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Wearing A Beacon in-bounds at the Ski Area? - Page 2

post #31 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisc View Post
...and now always have a beacon for inbounds skiing.
Hardly. Merely noting that there are certain places and times inbounds where it is reasonable and appropriate.
post #32 of 157
Just a funny thought I remember. Someone said something once like, "What do you do when your buddy shows up with his beacon but no shovel or probe?" Ans: give him yours.
post #33 of 157
Sunshine Village near Banff requires a beacon for skiers skiing the Delirium Dive area http://www.skibanff.com/the_mountain/stats.php , my photo is below.

I plan on buying one this year and using it as Bob describes.
525x525px-LL-vbattach2249.jpg
post #34 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisc View Post
I understand the sentiment that no place is always safe, but it is hard to find unconsolidated snow inbounds 24 hrs. after a storm. So I cannot imagine wearing one except on some really snowy days or after new terrain openings. Wet slides? Possibly, but often terrain prone to that is so tightly controlled in-bounds.

There are probably other things more important to your health than in-bound beacons. Helmets. Knee-pads. Wrist-guards. Genital Cup.
Certainly the latter items are more likely to protect you, and inbounds slides are less common but it all depends on where and when you ski. Look here: http://avalanche.state.co.us/Acciden...5/20050520.htm
I had skied there just a couple of days before this fatal slide. I don't know that a beacon would have helped him, but it might have sped up the search enough to do so. This was on a well consolidated and moguled slope, about 35 degrees (prime avy terrain) with what turned out to be a rapidly rising temperature gradient. The patrol had checked the slope earlier in the day. I was at The Canyons and Park City this April, and most of the steep inbounds terrain had to be closed because of wet slab releases all over the place. I had planned to ski the BC, but it was just too dangerous, and I wore a beacon inbounds that week.

Re: Tracker 2- the word from BCA is that they are still doing testing, and it won't be available to the public until next season (look here: http://www.backcountryworld.com/showthread.php?t=3946 at post #7)
post #35 of 157
whatever you do ...please don't wear your beacon to the bar. but if you must - at least turn it off.
post #36 of 157
Any of you ever been to Alta?

This was in bounds. Slid over (temp closed for control work) groomed runs.





EDIT:If you're good you can sync up the 3 vids! KEWL!
post #37 of 157
The ABasin slide seems like a really unfortunate situation. Wet slides seem even more dangerous/less survivable since the snow is denser.

But I thought this was interesting to note:

Quote:
Avalanche deaths occurring in-bounds on open terrain are very rare; in Colorado where nearly one-third of all US avalanche victims have died such accidents are extremely rare. The last skier killed on open terrain in a Colorado ski area occurred back on January 9, 1975. A man skiing in the trees between trails triggered and was killed in a small avalanche at Crested Butte.

In the United States -- prior to this accident -- there have been only 4 other skier-deaths on open terrain since 1985. One death occurred in California (November 1985), another in Utah in February, 1986); the third died in Wyoming (January, 1999). The fourth fatality occurred this winter when a 13-year-old boy was blown out of a lift chair and buried in Nevada.
The Nevada incident at Las Vegas Ski Resort was very unfortunate - record snows/100-50 yr slide paths/resort errors.
post #38 of 157
The season before last I was riding a lift during a spring storm at Baker with Posaune and he pointed out where he'd seen someone buried to the neck inbounds (on a common run) a day or two before.

Or try a tour of a tree well. I was lucky enough not to be stuck upside down & was able to dig myself out. That induces some perspective. Consider http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...wdeath13m.html and http://dwb.thenewstribune.com/news/l...-4940485c.html

I really do not think anyone is advocating beacons or Recco for every skier at every ski hill. But there are times and places even inbounds where there is no reason NOT to be equipped with both. The reasons have already been enumerated above...
post #39 of 157
So how often are people advocating in-bounds beacon use?

Here are some Squaw totals for 2005-06 (I'm ignoring that last year even happened). Squaw is pretty good about opening up 100% within 24-36 hours after a storm/winds end.

If you ski KT, Silverado, Red Dog, Broken Arrow, hike Granite/Palisades/Kitchen?

Frankly, I'm more worried about my beacon getting stolen out of my pack for the days I REALLY want it. I do not prance around with it. Rather have it semi-safe.


