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DIY Baking Intuition/Thermoflex Liners

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
First, i am really cheap. I have six kids and if I don't keep skiing as inexpensive as possible, my wife will do something drastic. I understand that I may ruin the liners, but lets stipulate that I am going to do them myself.

I have copied the following information from TGR and have watched the video on the tele site. Is their any other information that I should be aware of before turning on the oven?

First, get a foam pad, like a camping pad. Cut off little chunks and stick between your big and litle toes. Tape in place. Then, get a big thick heavy sock, and cut the toe part off. Stick this over your toes to form a toe cap. You can add more material if you want. Then, tape your custom footbeds to your feet (if you use em). Then, grab a pair of your mom's/girlfriend's/wife's nylons, and put them on over everything. If you don't have a mom/girlfriend/wife with nylons, a Safeway plastic shopping bag will do as well (it reduces friction so you can get your packaged foot into the soft liner).

Now, pull out the oven racks, and preheat your oven to 300 degrees. Get some aluminum foil, and when the oven is hot, turn the temperature down to 200, and put the foil over the heating elements (to prevent the radiation from burning the liners). Put in the COLD oven rack, and stuff the liners into the oven. MAKE SURE that there's enough room for the liners to expand without touching anything. I neglected to do this and put some holes in the tops of mine (no biggie, fix with duct tape).

Check the liners every minute after 6 minutes to see if they're ready. If they're all soft, warm, and mushy, they're done.

Shove the liners into your boots. Take a few extra seconds and make sure they're fitting well everywhere, without wrinkles, etc. Then, stuff your packaged foot into the shell. Pull up on the top of the liner, gently, and make sure the front of the liner is correctly folded, tongue in the right place.

Then buckle the boot lightly, kick your heel against the ground a few times, and stand around for 15 minutes.

Done.

The thick toecaps and toe spacers should give you the room you need. The liner will feel very tight when you first put it on. My toes are typically painful while the liners are cooling, but once I pull off the toecap and spacers, the fit is fine.



I've always had better luck using a different method. I heat up the liners and then position my footbed in the liner first. This allows me to get it lined up perfectly. Then I put my foot in the liner (which already has a super thin ski sock with toe cap underneath). Then I'll slip my foot with the liner already on into the boot shell (just make sure everything goes in smooth and pull up on the rear cuff). Sometimes I'll slip the liner into thick nylons first to hold everything together - depends on the shell (some are too "catchy" to use the nylons method).

No shop has ever done a better fit on Thermoflex liners for me than I can do at home.


They said you need to use a footbed. My bootfitters cooked them in a convection oven, then put some bags shaped like the liner over them to help them slide into the boot easier. I put my foot into the liner and then slid it into the boot. My footbeds were placed inside a very thin sock along with the toe cap. This helped hold the toe cap and footbed where we wanted them. After the liner was in the boot I walked my heel up and down a few times to get the liner all the way down in the boot. We then clamped them down pretty good and I stood with my weight forward a bit as if I was skiing. They came out perfect. This was at the Sports Loft in SLC, Earl and Jeremy are very knowledgeable and I recommend them.

put duck tape over any rivets or anything sticking out on the inside of your boot.
post #2 of 28
Just ordered some intuitions so I will be doing this myself in a few days. Thanks for the ideas.
post #3 of 28
DO NOT BAKE THE INTUITION!!!

The Thermoflex liners are no problem, DIY, but the intuition liners need to be heated with the blower heat unit, and is best if you go to a boot guy and have it done right.

Cost of a boot fitting: 35.00
Cost of ruined Intuition liner: 100.00
Cost of the look on Fisch's wifes face when he tells her he has to buy new liners: priceless

($$ figures are guesses and may differ from actual costs)
post #4 of 28
Thread Starter 
I don't tell my wide what I buy or don't buy, so no looks here. By the way over in the Boot Guys section, CEM says he prefers using an oven then the stack for Intuitions.
post #5 of 28
Could you use a hair dryer? Would that get it hot enough?
post #6 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by fischermh View Post
I don't tell my wide what I buy or don't buy, so no looks here. By the way over in the Boot Guys section, CEM says he prefers using an oven then the stack for Intuitions.
CEM is certainly more knowledgeable than I am.
When I got mine, the information said DO NOT use the oven. I' have had mine heated twice. Once with and once without using the toe caps. (prefer the fit with the toe room!)
Both time the boot shop used the blower heater unit.


