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Movement Analysis (MA) 101: What's Your Process?

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
Movement Analysis (MA) 101: What's Your Process?

1. What is your process (checklist/list of questions/etc.) that you use to perform a movement analysis (assume that you have both regular speed and slow motion video to analyze)?

2. What do you look at 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and so on (skis - spray from skis, edging, flex; ankles; knees; hips; core; spine; shoulders; hands; arms; head; balance; edging; rotary; pressure control; line; turn shape; pole movements; eyes; turn phases; alignment; inclination; upper body rotation; counter rotation; blocking pole plant; leg rotation; fore/aft movements; lateral movements; vertical movements; motivations; other activities; equipment; psychological factors; morphological factors; tactics; technique; direction-accuracy-intensity-duration; flexion-extension; disruption; etc.)? Please be specific as possible.

i.e.
Is the skier balanced (fore/aft, laterally)?
Is the snow spray from the tip, middle or tail of the ski?
Do the edges change at the same time?
Are the skis tipped progressively through the turn or suddenly at the end?
What is the turn shape (C, comma, Z)? Why?

3. What software if any do you use?
V1 Sports www.v1ski.com
Dartfish www.dartfish.com/en/software/index.htm

4. What are your favorite resources for drills (specify names of books, articles, websites, cds, dvds, etc.?)


I will give you three scenarios and if your movement analysis process varies for any of the scenarios, please also note the differences.

Scenario A: Level 8-9 skier freeskiing on groomed trail

Scenario B: Level 8-9 skier racing in a Giant Slalom course (USSA masters/J1 type course)

Scenario C: Level 8-9 skier racing in a Slalom course (USSA masters/J1 type course)


I am trying to gain an understanding of how folks do movement analysis. Thanks in advance for your help.

If you feel that your MA process has been influenced by a particular methodology or background (PSIA, CSIA, APSI, BASI, NZSIA, USSCA, CSCF, HH, MSR, racing, etc.), feel free to note that as well.


When I Googled "movement analysis", I found the following (If you know of other good links, please post them):

Movement Analysis Process Handout 07-08.pdf from PSIA Rocky Mountain Division Alpine Education Material Download Page http://www.psia-rm.org/ed_materials....cipline=Alpine

PSIA Visual Cues to Effective and Ineffective Skiing www.psia.org/interactive/htm/Alpine05.htm

Ron LeMaster - Seeing Skiing: Developing a Good Eye www.ronlemaster.com/presentations.html
post #2 of 39
IMO intent is very important. Without knowing exactly what the person skiing is trying to do and why its impossible to determine if the outcome is good or bad. Even bad outcome can be good sometimes when you are trying to brake a bad habbit or when you are in the learning prosess of something new.

Also how the person felt during the performance is of great importance. Both emotionally and physically. Sometimes the only way we can pinpoint a sertain movement is when we feel something, for example pressure somewhere or maybe the lack of it.

Conditions are also important to know because they can make or brake your performance. And we should not forget reference skiers. They are never posted in videos here at the net for different very logical reasons but out there on the mountain its easy because usually I ski first and then I use myselfe as a reference in addition to other group members or simply other skiers just passing by. I try to film on video and I edit all my filming with SonyVegas and post it on www.topeverything.com for viewing and downloading.
post #3 of 39
I go through a checklist that goes something like this:

"I see a (level ?) skier making (round, j-shaped, <-shaped) turns in a (skidded, carved) fashion. The skier's stance is (centered, fore, aft) and looks (proactive, defensive). The skis are (sliding, carving, skidding, slipping.) and the skier initiates the turn by (?) controls it with (?) and finishes by (?)."

Once I memorized this quick paragraph in my head, it makes for a fast, objective analysis with no qualifying factors... only quantifying factors. It does require a solid knowledge of the many possibilities and movement patterns that all levels of skiers go through, (something that I'm always working on!) but it shouldn't really be all that hard to plug into any teaching system.

