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Cleats for skis?

post #1 of 41
Thread Starter 
Does anyone see a use for this idea? I have a good design that gives a little traction on the walk back to the lift. These little guys allows you to fly down. Any ideas?
post #2 of 41
Don't typically walk to the lifts. Other than maybe the first one of the day. Not sure what you are describing. A replacement for skins?
post #3 of 41
Most AT bindings offer ski crampons.
post #4 of 41
How about Cat Tracks? I think they're similar in design.
post #5 of 41
Thread Starter 

Have look at the photo and see what you think.
post #6 of 41
Your resolution leaves a lot to be desired. You taking pics with a cell phone?

Since it can't be seen, are you talking about that red arrow?
Does the device deploy? How do you keep it from creating drag?

I think most of us have no problem navigating to the lift using skating, herringbone or side-step. Walking has even been known to work.
post #7 of 41
Or choosing a line and skiing straight on.
post #8 of 41
Thread Starter 
These are all great points. The steps you mention will wear down a beginner or novice skiier. The red arrow is it. It is shaped like a wing of an aircraft to reduce drag.
post #9 of 41
I still don't understand how this works. And why you would want an airplane wing on the bottom of your skis. Is this like a glue on scale similar to the scales that waxless touring skis have underfoot?
post #10 of 41
I think the market for such a device would be very, very, very small. Most people by day 2 are able to at least side step. No matter the shape it is still going to slow somebody down. Also if you look at the skis out there, a lot of people are skiing on twin tips which give you the ability to ski backwards, those things would completely eliminate that ability for any ski. Nobody want to buy a ski or device that is going to limit their ability to progress, such a system does exactly that, it is only for the extreme beginner. Sorry to be harsh but just want to be honest.
post #11 of 41
Thread Starter 
Ok let's take a step back and look at this whole idea. Let's assume that most here are talking to Northern hemisphere people. (Yesterday I was speaking to people on the south part of this ball)

Now in the US and Canada we have an aging population that most likely be skiing backwards. And there are young and other beginners that want to ski and be able to move on a flat surface without tiring steps of the side step and skating.

The move that will be made easier is the cross country step. These cleats lay flat on the ski and do not have that much traction.

All for 10 dollars US or Canadian retail
post #12 of 41
Want to walk? Take off your skis. Free.
post #13 of 41
Believe me.. I am a very positive person. I look on the bright side of everything. I am entrepreneurially minded, and I'm generally not a person who would rain on someone's parade, but I gotta tell ya... there is just ZERO need for something like this.

post #14 of 41
What I don't get is if this were a big issue for someone they would just buy some waxless touring skis and ski on those with alpine binders. Not that making an XC stride in alpine boots and bindings is not a totally inefficient movement. And learning how to skate and side step actually strengthens muscles that you will use in skiing at higher levels.
post #15 of 41
I've re-read this and have come to the conclusion that skiwalker does not ski.
post #16 of 41
How does it install? Do have to cut the base to put it in place? Does it screw on? Does it glue on? Will it interfere with waxing and tuning the ski? Is it demountable without damaging the base of the ski?

You've thrown something out to us and asked can we use it. You haven't given us a good picture of it, told us how it works, told us how to mount it on the ski. You haven't given us a clear idea of the system. How do you expect us to respond? We don't have enough information to give you any proper feedback.

Have you tested this with a variety of skiers?

As you can see your initial post has generated more questions than answers.
post #17 of 41
Try to do a 360 on the snow. Try to pivot slip. Ridiculous.
post #18 of 41
or just glue on a piece of climbing skin like Karhu did with the Meta
post #19 of 41
What happens when you want to ski switch?
post #20 of 41

Serious Reply

Skating, herringbone, or side-step teach and reinforce edging skills. Assuming that the buyer for these belongs on the lift, they should have those skills to some degree.

Say that a buyer has those skills enough to descend the slope without endangering himself or others. Say also that those skills are weak enough that the buyer gets tired applying them on the way to the lift. Say also that the buyer gets tired poling or pushing.

Within the extremely tiny market defined by these thought experiment limits, there are even more problems.

Where on the base to stick the cleat? Too far forward, or too stiff a ski up front, and the buyer is sliding backwards when he tries to go up even the slightest incline. Longer cleats wouldn't have this problem, but would also mess up glide.

What happens if the cleat ices up?
post #21 of 41
Thread Starter 
Ok I think everyone is reading way too much in this. I went bought 200 dollar skis and don't ski that much, love it but don't ski much. I wanted to make my life easy. I love to shoot down and cut the turns-what I don't like is moving at the bottom of the hill.

