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backflip/lone peak

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
Hey w'sup everyone! I got two quick questions... First of all, I am making a ski video just for fun and I have my mind set on doing a backflip for it. I have not learned any other tricks, as I do not particularly like the terrain park, and I was wondering how difficult a backflip was. Also, how dangerous is it?
Second, what is the best way to get a partner for Lone Peak (Big Couloir/Headwaters type stuff) at Big Sky? On their website, they have guides for adults, but, as I am only 14, we called them and they said I would have to wait till I am older (wtf?) And yes, I have seen the slopes and done other slopes about as diffulct and am not a complete gaper (not completely one...)
post #2 of 28
Have you ever done a back flip? Trampoline? Diving board? On the ground?
post #3 of 28
Thread Starter 
I am pretty sure I have done it off a trampoline...def a front flip off a diving board, I THINK a backflip. And certainly not off the ground.
post #4 of 28
You can't remember if you've done a backflip or not? Must have hit your head.

I would learn 180's and 360's before I tried going inverted. That said, there are a few spots at Moonlight with perfect takeoffs and landings that remain deep and untracked for forever that are perfect for trying new tricks into.

You might try front flips first actually, most people say they are harder, but the thing is with front flips, you can start small, just glorified front summersaults, and its fine if you don't get it all the way around, you just flop on your back in the pow. With back flips, you have to commit to getting it all the way around. Thats why I'm always too afraid to try one. If you are set on doing a back, then you will need a decent amount of air, at least a solid 20ft, and I would make sure you can stomp 20 footers to hardpack in your sleep before you try going inverted on an air that size, unless BS gets like three feet of snow.

As for a partner for the Big, I'll be skiing at BS/MLB four or five days a week once I get back into town in mid January, and I'm sure there will be days I have no one to ski with. Drop me a line around the 20th if you want and I'll ski it with you.


Whatever happens though, post the video.
post #5 of 28
Thread Starter 
Thanks a ton dude. I would be completely happy with a front flip... I just always heard they were harder. I would be willing to go 15-20 feet but definitely not anymore. Also, I will be out there for like 11 days in late March and it would be killer to hook up with you sometime. I will PM when March is nearer :.P And I will definitely post the video up here if you want.
post #6 of 28
I think you should post this question over at TGR... it will be a lot of fun!

Don't under rotate! You biggest danger will be getting halfway through, freaking out, and landing on your head.
post #7 of 28
If you have to ask here what is intailed in doing a flip, you prolly aren't ready.
post #8 of 28
Thread Starter 
Haha Summit...I was gunna post it at TGR but my account has been disabled for some reason. I had a couple hundred posts, so I was kinda past the stage where whenever I posted something, everyone would just say "JONG" and completely ignore the question. But not really...


P.S. are u the same Summit that posted that insane TR with the 400 foot exposure in the middle of the slope?
post #9 of 28
OHHH MY GODDD:
post #10 of 28
Back flip.....does not know if he can has done one on the ground......hmmm, hey I got an idea! Why not just run into a highway, you will surely kill yourself much easier and quicker that way and it will be much more spectacular for film with all the blood and guts and your body parts flying all over the place....it would go all over the Internet for sure.

Dude, seriously, learn to do a back-flip on a trampoline and in a pool and know it well before you go and turn yourself into a quadriplegic to make a dumb video that no one will look twice at.
post #11 of 28
If you are going to hold off, I strongly reccomend water ramping in the summer to train...

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtraheat View Post
Haha Summit...I was gunna post it at TGR but my account has been disabled for some reason. I had a couple hundred posts, so I was kinda past the stage where whenever I posted something, everyone would just say "JONG" and completely ignore the question. But not really...
You might try again... there were some ongoing problems with the TGR forum database affecting a number of accounts and posts, but I think The Suit fixed two or three days ago so your account might be working again...

Quote:
P.S. are u the same Summit that posted that insane TR with the 400 foot exposure in the middle of the slope?
If you mean this: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=86995
I am the same Summit.
post #12 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAGGOT View Post
You might try front flips first actually, most people say they are harder, but the thing is with front flips, you can start small, just glorified front summersaults, and its fine if you don't get it all the way around, you just flop on your back in the pow. With back flips, you have to commit to getting it all the way around. Thats why I'm always too afraid to try one.
I used to coach gymnastics (and competed for a while), so I've done my fair share of backflips and front flips on trampolines and on the ground, and other other less well-advised locations...