Code:
 
May 27, 2006 2-3" 3-5"352 628 Apr 17, 2006 8-10" 14-16"349 623 Apr 16, 2006 18-20" 24-28"339 607 Apr 12, 2006 1-2" 10-12"319 579 Apr 11, 2006 1-2" 3-5"317 567 Apr 10, 2006 4-6" 11-14"315 562 Apr 8, 2006 1-2" 4-5"309 548 Apr 5, 2006 6-8" 8-10"307 543 Apr 4, 2006 8-10" 14-18"299 533 Apr 3, 2006   6-8"289 515 Apr 1, 2006 18-20" 22-24"289 507 Mar 31, 2006 2-3" 2-3"269 483 Mar 28, 2006 3-4" 6-8"266 480 Mar 27, 2006 trace  2-3"262 472 Mar 24, 2006 8-10" 16-19"262 469 Mar 19, 2006 1-2" 2-3"252 450 Mar 16, 2006 6-6" 8-10"250 447 Mar 14, 2006 2-3" 3-5"244 437 Mar 13, 2006 18-25" 28-35"241 432 Mar 12, 2006 2-3" 4-6"216 397 Mar 11, 2006 4-6" 6-8"213 391 Mar 10, 2006 6-8" 12-14"207 383 Mar 9, 2006 8-12" 14-18"199 369 Mar 8, 2006 4-6" 5-8"187 351 Mar 7, 2006 2-4" 5-7"181 343 Mar 6, 2006 6-8" 8-10"177 336 Mar 5, 2006 3-4" 4-6"169 326 Mar 4, 2006 1-2" 2-3"165 320 Mar 3, 2006 8-10" 10-12"163 317 Mar 2, 2006 10-12" 12-16"153 305 Mar 1, 2006 2-4" 4-6"141 289 Feb 28, 2006 2-4" 5-7"137 283 Feb 27, 2006 1-2" 3-5"133 276 Feb 18, 2006 1-2" 2-3"131 271 Feb 17, 2006 6-8" 8-10"129 268 Feb 16, 2006 4-4" 4-6"121 258 Feb 15, 2006 1-1" 1-2"117 252 Feb 14, 2006   1-2"116 250 Feb 1, 2006   1-2"116 248 Jan 31, 2006   1-2"116 246 Jan 29, 2006 4-6" 8-10"116 244 Jan 27, 2006 4-6" 6-8"110 234 Jan 26, 2006 1-2" 2-4"104 226 Jan 25, 2006   1-2"102 222 Jan 20, 2006 1-1" 1-1"102 220 Jan 17, 2006 18-22" 24-36"101 219 Jan 14, 2006 8-10" 10-12"79 183 Jan 13, 2006 6-8" 10-12"69 171 Jan 6, 2006 1-2" 2-4"61 159 Jan 3, 2006   2-4"59 155 Jan 1, 2006 8-10" 14-16"59 151 Dec 31, 2005    49 135 Dec 31, 2005 6-8" 10-12"49 135 Dec 29, 2005   2-4"41 123 Dec 28, 2005 2-4" 10-12"41 119 Dec 25, 2005 10-12" 12-14"37 107 Dec 20, 2005   1-2"25 93 Dec 18, 2005   2-4"25 91 Dec 17, 2005 6-8" 12-14"25 87 Dec 16, 2005 1-2" 1-2"17 73 Dec 8, 2005   1-1"15 71 Dec 7, 2005   2-4"15 70 Dec 1, 2005 1-3" 18-24"15 66 Nov 30, 2005   4-8"12 42 Nov 28, 2005   6-8"12 34 Nov 27, 2005 4-6" 10-12"12 26 Nov 25, 2005 2-3" 4-6"6 14 Nov 17, 2005 1-2"  3 8 Nov 3, 2005 trace  1-2"1 8 Nov 2, 2005 1" 1-2"1 6 Oct 26, 2005   1-2"0 4 Oct 14, 2005 trace  1-2"0 2
post #40 of 157
Lonnie,
Thanks for the Video!
post #41 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonnie View Post
Any of you ever been to Alta?