I will never do 360's or ski backwards or any tricks, I just don't have the time. So I took these skis and put them through a lot testing. The end is thses cleats are glued on the bottom. I didn't want to put them there, but for safety reasons for the skier, fellow skiers, and grounds keepers this is where they landed. The fun factor had to stay there.

As for will they come off, last year they came off quite easily. They came off on the run down. I have some friends at Dow and they have given me some glue that will take the beating and conditions. They say some heat and they will pop off-maybe the ski will pop apart.

I have been vague to see what is out there and comments and also like the Kiwis covering the keel of their boat is to protect the design. And if anyone knows this market to put it in front of someone. Manufacturing and packaging is simple for here in North America and I also have contacts in China.

So let's have some fun. This design maybe horrible, it works for me the 20-30 time skier per year.
post #22 of 41
Originally Posted by Skiwalker View Post
This design maybe horrible, it works for me the 20-30 time skier per year.
I think you just figured out your market.
post #23 of 41
Originally Posted by Skiwalker View Post
This design maybe horrible, it works for me the 20-30 time skier per year.
Anybody skiing 20 or 30 times a year is skiing way, way more then the vast majority of people (at least here in the USA). I think the number of days that the "average skier" gets out is somewhere around 7.

I would hope that any skier who logs 20+ days a year is more then capable of moving around on the flats / slight uphills without the aid of any sort of "cleat".

Skiers who might benefit from such a gadget probably aren't the type who will be searching through ski gear catalogs or hanging out in ski shops looking for an item such as the one you're proposing. Skiers who do look through catalogs / hang out in shops will have the reaction you're getting here.

I'm glad you found a way to increase your enjoyment of the slopes. However, I honestly believe that you are the only person who needs such a device. i.e., the market size for such an item is one. You.
post #24 of 41
Thread Starter 
So, I will ask-why should I move like everyone else when their might be a better way. Your enjoyment might also be enlightened by having these 7 day guys move more quickly out of your way.

And I'll take a pair.
post #25 of 41
Where do you ski that there are so many flats and people on them?

If you're clever, a snowboard design might sell quite well. Maybe more of a lightning bolt shape?
post #26 of 41
Thread Starter 
There are a fair amount of 20 second hills such as Lakeridge, Dagmar, and a good resort of Blue Mountain is not far either. The 20 second hills can get quite crowded as well as Blue Mountain. In the Toronto area.

I see that the snowboard is more flexible and these cleats are ridgid. Some cool looking decal underlays might be nice.
post #27 of 41
I think it's good that you're trying out new ideas. The only market I see for this would be on kids skis, or for beginners. I often see them scrambling around for traction in the lift line and tripping all over everyone else's skis in the process. This could potentially help them out. They also wouldn't notice the slight drag hit on their skis when going forward (whereas most of us probably would). On the other hand, I hope a device like this wouldn't prevent these people from learning proper skills -- any skier should be able to get around without too much trouble, and that includes flat terrain, slight uphills, and lift lines. Skiers should not have to depend on a device for that sort of thing.
post #28 of 41
I think you'd be better off with some type of deployable brake, similar to the brake on the binding, but mounted such that you could pop the release with your pole and then re-latch (lift) it with the same pole when you're done with it. Market might be small beginner children - too young and uncoordinated to skate, etc as we all do once we 'learn'.

It would probably have to be integrated around the binding area near the boot, and would probably scream 'short bus'. If anything, a secondary brake with a release/catch mounted around/under the binding might at least be somewhat disguised.

But only for children. Parents buy everything to make things easier for their kids so that their kids will be easier for them. This might fall in that bag.

Then of course there are the lawsuits from the people who are (arguably) pathetic enough to need such a thing.

At the end of the day, if you invested all that mad-scientist time in skiing, you might forget you ever thought to invent such a thing. Otherwise, don't be dismayed, but don't expect to make much money real quick either.
post #29 of 41
Thread Starter 
I went this route last year around the bindings and even at the back. The ski looked bad and in a spill the hardware might have done some damage.
post #30 of 41
Why do people spend their time thinking about improving what skiing is not, ie walking, with devices that detract from actually skiing?

So much time is spent waxing and tuning skis so they will glide. How about just not waxing ever? Like clean off all the wax and leave it. How about, using X-country grip wax instead, from tip to tail? You'll be skiiing blacks on day one.

This product is absurd.
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