I've also seen MA pared down to simply "What are the skis doing, what are the body parts affecting them, and what movements are occurring?" Haven't messed with it enough yet to guage its effectiveness.

Spag
post #4 of 39
MA 101 wouldn't start with level 8-9 skiing as a model. So in a way the question is a bit of an impossibility. A second misconception is that we do MA from a video. It is one tool but it has limitations and should not be considered our primary visual source. In short nothing replaces a good eye watching live performances.
So with those qualifications being said the idea should be to get a global impression of what you are witnessing. Watch the skis and determine how they are interacting with the snow. Identify carve,skid, balance point, etc. Then ask yourself why the skis are acting that way, what is the skier doing to make that happen? If that is the stated task/goal then there isn't much more to determine. If not, we need to start asking what changes need to happen to bring about the desired outcome. Mind you understanding how everything connects takes time and experience. Getting that experience means investing in reference materials and working with an experienced instructor, both on the hill and in a classroom setting. Sources include USSA, PSIA, CSIA, HARB, or whatever system you are currently working within. Ask your SSD or trainer for specifics. I'm sure they will guide you in the right direction.
post #5 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by justanotherskipro View Post
MA 101 wouldn't start with level 8-9 skiing as a model. So in a way the question is a bit of an impossibility.

I don't necessarily agree with this.

Movement analysis is a tool for instucting and coaching, and like many other tools, it requires practice and experience for efficient use.

That being said... for most purposes of instructor training and coach training, level 8-9 skiing is a great model to use for developing movement analysis skills... just as good as any other level of skiing, IMO. Even a level 3-4 skier can be taught the basics of analyzing the movements a level 8-9 skier.


Spag, I like your checklist. Well done.
post #6 of 39
This is from a post of mine in another thread.

Quote:
Yeah, I'm a big picture first person. I look at posture and movement in the whole body to get a base line of how they are balancing and moving. Then I focus on the skis interaction on the snow, and look for the effect the movements and posture are having on the skis. From here I will either prioritize from a movement perspective or from an energy perspective, or both. In other words, what movements are creating what ski actions, as well as what movement are they putting the most energy into. Following the energy can tell us a lot. Then I look at what action I would like to see from the skis, and determine what movement(s) need to change to accomplish this change, and just as important, what might block or get in the way of this change happening. Sometimes it might be more important to remove a blockage.

Both the skills concept and the D.I.R.T concept are great tools for evaluation purposes IMO, but I don't teach "skills". I like to think of it as teaching the relationships between our movements and outcomes. And of course the entire student profile, mind body and spirit, is a determining factor in which way to go.

Some look at the skis first, some may look at the stance and alignment first. In the end it is important to develope a personal system that works for you, and to continually work to expand and evolve that system.



I agree with Jasp. MA 101 should start with skiing 101. I remember when in my level 1 exam we were surprisingly asked to do MA on our ski school director. Needless to say we were all a little overwhelmed and intimidated by this task along with not being very successfull. This is not to say that we shouldn't tie low end common movements to high end common movements as we learn, only that we need to learn to walk before we learn to run.
post #7 of 39
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Notorious Spag View Post
...
I've also seen MA pared down to simply "What are the skis doing, what are the body parts affecting them, and what movements are occurring?" Haven't messed with it enough yet to guage its effectiveness.

Spag
Quote:
Originally Posted by justanotherskipro View Post
...Watch the skis and determine how they are interacting with the snow. Identify carve,skid, balance point, etc. Then ask yourself why the skis are acting that way, what is the skier doing to make that happen? If that is the stated task/goal then there isn't much more to determine. If not, we need to start asking what changes need to happen to bring about the desired outcome...
this is what we're being trained to do at the resort where I work. At first I was resistant (always having liked looking at the big picture, then working on different body parts); however, hafta say looking at what the skis are doing really focuses one on the task at hand.