A hair dryer is not likely hot enough for this job. They have to get pretty hot.
post #7 of 28
Thread Starter 
I tried heating a Head SH3 liner with a hair dryer, thinking it would be safer than using the oven. The hair dryer ended up melting a small hole in the liner.
post #8 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by trekchick View Post
DO NOT BAKE THE INTUITION!!!

The Thermoflex liners are no problem, DIY, but the intuition liners need to be heated with the blower heat unit, and is best if you go to a boot guy and have it done right.

Cost of a boot fitting: 35.00
Cost of ruined Intuition liner: 100.00
Cost of the look on Fisch's wifes face when he tells her he has to buy new liners: priceless

($$ figures are guesses and may differ from actual costs)
I have had many thermoflex and many intuition liners. Regardless of what the instructions say, you can use an oven. I've done two pairs in the last week, one in a regular oven, and one in a thermoflex convection oven. I really didn't notice a difference.
I have also molded some liners using the heat stacks, and I really don't like that method at all. I just don't think it works as well. It is a little more foolproof for the inexperienced, but I don't think the end result is quite as precise.

Check out the tutorial I posted HERE.
post #9 of 28
Thread Starter 
UP,

thanks that is perfect. Also the boot stretcher is great. I have an old pair of ESS bindings that will do the job of the Markers.
post #10 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by U.P. Racer View Post
I have had many thermoflex and many intuition liners. Regardless of what the instructions say, you can use an oven. I've done two pairs in the last week, one in a regular oven, and one in a thermoflex convection oven. I really didn't notice a difference.
I have also molded some liners using the heat stacks, and I really don't like that method at all. I just don't think it works as well. It is a little more foolproof for the inexperienced, but I don't think the end result is quite as precise.

Check out the tutorial I posted HERE.
Great description of the fitting process

When I was starting w/ Intuition liners, I called the company in BC and they said you got to use the heat stacks. Next day I called the US rep and he said no way, use the oven for alpine, he said the company people were mostly tele skiers and they could get away w/ using heat stacks. All the shops I talked w/ in SLC used the oven. I've done the oven method twice(at a ski shop) and results have been great

Other suggestions:
Use the sock you plan to ski in to hold the toe cap in place. And get custom foot beds
Defently put the liner on your foot before putting it in the shell.
If you don't have something to spread the shell, have a third person on hand to spread the shell(this is how the shop I used did it).
Use bits of foam pad for any foot irregularities. I have a bone spur on one heal and high arches w blood vesseles runing across the top. Using small foam pads on these eliminated custom boot fitting to try to solve the problems(fitting that was marginlly successful at best)
Also, be prepared for the fitting process to be as uncomfotable as h*ll(painfull!). I remember the first time I had mine fitted I thought "Ah oh, did I just make a really big mistake?"

LIke I've said before, the Intuition liners were the best $200 I spent in 30 years skiing.
post #11 of 28
Thread Starter 
I have footbeds made by Epic's own Pierre.

In UP Racer's tutorial, he mentions that you may not want to insert your footbed in the forming process. Unlike Yooper, I have wide beefy feet. What advantages/disadvantages would there be to forming without the footbeds?

I think I read of someone that put the footbed under the liner, during the process. I think the idea was that the bottom of the liner would be formed in the shape of the footbed, eliminating the need for the footbed. Is their any experience and/or validity to the idea?
post #12 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by fischermh View Post
I have footbeds made by Epic's own Pierre.

In UP Racer's tutorial, he mentions that you may not want to insert your footbed in the forming process. Unlike Yooper, I have wide beefy feet. What advantages/disadvantages would there be to forming without the footbeds?

