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A Big Frickin' Asterisk - Page 2

post #31 of 38

oopsie! ;)

post #32 of 38
"Say it ain't so Joe!" ..... little kid to Shoeless Joe Jackson 1919 Series fixing scandal ... :

They knew, they did it, end of story.

Yank em' out of the books.

"The Babe" ... he did it on hot dogs, booze .... and a "short porch" ...
post #33 of 38
OK...before we get all traditonal, consider:

1. Baseball players...for many years, have openly used amphetamines. They were only banned last year.

2. HGH was not banned until the 2005 season. Steroids were not banned until the end of the 2002 season. Players who used those drugs before the bans DID NOT BREAK ANY RULES. This includes Bonds' 73 hr season and the Mcgwire/Sosa battle.

3. The owners and MLB officials had to know. If they claim ignorance, they are f'ing liars, Bud included.

Asteriks? No. Just realize that comparing eras to one another is full of problems.

BTW...that Clemens pic is classic. Altough he helped my guys out a lot, I've always kinda thought he was an a-hole.
post #34 of 38
This is too funny!

So, following your logic, since MLB hasn't banned U-235 or Pu-239 it would be Ok to use them in a game?

er .... pssssst ... they (steroids and amphetamines), are illegal, or have I been just missing them in aisle #3 of the stupormarket?

post #35 of 38
honestly I didn't like him the last several years with the Sox. Never mind how good he was - just his Texas attitude I think.

But Schilling ... he's different

It is very interesting that Dan Duquette claimed that Clemens was in the twilight of his career and if it turns out to be true he would have been, but for the roids. He started doing them in Toronto.

This is going to affect his whole schtick

Roger Clemens' topic for his convention to talk is to be, ``My Vigorous Workout, How I Played So Long.''

- apparently he is probably going to cancel talking to kids about his workout.

Once Pettitte came clean it had to be a bit of a wakeup for him....

Then there's the legacy, the Cys and of course the HOF voting.
post #36 of 38
I liked the way Schlling called Clemens out.

But, I wonder, when all of this started hitting the fan and you know we were all scanning for "who coulda's" .... Schilling was on my suspect list too. Clemens was up there for sure.
post #37 of 38
Schilling actually backed off his earlier statements. He can be as duplicitous as the next guy when it comes down to it. But generally I like him.

Of course there is the whole story of how Roger made him what he is today because of some meeting early on in Schill's career. Big Schill is not going to be a lock for HOF as Roger was (until recently at least), only thing I can see is the postseason record making him a possible candidate.

This isn't yet resolved ... I'm really interested to see how things unfold. He might be wise to take the path Pettitte took "I only needed it for injury rejuvenation" as some others have done - maybe rather than a patent denial some kind of limited confession. Which I still think as a purist is a bit suspect itself, but ... it seems to take the public pressure off.
post #38 of 38
For many of the athletes on the Mitchell list, several have come out and acknowledged their use. But the dates are important here too!

MLB did not ban the use of these PED's until quite recently. If they were not illegal when taken, how can the athletes be held up as criminals now?

Thats like saying every stock car that raced without a restrictor plate is now going to be stripped of any titles won prior to restrictor plates even having been developed!

Was it ethical? Thats not for me to say. But if they were taking them when they were not banned, and did not take them after the ban, then there is no case to be debated. If they took them after the ban, then thats another situation altogether.

Another point that bugs me-. These PED's must be taken on an extended regular basis, not just once or twice, for them to have the magical effects most people seem to think they have.

It's ridiculous to think that if I got one or two shots of juice, that I would hit like Bonds or Maguire or run like Marion. In each case of proven use, a schedule always seem to come out, showing the use took place over an extended period of time.

I have not heard anybody discuss this as part of the report. Only the cry of "PED's are illegal/ banned, and these people took them!" The context is missing and therefore dimishes the entire report, IMO.

It was asked earlier if steroids and HGH aren't illegal, full stop. No, they are not! They are controlled substances, to be prescribed by a licensed medical physician. I was injected with steroids to help fight an infection in my leg earlier this summer. Am I a criminal? HGH was developed and is administered to promote accelerated healing of injuries. If prescribed by a Dr, does that make using them illegal? If an athlete buys these drugs without a legitimate scrip, then you have another case to try.

Just like with druggies, it's not the use of the drug which is illegal, it's the purchase and possession of them which is. (unless operating a motor vehicle or bicycle under the influence, again, another type of case)

I am not condoning the use of PED"s or drugs. But unless it can be proved that these drugs were used AFTER the bans were established, and that they were obtained illegally, then I do not see where the public 'outing' of those players on the list was warranted. With this report and list, these players were judged guilty before the media court, the evidence nothing but the statements of a few individuals. No charges have been filed (other than Bond's obstruction charges) against any athlete for having violated either of the two standards I previously mentioned. Granted, the Grand Jury is certainly looking at who they can make a sacrificial lamb, to prove how 'tough' they are on PED use.

A law is either in the works or possibly just passed here in Texas, where ANY HIGH SCHOOL athlete may be tested for PED use at any time. They must obviously believe that a serious problem exists even at that level. If it does exist, then I hope this contains it. But I surely hope this is not just a politicians effort to chase shadows, in the effort to show that something is being done about this terrible epidemic.
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