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Safety of Extreme Carving - Page 2

post #31 of 41
A few guesses regarding the "carving" in the video (Warning: Idiotic uninformed opinion ahead!):

1. The skier is not balanced on the outside foot. There is considerable pressure on the inside foot to allow the skier to get as low as he/she is. The extreme position and large forces are, I believe, very risky to the knee of the inside leg.

2. Pressure on the inside foot allows the skier to acquire the positions shown at lower speeds than a racer would reach when showing similar angles between the skis and the snow. I think it is quite possible for other skiers following straighter lines to catch this skier, intentionally or otherwise.

3. Despite the pronounced body language shown by this skier indicating what's coming next, I believe many skiers will not observe it and draw the correct conclusions. Despite the Code, many skiers are so focused on the next turn, or just standing up, that they do not really notice much of what's going on around them (or below them). Given this, it's rather amazing how few collisions actually occur!

4. Note also that this skier is executing a park 'n' ride. For anyone paying attention, the line is easy to predict - but many people don't pay attention. See below.

5. Personal experience: I have, more than once, received irritated comments from passing skiers while doing mild pure carves (no snow spray) initiated by subtle foot tipping. In each case, I was using a corridor of 30 feet wide or less on a sparsely populated low angle slope well over 100 feet wide. According to the Code, the responsibility of the overtaking skier was clear, and yet, in each case, the overtaking skier blamed me for getting in their way because they didn't or couldn't figure out my probable line. Fortunately, I check over my shoulder often and there were no accidents.

But then, what do I know??
post #32 of 41
This discussion sounds a bit like it is from 1997. It would certainly limit the possibilities that modern equipment opens up, if slope users did not have the right to carve sharply across the fall-line. ("Slope users" because hard-boot snowboarders also carve this type of trajectory.)
Would it be safe to do this on a really crowded run? Obviously not.
Would this technique be the fastest way to negotiate an injected super G course? Probably not but it is undoubtedly fun.
Is it more or less fun or boring than off-piste skiing, telemarking, or dropping cliffs? Whatever floats your boat...
For anyone who wants to carve across the fall-line, I would certainly agree with previous comments: there is "the code", and then there is also the real world and common sense, so by all means take an occasional glance over your uphill shoulder.
post #33 of 41
While not the same except in the broadest sense, last Sat night 2 of the guys I ski with regularily were following me in perfect snow that emptied out onto a nice wide pitch like in this video.

One of the things I like to try to do when the circumstances and snow are right, is to try to do a 'loop!' Do a 360 degree turn - as round as possible.

While leading the pack i decided to do just that and darn near got myself run over due to the guy right behind me not knowing what i was up to.

BTW made it about 270 degrees---can't quite figure out how to finish the top of the loop..
post #34 of 41
I'll tell you what's unsafe about the skiing in the first video -- look at how much the downhill ski is wobbling. It's kicking up a pulsed trail of snow for crying out loud. I'm not sure I see the point of extreme carving if it means teetering on the brink of disaster. If the weight of the upper body is that far away from the edges, it's bordering on gaper skiing in my opinion.
post #35 of 41
skier219: ...look at how much the downhill ski is wobbling. It's kicking up a pulsed trail of snow for crying out loud.

The only reason the outside ski is doing that is because the skier is carving on the inside ski in order to be able to reach for the snow. I would guess that any decent skier or racer can do the same turns using the outside ski as the dominant stance ski.
post #36 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry_Morgan View Post
...It is pretty boring after the first 2 or 3 turns.

Yesterday I watched a snowboarder take Superman. Drops a 50o shoulder above a 140' cliff, to two airs, the bottom being 40'. THAT was worth watching.
Hucking, wow! I wish I had seen that. You are a lucky man. Did he also do some straight running!?
post #37 of 41
Not just extreme carving in skis.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se_oZmsaVqI
post #38 of 41
I just watched the video, and honestly I don't see what's so impressive.

A) The downhill ski is chattering like crazy on almost every turn.
B) The upper body is all over the place.
and
C) the slope looks very mild, a Blue at best! Anyone can buy a ski with alot of sidecut and lay it on it's side and turn like that. BORING!

As far as the safety of this kind of skiing is concerned, the skier seems to be pretty much in control the whole time, and the slope is empty so I don't see what the fuss is about. There are a lot of power wedgers who ski out of control who are a lot less safe!


Quote:
Originally Posted by skilife View Post
I and 4 other people were once skiing down a groomed black run making wide arcs at a good clip. This was early in the morning with no one around. It was pretty much just the 5 of us. And not all 5 of us were going down at the same time but with about 30-40 seconds interval between us.

A patroller, caught up to us at the bottom and said we couldn't do that. The reason she gave us was that later on the trail was going to be busy and even though we were under control and perfectly safe, people were going to try to imitate us and that was going to be a problem.
As far as this is concerned, the patroller was WRONG. This happens frequently and should not come as such a surprise. In my experience it is generally weekend volunteer patrollers who get on an ego trip and think that they run the mountains they actually spend only 20 days a season on. These folks are best ignored. They generally don't ski well anyway, so just give a hoot and blow by them. (Sorry if there are any weekend warrior patrollers on here, but in my experience you guys usually have huge egos, are bitter about not being at the mountain every day, and ski like s*it!)
post #39 of 41
Honestly, I don't get it. I've skied like that for S'n giggles, but it's not really fun and it's not fast either. Like others have said, it's boring after a few turns. Not to mention, hard edging like that doesn't make any frickin sense as it chops off a ton of speed and kills the momentum for the next turn. I think her turns are too tight, you can see the outside ski struggling to hold the edge, chopping all over the place, that's not smooth skiing. Smooth skiing/ carving equals speed, look at any pro downhiller or GS skier, no one edges that hard. Why?? It kills your speed. F'ing pointless.
post #40 of 41

Trail edge to edge turns

I like making high speed carving runs cranking my edges over using the whole trail edge to edge as much as the next person, but if anyone else is on the trail (uphill of you or downhill), regardless of how safe it is, you are being inconsiderate. No one can safely pass you, and you tend to have to do a human slalom if people are downhill from you.
post #41 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by c1er View Post
I like making high speed carving runs cranking my edges over using the whole trail edge to edge as much as the next person, but if anyone else is on the trail (uphill of you or downhill), regardless of how safe it is, you are being inconsiderate. No one can safely pass you, and you tend to have to do a human slalom if people are downhill from you.
I agree that if a trail is too crowded below you than this type of skiing can be difficult to pull off; however, it should not be a concern for you if you are the one above and trying to pass. This skier is following a very predictable line and could be easily (and safely) passed by anyone with the skills necessary to ski at the speeds required for such a move.
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