I think I read of someone that put the footbed under the liner, during the process. I think the idea was that the bottom of the liner would be formed in the shape of the footbed, eliminating the need for the footbed. Is their any experience and/or validity to the idea?
The only advantage of forming w/o the footbed is if your foot volume is so large it becomes a problem(and you'd have to have a truley strange foot). The advantages of a custom footbed are far significant enough to consider changing shells if there's not enough volume(I would).

As far as forming w/ the footbed under the the liner You want the footbed to be part of your foot, not the liner. It doesn't make sense, what do you gain? IMHO.
post #13 of 28
I just had my Intuitions fit, but haven't skied them yet. Since my fitter (Gary Hohl at Helm of Sun Valley in San Mateo, CA) was experienced and had both the insert and oven options available, I asked him which he suggested. He prefers the oven. I deferred to expertise. He also had me stand still, noted my pronation, and suggested that I continue to use my custom footbeds. We heated the liners, inserted them, inserted the footbeds, and buckled down. I'll be skiing them Saturday and maybe Sunday; I'll weigh in further then.
post #14 of 28
I just fit my intuitions using this DIY method and allso UP's method. Sweet results. I found that by warming my shells on top of the stove while the liners baked it softened them up and made it easier for my wife to hold open. And the spraying some cheap cooking spray in there helped to lubricate the process too great idea.
post #15 of 28
Are you guys putting footbeds in the liners, or fitting without footbeds?

I just got liners today. Man, they feel short! Before fitting, did your toes jamb against the end of the liner? They take up a lot of volume and are very stiff compared to the stock liners. Dry fitting in my Garmont Adrenalin suggests these could produce a suitably stiff boot. In the Nordica Hot Rod, I don't know where I'll find the toe room, but they will be a lot warmer than stock.

So, I'm just starting the process and will probably pay a visit to SierraJim since its an easy trip. But still would like to compare notes.
post #16 of 28
I molded mine with foot beds. I don't see what you gain by not using them.
post #17 of 28
FWIW, this TGR thread has been running for a year, and us Maggots are still confused.
post #18 of 28
Thats some weird stuff. It seems most people prefer it with the foot bed.
post #19 of 28
Cirque, I can't understand why you would mold without the footbed. I think you'd want to mold it as you'd ski it.

As for comfort. The liners seemed short and extremely uncomfy before molding. You will love them when you have the fitted.
post #20 of 28
Thread Starter 
I am considering not using footbeds. My foot is wide and I don't have a lot of instep room. I am thinking the instep may work better without the footbed.

I have had footbeds for 15 years and am seriously reconsidering how critical they are.
post #21 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by fischermh View Post
I am considering not using footbeds. My foot is wide and I don't have a lot of instep room. I am thinking the instep may work better without the footbed.

I have had footbeds for 15 years and am seriously reconsidering how critical they are.
Wouldn't not using the footbeds cause the foot to spread-out more?
post #22 of 28
Thread Starter 
That is true. It is a dilemma, which do I need to address more the forefoot width or instep height. I think I will play around and try to figure out what works best for me.
post #23 of 28
This maybe obvious but what about getting the shell punched-out at the forefoot and then using peices of hard foam on the bare skin of the forefoot during molding to give you a little extra room. :
post #24 of 28
Re: Thermoflex: PhilP has fit mine into two different shells so far using the basic method outlined in the first post with good results. He uses lower oven temperatures, about 250 F, I think, with toe caps and standard thin ski socks. We put my A-line footbeds in after the heating, but didn't use the toe spacers. His wife doesn't seem to mind liners in the oven.
post #25 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by evansilver View Post
Re: Thermoflex: PhilP...... His wife doesn't seem to mind liners in the oven.
Man, I wish I had a wife that understanding
post #26 of 28
These things are truly awesome.
post #27 of 28
Thanks,do you have some videos or images?

it's difficult for me to understand these words .
post #28 of 28


I molded my Thermoflex liners using "Cookin with Big Tim"  video as a guide. Available here http://www.telemarktips.com/DrTelemark.html

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