Brings up a question/comment: is this being implemented RM div wide?
post #8 of 39
I look at the big picture first and the movements skier make. I often do this in a follow me situation where I pick the speed, turn shape, and of course, the terrain. I know the snow condition, b/c it is real time. I do this by looking over my sholder as I ski. I first look at transition movements, turn shape, then balance. That allows me to make my assessment on cause and effect.

I like to make my analsys on a pitchcy part of the slope (from green to d. black depending on the skier level), b/c that is where peoples skiing tend to fall apart.

RW
post #9 of 39
I look at the skis/feet to determine what they're doing. Then I try to figure out what's causing any outcomes I don't like. It might be the feet themselves or it might be what's going on elsewhere in the skier.

I agree that MA 101 needs to begin with Skiing 101 to develop a full understanding. Level 8 skiers can mask a lot of mistakes.
post #10 of 39
Let's see, we have a level 8-9 skier.

What's the goal, what's the self evaluation, what's the expectation?

When the student is skiing as close to the goal as they can, what is the flow of the center of mass and does it become static at any point during the task? Is there any inhibition due to alignment or anatomical issues? That is always number one with me on a level 8-9 skier.

If the center of mass becomes static, where does it become static, at what point in the turn? Where does the CM become un-static. Does the static nature begin in the upper body or lower body? Where does movement cease first?

If movement of the cm ceases first in the lower body is the edging and steering continuous? Where does edge engagement begin? where does it end? Is there a flat neutral with good athletic stance? How is flexion and extension being applied? What becomes static first and causes the kinetic chain to break down. Is what I am seeing alignment or technique?

If movement becomes static in the upper body first, is it in the arms and hands or in the core? Is anticipation and countering movements appropriate?


Out of this evaluation where does the inefficiency start and what is the single best movement pattern that I can introduce that will best achieve the students goal? What is the best way to introduce that change in movement pattern to put a smile on the face of my student? Do we have enough time to accomplish the goal?

If the center of mass does not become static then our skier probably does not have any lacking fundamentals in their skiing and we can concentrate on timing, tactics and blending of skills to achieve the goal.

Is the student in agreement with the evaluation and do we agree on the best way to get to the goal. Is the student really comprehending the changes we are after of not? If not, how do we modify or bring in transfer learning? Can we back down and break things down into simpler progressions? Are we going to accomplish the goal in the time frame we have set?

I spend much more time looking at a level 8-9 skier before talking then I do an level 6-7 skier. I now have a lot of experience teaching at this level.
post #11 of 39
Thread Starter 

Resources for Skiing / Snowboarding / Racing Drills & Skills?

Keep the detailed advice coming. I appreciate the time that you take to respond.

Please do not get hung up on the 101 in the thread title. If you have a movement analysis 101 process and a movement analysis advanced process that you currently use, please feel free to detail both processes.



For those of you that have not responded to questions #3 and/or #4, I am interested in your advice.


3. What software & version if any do you use for movement analysis?

V1 Sports (V1 Home Basic - no cost, V1 Home Premium, V1 Professional) www.v1ski.com

Dartfish (Dartfish Connect, Dartfish Connect Plus, Dartfish ProSuite, Dartfish TeamPro) www.dartfish.com/en/software/index.htm

General media player with slow motion capability
VLC (no cost) www.videolan.org/vlc/



4. What are your favorite resources for drills & skills (specify names of books, articles, websites, cds, dvds, etc.?)

Resources for Skiing / Snowboarding / Racing Drills & Skills

CSCF Canadian Ski Coaches Federation - CSCF Entry Level Coach Material section (no cost downloads):
www.snowpro.com/cscf/e/downloads.html

* Drills and Exercises (60+ free skiing drills & 30+ gate skiing drills, 128 pages) www.snowpro.com/posts/cscf/e/20070206084932.pdf

* Snow Stars Technical Manual (many drills, 97 pages) www.snowpro.com/posts/cscf/e/20051215160711.pdf