This was in bounds. Slid over (temp closed for control work) groomed runs.
The big Yellow Trail slide (when pretty much the whole face slid) last winter was impressive as well.
post #42 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisc View Post
Frankly, I'm more worried about my beacon getting stolen out of my pack for the days I REALLY want it. I do not prance around with it. Rather have it semi-safe.
Errm, how are they going to steal it if you are wearing it? Seems like as "semi-safe" a place as any.
post #43 of 157
Wow...:

A pretty scary level of misinformation and misunderstanding in this thread about avalanche mechanisms/control and rescue.

Here is some things to consider:

From this thread: "I wear a beacon incase I get stuck in a tree well."

Consider: Nice idea, but when an avalanche happens on the hill, generally it is pretty noticable, and the mechanisms of it mean it is likely a ski pole or your hat may stay on the surface...giving a clue for people to look for you.

If you go into a tree well, odds are no-one will know....until it is WAY too late....beacons ALWAYS transmit...someone has to know to RECIEVE to find you....and be in the area. Best defence as mentioned for this one...is ski with buddy in the trees...and, yup...Whistle.

From this tread: "I always wear a becon after a heavy snow fall"

Consider: Ya good idea...but ANOTHER prime avalanche mechanism is WIND LOADING. Hence a cold clear night can lead to development of a FAILURE PLANE...if this is followed by a hollowing wind....cause for serious concern.


From this tread: "It didn't snow much last year, so I didn't bother wearing one"

Consider: ANOTHER key failure mechanism is excessive tempature gradients in the snow. This is more common in cold climates with THIN snow pack. Hence thin snow years, can somtimes be worse then heavy years. Just depends on wind, temperatures, and cloud cover....


Final Thought: Wear a beacon if you feel it is nessecary, (in bounds maybe/out of bounds definatley) but remember it is only a backup...not protection itself...real protection only comes from educating your self on Avalanche Mechanisms and using your head.
post #44 of 157
Methinks you are the one who is misinformed a bit, or maybe just making some assumptions. Focusing just on the tree well thing for the moment, in many cases whistling will be impossible or may not be heard unless someone is right on top of you (speaking from experience, tree well acoustics are weird). Second of all, the beacon-treewell thing presumes a rational and mutually understood protocol with a partner(s). I sure would not ski PNW trees alone and assume someone would find me via beacon if I got in trouble. I can't imagine anyone else thinking that. And I also would not assume they could keep me in sight 100% of the time in dense trees - even if you set this as a goal and make reasonable efforts to do so. Hence the value of a beacon in that situation (again, assuming you are using an agreed upon game plan)...

As has been discussed before, tree wells are a big deal for off-piste skiers in this neck of the woods. Both inbounds and out of bounds. eg, check out http://www.treewelldeepsnowsafety.com/tree_wells.html which is linked to by a number of local areas.
post #45 of 157
You wrote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by spindrift View Post
Methinks you are the one who is misinformed a bit, or maybe just making some assumptions. Focusing just on the tree well thing for the moment, in many cases whistling will be impossible or may not be heard unless someone is right on top of you (speaking from experience, tree well acoustics are weird). Second of all, the beacon-treewell thing presumes a rational and mutually understood protocol with a partner(s). I sure would not ski PNW trees alone and assume someone would find me via beacon if I got in trouble. I can't imagine anyone else thinking that. And I also would not assume they could keep me in sight 100% of the time in dense trees - even if you set this as a goal and make reasonable efforts to do so. Hence the value of a beacon in that situation (again, assuming you are using an agreed upon game plan)...

As has been discussed before, tree wells are a big deal for off-piste skiers in this neck of the woods. Both inbounds and out of bounds. eg, check out http://www.treewelldeepsnowsafety.com/tree_wells.html which is linked to by a number of local areas.
I wrote:

"Consider: Nice idea, but when an avalanche happens on the hill, generally it is pretty noticable, and the mechanisms of it mean it is likely a ski pole or your hat may stay on the surface...giving a clue for people to look for you.

If you go into a tree well, odds are no-one will know....until it is WAY too late....beacons ALWAYS transmit...someone has to know to RECIEVE to find you....and be in the area. Best defence as mentioned for this one...is ski with buddy in the trees...and, yup...Whistle."


Seems we are mostly on the same page here......