(NOTE: WHAT FOLLOWS IS NOT INTENDED AS INSTRUCTION FOR ATTEMPTING THE SKILL ON SKIS - THIS IS PURELY FOR GROUND/TRAMPOLINE-BASED FLIPPING)

It's true that a front flip leaves a lot less opportunity for landing on your head, but it's a little trickier in that it requires a "blind" landing. You can't see the ground until it's too late to adjust. On the other hand, a back flip does allow you to spot your landing before hitting the ground. The basic rule of thumb when attempting a back flip would be to get as high as you can, let your head drop back (at the top... not before), and bring your knees in to your chest. Where a lot of people run into trouble is by trying to bring their chest to their knees. That will stop your rotation... not good... Bringing your knees to your chest at the top of your up/down motion will initiate the inversion. Hold that position until you see the ground (your head will still be "back", which is to say that that you'll see the ground before you're vertical again), and then pretty much just put your feet on the ground. That's the nice part about spotting landings...

I should also point out that men have a MUCH easier time doing backflips that most women, because the center of gravity is higher (chest vs. hips). Front flips are harder to initiate on the ground, but on a trampoline, they're not so bad. It is a lot harder to seriously hurt yourself on a front flip, but you'll probably bruise your back a few times...

As far as doing it on skis, I have no idea. Any flipping I've done on skis has been entirely unintentional (and very painful to watch). I'd guess, given the physics of it all, that a backflip would be easiest on something with a lip or kicker, or whatever it's called, since that would somewhat intiate the "going over backwards" motion. On the other hand, a front flip would be easier just hucking a cliff, since it would be easier to get your upper body ahead of your lower body, which initiates the "going over forwards" motion.

I agree that you should DEFINITELY try inversions into a pool, or on a trampoline first, just to get a sense of timing, placement, and develop a little of the muscle memory for what it feels like to be right side up, then upside down, then right side up again. It's VERY quick, and takes a few times just to figure out where you can push/pull the timing...


aaron
post #13 of 28
post #14 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
Dude, seriously, learn to do a back-flip on a trampoline and in a pool and know it well before you go and turn yourself into a quadriplegic to make a dumb video that no one will look twice at.

Well, if he fails I might be tempted to look at it more than once! :


But seriously, you haven't spent any time in a park, you don't know any other tricks, but you've decided it would be a good idea to learn the backflip first? This is a joke right? You've really got to be pulling our collective legs...

Or is for an episode of Jackass?
post #15 of 28
:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTT View Post
OHHH MY GODDD:
post #16 of 28
Go to a pool first and practice doing Gainers off a spring board. If you can go off forward and flip backwards into a pool you may be ready for the snow, but you better be comfortable doing other tricks first and getting a fair amount of speed and air.
post #17 of 28
In order to ski the Big Coulier you need a shovel, probe and transceiver as well as a partner. You have two options in an attempt to hook up with someone. One is to post a bulletin on the board of the hotel you're staying at. The other is to hang around the ski patrol hut at the top of the tram hoping someone will feel sorry for you and take you along. I doubt you'll have much luck with either option.

Personally, I would never ski the Big Coulier with anyone I didn't know. While it might not be as steep as some terrain you've been on it is very, very long with no room for error. It is also very visually intimidating.
post #18 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtraheat View Post
I have not learned any other tricks, as I do not particularly like the terrain park, and I was wondering how difficult a backflip was. Also, how dangerous is it?


Second, what is the best way to get a partner for Lone Peak (Big Couloir/Headwaters type stuff) at Big Sky?

And yes, I have seen the slopes and done other slopes about as diffulct and am not a complete gaper (not completely one...)
xtraheat, to answer your question about how dangerous a back flip is: that depends!!!! If you know what you are doing and the terrain is safe -- it's not dangerous at all! If you don't -- you can end up dead!!

Second: Partner for the Big Couloir: I am one of the guides and I have taken 14 year olds into the Big. What does it take? A sign off from the guide! We would be the ones that would have to check you out and determine if you are capable of skiing it. Then you will need a sign off from your parents. They will have to come with you and sign the sheet at the top in the ski patrol room on the top of Lone Peak.