USSA - Coaches Resource Center:
http://athletics.ussa.org/
* Alpine Ski Fundamentals 1 cd
* Alpine Ski Fundamentals 2 cd
* Alpine Tactics cd

* Fundamentals of Giant Slalom by Finn Gunderson (US Ski Team - Director of Alpine Education)
http://athletics.ussa.org/alpine/tec...al_discussions

Greg Gurshman (Austrian, U.S., Canadian coach) - Coaching & Instruction sections: http://youcanski.com/en/

Modern Ski Racing - Technique section: www.modernskiracing.com/technique_links.php
post #12 of 39
Scott,
I cannot stress strongly enough that MA is not a computer or video skill. It is an on the hill evaluation of a skier. Call it my pet peive but way too many individuals here have never made ski films, or training films. They lack the cinematic training to understand how to use a camera effectively. They also do not understand that the footage is just a two dimensonal representation of three dimensional action. Without the depth and binocular vision (two eyes) it is easy to miss details that you would see in person.

In so far as a level 8-9 MA, compensatory movements are there but you need to know what you are looking at before you would even notice them.
Using that footage to teach level 4's would be as innappropriate as doing level 9 demos for those students. Everything we do needs to be relevent to the class. The question itself show a lack of experience, slow down and learn the basics before you jump into more difficult assessment activities.
post #13 of 39
Thread Starter 
JASP/others - I do not mean to downplay the importance of the on the hill movement analysis skill. However, quite often on EpicSki we see videos of folks that we may not have the opportunity to ski with in person. Also, I do hear the point about learning the basics of movement analysis and am interested in hearing details of both processes of movement analysis (101 basics & advanced as mentioned in post #11).

My questions should be also considered from the perspective that if video is available, how do you perform movement analysis on the video and what tools (software, drills) do you find useful?
post #14 of 39
skierscott,

I do real time MA, there is no slowmo or replay. Often it is done while I am skiing and not even watching where I am going or while I am skiing backwards (sometimes quite fast on steep icy slopes). There is no software, no manuals, no comparison or model skier, and no resources other than my own knowledge and training. MA on a vid is such a piece of cake compared to what I do at work b/c it can be slowed down, enlarged, stop action and replayed many times.

On the slopes I have about 10 sec. to get it right and often there is more than one skier to watch, sometimes as many as 12 in an instructor clinic. If I miss someone, I apologise and make shure I watch them next time we are in motion.

AS far as vid clips on epic, I use the same process that I do on the hill, I use no software other than my eyes, ears, and experience. Any drills that I may describe to the person on the clip comes from my own experience of a drill that would develope the skill needed to change or enhance the performance of the skier.

RW
post #15 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkierScott View Post
Movement Analysis (MA) 101: What's Your Process?


I am trying to gain an understanding of how folks do movement analysis. Thanks in advance for your help.
Are you doing this as part of instructor training? Are you on a ski school staff? Your best bet to learning how to watch skiers and develop MA skills is to stand at the side of slopes typically skied by the kind of skier you want to do MA for with a very experienced member of the school and talk about skiers as they approach and pass you. Then spend all your time on chair lifts doing the same thing both with your mentor and by yourself.
post #16 of 39
Thread Starter 
There are two main reasons that I'm interested in movement analysis. First, I'm stuck at a plateau as I try to move from an advanced racer to an expert racer on USSA masters/J1 style courses. Second, from time to time as an amateur I shoot some photos/videos of my local race league and would like to help folks on my team and in my league to improve as well as to potentially encourage more skiers/boarders to consider racing. I plan to spend more time on the side of my race courses near key transition sections watching racers and developing my MA skills.
post #17 of 39
Try to find a coach who will let you eavesdrop on some of his pointers to his racers at the bottom of the course. Maybe schlep some gates in trade for some information??? Or get your team to take a race lesson and spend most of your time with the coach.
post #18 of 39
Good advice Neale! I totally agree with the idea that coaching is a better solution.


