
post #9 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston View Post
So far as I know, isopropanol, ethanol and denatured ethanol should all be pretty much interchangeable in this application. The chemical properties are pretty nearly identical for these purposes.

The downside of ethanol (as in Vodka) is that it costs a relative fortune, due to taxes. Denatured ethanol is only made because if you render the stuff undrinkable, you avoid the taxes. What's sold as denatured alcohol often includes some methanol or (I think) isopropanol. Sometimes the denatured alcohol you buy at the drugstore has some scent added too, I guess just to make it more pleasant to smell and less likely to be consumed.

The advantage of Vodka is that you can be pretty confident exactly what concentration it is, and what's in it. The labeling on denatured alcohol can be a bit spotty. Also, of course, it does double-duty: you can drink it if you feel like it, and if you do so by accident, it'll be more pleasant than if you did the same with denatured alcohol, or, really, if you didn't drink anything at all (at least in the short term).

You want to keep the concentration around 50% alcohol (i.e. 100 proof) to avoid flammability danger.
FYI, check the label for impurities like benzene (it causes cancer) and be careful for methanol it will make you blind.
post #10 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjjohnston View Post
So far as I know, isopropanol, ethanol and denatured ethanol should all be pretty much interchangeable in this application. The chemical properties are pretty nearly identical for these purposes.

The downside of ethanol (as in Vodka) is that it costs a relative fortune, due to taxes. Denatured ethanol is only made because if you render the stuff undrinkable, you avoid the taxes. What's sold as denatured alcohol often includes some methanol or (I think) isopropanol. Sometimes the denatured alcohol you buy at the drugstore has some scent added too, I guess just to make it more pleasant to smell and less likely to be consumed.

The advantage of Vodka is that you can be pretty confident exactly what concentration it is, and what's in it. The labeling on denatured alcohol can be a bit spotty. Also, of course, it does double-duty: you can drink it if you feel like it, and if you do so by accident, it'll be more pleasant than if you did the same with denatured alcohol, or, really, if you didn't drink anything at all (at least in the short term).

You want to keep the concentration around 50% alcohol (i.e. 100 proof) to avoid flammability danger.
Expensive? Not if you went on holiday to Poland in 1990 I've got a few bottles of ridiculously cheap, but virtually undrinkable vodka - in fact there's a bottle on my workshop table next to the tuning vices right now
post #11 of 39
From SVST's Secret Sauce description:

Quote:
Secret Sauce Edge Polishing Solution
Exclusive to SVST, our World Cup tested edge polishing solution accelerates cutting and polishing action without premature diamond and stone loading. Our unique blend will increase stone and diamond life and will not taint or contaminate base. (Water soluble.)
In addition to 50/50 denatured alcohol, what benefit does something like wintergreen or other oil bring to the process? As Max Capacity said, Sorma (makers of Diaface MoonFlex) recommends 50/50 mix and that is why we sell this and spray bottles. I've had good results with this simple mixture you can easily make yourself, but also curious about 'the next level' and whether or not it really provides more longevity and better sharpening & polishing results.
post #12 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
From SVST's Secret Sauce description:



In addition to 50/50 denatured alcohol, what benefit does something like wintergreen or other oil bring to the process? As Max Capacity said, Sorma (makers of Diaface MoonFlex) recommends 50/50 mix and that is why we sell this and spray bottles. I've had good results with this simple mixture you can easily make yourself, but also curious about 'the next level' and whether or not it really provides more longevity and better sharpening & polishing results.

You can actually buy alcohol with wintergreen already in it,I just did for use on my skis, you can feel more lubricity in it if you put some on your fingers. Some knife sharpeners use wintergreen for sharpening. My dad, a jeweler all his life, also prefers it when he sharpens his tools on an Arkansas stone. I see many professional engravers use it as well.
post #13 of 39
Is the concentration of alcohol to water different? Where can you get wintergreen oil or alcohol/wintergreen mix? I can also check with a jeweler friend and of course do some web searching....

Thanks!

Has anyone compared SVST's Secret Sauce to 50/50 denatured alcohol mix?
post #14 of 39
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by comprex View Post
Isopropanol with a bit of Windex for color so I can tell it from daily shower spray when it's in a clear spray bottle; the smell is almost identical otherwise. Denatured ethanol evaporates fast.
or

Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Capacity View Post
Denatured.