All your assumptions are correct....but must be made clear they are assumptions. Beacon and Whistle with buddy...best chances....I am also from the PNW, and know from extenisve expierance it is easy to get split up, and you could easily wait 5 -10 minutes before you realise somthing is wrong...also, just reality...even when skiing trees you will crisscross other groups...a good whistle will attract everyones attention...not just your group. The idea is a very good one...and yes tree well acoustics are terrible,,, but a whistle will travel farther then a voice.

Again whistle is not perfect...nothing is...but if you re-read the thread you will see the idea was dismissed as being dumb.

Where else am I misinformed?
post #46 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post
Wow...:

A pretty scary level of misinformation and misunderstanding in this thread about avalanche mechanisms/control and rescue.

Here is some things to consider:

From this thread: "I wear a beacon incase I get stuck in a tree well."

Consider: Nice idea, but when an avalanche happens on the hill, generally it is pretty noticable, and the mechanisms of it mean it is likely a ski pole or your hat may stay on the surface...giving a clue for people to look for you.

If you go into a tree well, odds are no-one will know....until it is WAY too late....beacons ALWAYS transmit...someone has to know to RECIEVE to find you....and be in the area. Best defence as mentioned for this one...is ski with buddy in the trees...and, yup...Whistle.

From this tread: "I always wear a becon after a heavy snow fall"

Consider: Ya good idea...but ANOTHER prime avalanche mechanism is WIND LOADING. Hence a cold clear night can lead to development of a FAILURE PLANE...if this is followed by a hollowing wind....cause for serious concern.


From this tread: "It didn't snow much last year, so I didn't bother wearing one"

Consider: ANOTHER key failure mechanism is excessive tempature gradients in the snow. This is more common in cold climates with THIN snow pack. Hence thin snow years, can somtimes be worse then heavy years. Just depends on wind, temperatures, and cloud cover....


Final Thought: Wear a beacon if you feel it is nessecary, (in bounds maybe/out of bounds definatley) but remember it is only a backup...not protection itself...real protection only comes from educating your self on Avalanche Mechanisms and using your head.
Ease up a bit there, Frances. Those were all pretty general statements. I don't think any novices are using this thread as a substitute for an Avy Level 1 class. Everything you said is dead on, but you're kinda comming off as someone who just read his first avalanche safety book and feels the need to school everyone. I'm not saying that's you, just that you're comming off as a bit sanctimonious.
post #47 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer View Post
Ease up a bit there, Frances. Those were all pretty general statements. I don't think any novices are using this thread as a substitute for an Avy Level 1 class. Everything you said is dead on, but you're kinda comming off as someone who just read his first avalanche safety book and feels the need to school everyone. I'm not saying that's you, just that you're comming off as a bit sanctimonious.
Sorry Corky,

Wasn't trying to offend, just pointing out some issues as I guess I dont agree with your assumption.....there are 10 views for every post here...so I do believe there are a lot people just hangin in the shadows soaking stuff up.

Come to the ski tech forums, and you will see that there are many many new skiers on this board, that read this stuff, and take it at face value. Some here, clearly know what they are on about....some dont.
post #48 of 157
Yeah, but he did in fact raise some good points. And I would not be surprised if, as skidude notes, many folks reading this have no idea what any level of Avy class is - just because they may not have been exposed to this stuff. And at the same time, more and more people are playing off-piste inbounds and out of bounds in places where that info could be a life saver. Not a bad thing to get "into the record" (again ).
post #49 of 157
I was under the impression that even if you get caught in a slide inbounds on controlled slopes (a rare event). The Beacon only comes into play if you are fully buried (another rare event) and is only really important if you are not actually killed outright in the slide (a fair possibility). so the cases when the beacon actually comes into paly are sort of not all that likely. That said I still can't come up with a good reason not to wear a beacon in bounds if you already have one.
post #50 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post
Wow...:

A pretty scary level of misinformation and misunderstanding in this thread about avalanche mechanisms/control and rescue.

Here is some things to consider:

From this thread: "I wear a beacon incase I get stuck in a tree well."

Consider: Nice idea, but when an avalanche happens on the hill, generally it is pretty noticable, and the mechanisms of it mean it is likely a ski pole or your hat may stay on the surface...giving a clue for people to look for you.