Third: Besides being able to ski it, we would have a session about "Self Arrest". You would need to learn what to do in case you would tumble and loose one or both skis. You will have to learn to control your slide and be able to get your feet below you. That session will take about an hour.

And, like Rio said, you will need a transceiver, shovel and a probe. (We do have that at the snow sports school for our clients.)

Let me know if you have more questions.
Ursula
post #19 of 28
Thread Starter 
Thanks everyone for the replies! Just to say to all the people saying I'm stupid... Why?? I'm not going out trying one right now, I'm asking you all so I don't get in over my head. Doesn't seem that stupid to me.
post #20 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by xtraheat View Post
Thanks everyone for the replies! Just to say to all the people saying I'm stupid... Why?? I'm not going out trying one right now, I'm asking you all so I don't get in over my head. Doesn't seem that stupid to me.

It doesn't seem stupid to you because you are 14! I personally have a cousin who when we were about your age decided that a certain stunt didn't seem that stupid to try...He's been a paraplegic ever since!
post #21 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Bear View Post

Second: Partner for the Big Couloir: I am one of the guides and I have taken 14 year olds into the Big. What does it take? A sign off from the guide! We would be the ones that would have to check you out and determine if you are capable of skiing it. Then you will need a sign off from your parents. They will have to come with you and sign the sheet at the top in the ski patrol room on the top of Lone Peak.
Gawd, thats lame. I would just poach it before jumping through all those hoops.
post #22 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilT View Post
Gawd, thats lame. I would just poach it before jumping through all those hoops.
Some opinions (by alleged pros) are better left unsaid on the internet Phil...Anyway, considering the Who's Who, I know who I'd listen to

Quote:
Ursula Howland (aka Little Bear)
PSIA Examiner and Clinic Leader (PSIA-NRM), instructor-trainer at Big Sky, Montana, German State Certified, one of SKI Magazine’s perennial Top-100 instructors, equipment expert, author of “Does the Boot Fit?” (in The Pro Skier), corporate pilot, 31 years of teaching experience
post #23 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilT View Post
Gawd, thats lame. I would just poach it before jumping through all those hoops.
Great advice for getting somebody permanently banned from Big Sky.
post #24 of 28
The problem with the poaching advice is that anyone who needs to do that probably doesn't have the skill to ski it, and they'll get hurt, then they'll draw resources away from the rest of the mountain for their own rescue which in turn hurts the rest of us who aren't so dumb. Worst case scenario one of the patrollers gets hurt rescuing the dummy who doesn't have any respect for anyone but themselves.
post #25 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilT View Post
Gawd, thats lame. I would just poach it before jumping through all those hoops.
Phil, thats not what you need to do to ski the big, its what you need to do for these 3rd party guides take you to ski the big. To ski the big all you need is a partner, and for you both to have shovel/beacon/probe. If its obvious you don't have a clue what you're doing, patrol might ask you some questions and maybe try and talk you out of it, but even then you could just ask to go for a run with a troller so they can see that you're good enough.

Don't go with the guide man, rent the gear and tap shoulder's in the tram line. Or send me a pm, as long as its not going to be a pow day.
post #26 of 28
Thread Starter 
Alright, thanks everyone! I'm at Big Sky right now (gunna wait till March to ski the Big) and this is kinda off-topic...But has anyone skied the Exit Chute on South Wall? Those were some of the best turns of my life! Got up there around 3 and there were about 2 tracks on it. Waist deep pow while some of the slopes I skied in the same day (Challenger lift.....) were icy and rocky.
post #27 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAGGOT View Post
Phil, thats not what you need to do to ski the big, its what you need to do for these 3rd party guides take you to ski the big. To ski the big all you need is a partner, and for you both to have shovel/beacon/probe.
Oh thanks for the clarification. I had thought all you needed was gear and a partner. (which is totally reasonable). I was just semi-outraged by the parental release, but now I get it.
post #28 of 28
Quote:
But has anyone skied the Exit Chute on South Wall? Those were some of the best turns of my life!
Shhhh!!!!! One of the joys of skiing Big Sky is its so huge most people never learn their way around so many places don't get skied out for days. If you find some of those places don't go telling everyone about it. BTW, a big storm is heading our way so you should be getting in some great turns Sunday and Monday.
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