I got that from MoonFlex, manufactures web site. I think it's Somna...
So it sounds like there is no real concessus out there. May have to experment on my own. As for the adding of the Windex/wiper fluid - if that is only for color and to tell what is in it, I can use a label on the bottle I store it in. Any other benefit to the Windex in the tuning process?
post #15 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
Is the concentration of alcohol to water different? Where can you get wintergreen oil or alcohol/wintergreen mix? I can also check with a jeweler friend and of course do some web searching....

Thanks!

Has anyone compared SVST's Secret Sauce to 50/50 denatured alcohol mix?
Around here most pharmacies have it right alongside the clear stuff. The concentrations I think are on the bottle, dont have it here at work so cant tell you.
post #16 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawker View Post
Expensive? Not if you went on holiday to Poland in 1990 I've got a few bottles of ridiculously cheap, but virtually undrinkable vodka - in fact there's a bottle on my workshop table next to the tuning vices right now
This may explain a number of things, including the prevalance of "Polish jokes" during that period.
post #17 of 39
The old 2b denatured alcohol used to be denatured with benzene, but other, safer, chemicals are used now.
post #18 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor D View Post
FYI, check the label for impurities like benzene (it causes cancer) and be careful for methanol it will make you blind.
Does it grow hair on you hands too?
post #19 of 39
plain water works fine. i think they suggest the alcohol to make it dry faster so it doesn't cause you edges to rust. i've never had a problem with plain water.
post #20 of 39
I bought some 100 proof corn whiskey for $5 on a trip not too long ago; it worked pretty well with diamond stones. Whether it was drinkable or not is arguable...
post #21 of 39
50/50 Denatured/Water here! Works fine!

Holmenkol makes a cutting oil, but way to messy and didn't want oil on my bases. Apparantly no one else liked it either, no longer on their site.
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by RShea View Post
Any other benefit to the Windex in the tuning process?
I started using it back when I was also using Goo Gone as a base cleaner :: to get the last residues of -that- off and Windex worked better than alcohols.

I had one pair of skis with edges that would rust almost before my eyes if there was any GG left on there, black staining would appear within 3-4 minutes and the ochre splotches in less than 15.

Creature of habit, I guess, I fancy it cuts random oils better than straight alcohol/water mix.
post #23 of 39
Well, FWIW, nudged by this thread we ordered and just received a supply of SVST Secret Sauce......and according to the label, it also contains rust inhibitors, is pleasant smelling, non-hazardous, etc....
post #24 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
Well, FWIW, nudged by this thread we ordered and just received a supply of SVST Secret Sauce......and according to the label, it also contains rust inhibitors, is pleasant smelling, non-hazardous, etc....
Pleasant as in minty? floral?

The one I got from Artech was minty, clearly had wintergreen in it, it is even greenish in color.
post #25 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomicman View Post
50/50 Denatured/Water here! Works fine!
Obviously you haven't drank your "secret sauce." It is not fine!
post #26 of 39
I've got your secret sauce.....
post #27 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
Pleasant as in minty? floral?

The one I got from Artech was minty, clearly had wintergreen in it, it is even greenish in color.
Color is light blue and scent is 'neutral' by nose.
post #28 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
Color is light blue and scent is 'neutral' by nose.
Any difference in droplet size and beading of Secret Sauce vs. water vs. Smirnoff/Aristocrat, on a waxed base?

If it beads up better, I might look to get some.
post #29 of 39

The Great Bead Race

Quote:
Originally Posted by comprex View Post
Any difference in droplet size and beading of Secret Sauce vs. water vs. Smirnoff/Aristocrat, on a waxed base?

If it beads up better, I might look to get some.
From left to right 80 proof vodka/Secret Sauce/50:50 denatured/water:


Gradually increasing tilt of ski, Secret Sauce stayed together and moved first without hesitation, 50:50 second with separation and slight lag/skip, then water with no separation and smoothly, vodka stayed put substantially longer.

post #30 of 39
Exactly what I was looking for, thank you Alpinord!
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