Scott, The problem with point and shoot MA footage is that in most cases you cannot glean enough information from the video. The footage needs context and a defined goal before you can determine if the skier is performing the chosen maneuver correctly. Which IMO means shooting footage of a drill, or of an excercise makes more sense.
That being said, IMO shooting video to determine their tactical and strategic solutions will certainly help you understand what choces they made. However, I would be quick to point out that it does not mean those choices would be appropriate for you, or anyone else. Especially if it's world cup footage. Is it relevent to your racing to attempt maneuvers that they are using? Maybe but in most cases cleaning up the movemetns you use currently is more effective.
post #19 of 39
This is an interesting thread. I'll try and make just a few points to get it back on track.

Point 1: The reason you dont start doing MA on a Level 8/9 skier, and thus the reason you dont start teaching there, is "areas for improvement" in low ends skiers are very easy to spot...for example a level 3 skier may be sitting back....when they do, it tends to be "alot" back, and they tend to be back the whole time. Thus it is easy to spot.

For a Level 8/9 skier, they may also be back, but it will tend to only be for a short instant of time, at a small portion of the turn, much much harder to spot....hence it takes time to develop that eye to spot those things. Further when a Level 8/9 skier is skiing at their full potential (or any skier for that matter) it is important to recognise "one offs" from "the way they ski"...ie if a skier is back in one turn, this one time...it is not something you would harp on, unless everyhing else was perfect...but that is not likely.

Point 2: Intent is a really overblown idea. Truthfully I see it as an excuse. If your MA is bang on, you can do it on any skier, skiing anything, and you will come to the same conclusions...we ski how we ski. I am willing to bet that if I shot video of your best ski buddy (ie someone you watch alot) you will be able to pick them out of crowd, whether they are in the bumps, gates, pow, groomer, short turn, long turn. The reason is, their "style" doesn't change....there well developed skills will always show, and their lacking ones will too.

Point 3: JASP is bang on that MA is not a video skill, but rather a on hill skill. When doing video on hill with clients, the way to use is to make your assesment on the hill, the use the video to simply show them, what you meant and perhaps why you are saying what you are saying. Ie, you might on the hill notice a skier is banking, hence you might say to them "at the top of the turn try to keep your shoulders more level, it will feel like a pinch in your side here"....then later with the video show them what you saw...

Point 4: There is no ONE "right or wrong" MA process...ie there are lots of effective ways....but there are many many more ineffective ways. The key thou is this: To be an effective MA process the process MUST identify the root cause of the problem.....all too often instructors just end up fixing symptoms, which just results in them chasing their tails and studens wasting time and money.
post #20 of 39
Great points, 'dude
post #21 of 39
Dude, Identifying what movements were used is a large part of MA but it is meaningless without comparing the actual outcome to the intended outcome. Without that context it's just Movement Identification. Movement Analysis includes much more than how. It's also an assessment of tactical choices, how well they performed the chosen tactics, and how well those tactics match the situation (terrain, snow, etc...).
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post
Point 2: Intent is a really overblown idea. Truthfully I see it as an excuse. If your MA is bang on, you can do it on any skier, skiing anything, and you will come to the same conclusions...we ski how we ski. I am willing to bet that if I shot video of your best ski buddy (ie someone you watch alot) you will be able to pick them out of crowd, whether they are in the bumps, gates, pow, groomer, short turn, long turn. The reason is, their "style" doesn't change....there well developed skills will always show, and their lacking ones will too.
I say this is nuts. I say there is a world of difference between a level 8 skier and a level 9 skier. Learning to tell them apart takes a lot of practice and you yourself pretty much need to be at that level and be present to really tell the difference.

Intent has everything to do with working with a level 9 skier as everything else is just nit picking. Tactical blending skills to produce intent is 100% of what a level 9 skier will seek help for.

A level 8 skier still has some issues with fundamental movement patterns that you can zero in on but here again. Intent means a lot. If the skier sought you out to cut lift lines and get some pointers on a powder day that skier's intent means everything. Those few fundamental issues may not be a hindrance to the intent at hand.
post #23 of 39
Individual style is a definite fact. But its as much due to an individual's body composition, and how that influences their technical approach, as it is specific technical flaws and idiosyncrasies. This can even be seen in skiers at the level of WC racers, where individuals can be as stylistically distinct as they are equally effective. And I've always found it interesting how sometimes the style of family members can be so similar. A circumstance I credit genetic similarities some influence.

Intent is certainly important to understand, but my guess would be the majority of students ski instructors work with will have intents of no more technical detail then just getting down the hill the best they can. If you asked them the state of balance they are trying to assume, both fore and aft, in each phase of a turn,,, the type of transition they are trying to execute,,, the form of angulation they are striving for, when and where,,, if they're trying to carve or steer,,, how much steer angle they're trying to use,,, the turn shape they're attempting,,, at what point, in what manner, and how much counter they're trying to introduce,,, where/how they're trying to apply flexion/extension,,, if they're trying to include any pivot, and how much,,, most would just look at you with a blank stare, and the rest would run back to the ski school desk to ask for an instructor who speaks English. At some point intent becomes a commodity the coach supplies as a goal for the student to pursue, and is chosen based on the instructors evaluation of the students generally monotypic skiing.

SkierScott, if you want to know a good system for MA, a good starting point would be to evaluate a students skiing based on the technical areas I described in the above paragraph. Once you get a handle on that, and define what you see not as intent, but simply as what they are doing, then introduce some drills that require the execution of slightly different options in those technical areas and see how well the student is able to modify and adapt. Areas that present difficulty in breaking out of default execution patterns represent areas that need attention.
post #24 of 39
I am surprised by the response to my "intent" position.

Good skiing is good skiing. Intent is irrelavant. For example, you are either in balance, or you are not. To say that with one intent you are in balance, and with another intent you are out is ridiculous.

The goal of any instructor or coach is to improve a skiers skills...how they apply them is tactical...but again regardless of the tactics they may or may not be employing, I can still determine where their skill deficiences are. Further if required, I can improve the tactics they choose....I dont need the student to tell me their "intent"...I know what it should be. Now before everyone jumps down my throat, that is not to say I am telling people where to ski, or when...they can say I want to improve my bumps...but that is not tactics....nor does it effect what needs to be improved...it only alters the lesson flavour...ie if the student is looking to improve their bumps, the lesson will spend a certain amount of time in bumps to play with the ideas I introduce....but I can say with a fairly high degree of certainty that in 98% of cases that I will work on the same things regardless of intent. Hence my position that intent is irrelevant.

To elaborate on above: As conditions get more challenging, skill deficiences have greater consequences. Hence while while skiing a blue groomer, a skier may feel that got it right, and they only struggle in bumps....this is simply wrong. If they skied the blue groomer properly they could take that same technique into the bumps and also ski those well. Hence the skill improvements I may make to improve their bumps will also transfer across to improve their groomer skiing, their powder, long turns and short....skill development is skill development...better skills = greater ability in ALL conditions.

A point to consider. The above is the reason why many instructors going for their higher certs will sometimes pass their high end but fail their wedge turns. A lack of skills is a lack of skills....ironically at speed, you can often mask things....when you slow it down to a wedge or the dreaded parallel with traverse used on the CSIA 4, you cannot hide anything...either the skills are there....or they are not.
post #25 of 39
I would say without a doubt that Skidude and Rick have a different definition of a level 8-9 skier than JASP and myself. Seems like their definition is more like my level 7-8. I deal with a lot of 7-8 skiers and almost always works on skiing deficiencies as Skidude and Rick suggest.

A level 9 skier in my opinion does not have skiing deficiencies. If you can recognize this you can help the level 9 skier much more than nitpicking on small stuff that does not occur with every turn. All level 9 skiers that I have worked with I have personally known ahead of time.

The conversation goes something like this. Pierre I am trying to (fill in the blank) but don't seem to be able to pull it off every time. Will you take a look and tell me what you see. In most cases the level 9 skier has been pushing the envelope and is outside the traditional box so their timing is not in order and they have no intention of putting their timing in order. They want to know how to pull off what they are doing with the tactics they are using and are usually missing a piece.

If you do not listen to the intent or recognize that this is a skier who does not have skiing deficiencies, you will only waste their time by trying to correct what they are doing to a movement pattern they already own. Just because their timing is off does not mean that they are deficient in their skills or need their firing order of motions corrected to a standard they have long since passed. Their intent means everything in the MA process. If you provide the missing piece, they already have the muscle memory to add the missing piece in.

A level 8+ skier is one who has some skiing deficiencies that I am going to zero in on but here again, what they are asking for may be tactical instead of fundamental and their deficiencies may not always be relevant. If that is the case, I am going to work on tactics instead of zero in on the deficiencies.

With a level 7-8 skier I am almost always going to zero in on a skiing deficiency that is inhibiting what they are trying to accomplish.
post #26 of 39
Dude,
Yes skills quantification is important but it is not the whole picture. GCT was invented to move us beyond movement identification. Which should tell you something about how important relevence is to our customers. It was their feedback driving that change.
I've attended seminars where the speaker didn't do enough research about the audience and I watched them lay an egg. I've also watched more than a few ski instructors do that because they forgot the fact that their student came to the lesson with an agenda and it was not addressed during the lesson. Identifying why a student uses a movement is just as important as indentifying the movement. Helping them improve means helping them make better tactical decisions as well as executing those chosen tactics better.
post #27 of 39
Pierre, my prior post comments (especially the suggestions of "monotypic" skiing) were directed primarily towards the average ski school student. My guess would be that person would be well below level 9.

I'd also add that my teaching history has been one of working extensively with level 9+ students. Skill base deficits dwell even in that high realm of the skiing world. They usually are in the form of needing refinement, and can be at the root of difficulties a student is finding in blending skills to achieve a desired result. The formula I use with high level skiers is a combination of guiding them toward new blends of skills, and refining the skills they're using in the blend.
post #28 of 39
to the original post... A little formula that works well for a lot of instructors:
B-A-T-S-I.
BALANCE; First thing to look at, if it's off, there's your lesson plan. ATTITUDE; is the student comfortable on the terrain or are they over matched for their skill level (body language).
TURN; what is the shape and what is the power source?
SKILL; what skills are they using, what skills do they need improvement on?
INSTRUCTION; what is the one thing I can give this student today that will make the greatest improvement in their skiing experience.
BATS-I.
post #29 of 39
Just so that no one here is missing what the original poster wrote.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkierScott View Post
Movement Analysis (MA) 101: What's Your Process?

Scenario A: Level 8-9 skier freeskiing on groomed trail

Scenario B: Level 8-9 skier racing in a Giant Slalom course (USSA masters/J1 type course)

Scenario C: Level 8-9 skier racing in a Slalom course (USSA masters/J1 type course)


I am trying to gain an understanding of how folks do movement analysis. Thanks in advance for your help.
post #30 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
Pierre, my prior post comments

I'd also add that my teaching history has been one of working extensively with level 9+ students. Skill base deficits dwell even in that high realm of the skiing world. They usually are in the form of needing refinement, and can be at the root of difficulties a student is finding in blending skills to achieve a desired result. The formula I use with high level skiers is a combination of guiding them toward new blends of skills, and refining the skills they're using in the blend.
It is clear to me that we are using different definitions in this thread. You are defining a level 9 skier as having skill based deficiencies yet you go on to say "in the form of needing refinement". In my opinion if a skier already owns a movement pattern they are not lacking in base skill deficiencies but the "need for refinement" is tactical refinement, not base skills. I don't know if we are saying the same thing or not.
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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › Ski Training and Pro Forums › Ski Instruction & Coaching › Movement Analysis (MA) 101: What's Your Process?