If you go into a tree well, odds are no-one will know....until it is WAY too late....beacons ALWAYS transmit...someone has to know to RECIEVE to find you....and be in the area. Best defence as mentioned for this one...is ski with buddy in the trees...and, yup...Whistle.
And thanks for adding to the misinformation.

Skiing with a buddy and a whistle are good ideas. So is taking an Avy class. Discounting the use of a beacon in NARSID situations, however, is just flat stupid. Not all snow immersions are witnessed, even when skiing with partners, nor is it always possible to use a whistle following an immersion. People have been found and rescued from immersions using a beacon, and unfortunately, bodies are often recovered the same way.
post #51 of 157
What ever Harry:.....did you read to end of the my original post or subsequent posts(dont just quotes bits, leave stuff out...and then claim I missed somthing)....no discounting done anywhere.....no claims of a whistle being the ultimate lifesaving tool either....wear a beacon if you feel it is necessary, but remember at the same time, as pointed out, the chances of being caught in an avalanche, inbounds in North America (different story in places like NZ) is extremely rare....so lets no go fear mongering either.

Educate yourself, take precautions, use your head. Best recipe for coming home in one piece.
post #52 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by tromano View Post
That said I still can't come up with a good reason not to wear a beacon in bounds if you already have one.
Yep. It would be more interesting if someone argued certain people inbounds should buy a beacon specifically for their inbounds skiing. I've skied in a bunch of inbounds places that have come just short of requiring beacon/probe/shovel, and there are at least a few examples of inbounds places that do require the gear.

The skier visits/inbounds avalanche fatality statistics might lend a false sense of security since some people are taking orders of magnitude more avalanche risk inbounds than the guy pounding groomers in the northeast. I mean, I've seen a couple avalanches in NY, but it would be pretty hard to argue people should be wearing beacon/probe/shovel when cruising around Hunter.

At first I was amazed when I saw the number of people in this thread talking about personal experience with inbounds slides, but now that I think about it I'm not so surprised. I have tiny experience compared to others here, but even I've set off/had people above me set off sluffs big enough to ruin your day inbounds, I've triggered at least one mini slab, and on at least a couple of occasions I've backed out of wind loaded inbounds stuff giving me the creeps.

But for all the reasons you and Skidude pointed out, the beacon is a poor substitute for not putting yourself in those dangerous situations. How about buying and wearing an ABS pack inbounds? That device arguably does a lot more to mitigate the consequences of the risks you do take than a beacon, and if you are taking those risks anyways inbounds you can't as easily argue it is increasing your risk taking behavior...
post #53 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
But for all the reasons you and Skidude pointed out, the beacon is a poor substitute for not putting yourself in those dangerous situations. How about buying and wearing an ABS pack inbounds? That device arguably does a lot more to mitigate the consequences of the risks you do take than a beacon, and if you are taking those risks anyways inbounds you can't as easily argue it is increasing your risk taking behavior...
Your post reminded me that some places do have inbounds terrain where avy equipment is required. I think powmow has some and silverton for instance.

I am an BC jong. But I am more worried about a small slide in bounds sweeping me off my feet in a technical area than getting buried and needing an abs or a beacon. I would think that most inbounds stuff is bombed enough and skied enough that skier triggered slides would be pretty small. The slide in lonnie's video was from control work, not skier triggered right? But obviously stuff happens. Like that dude in the video who almost got hit.
post #54 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by tromano View Post
But I am more worried about a small slide in bounds sweeping me off my feet in a technical area than getting buried and needing an abs or a beacon.
That reflects my experience and worry too, but I'm super-jong BC wise.

I've walked past a few signs (inbounds) suggesting beacon/probe/shovel/education/partner missing several of those, and I've decided this year I'm going to stop being a moron and get the appropriate gear/education.
post #55 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
That reflects my experience and worry too, but I'm super-jong BC wise.

I've walked past a few signs (inbounds) suggesting beacon/probe/shovel/education/partner missing several of those, and I've decided this year I'm going to stop being a moron and get the appropriate gear/education.
Where specifically? In-bounds

I've seen signs at Taos for wanting partners on the Ridge.

Others include:
The ridge at Bridger.
Sunshine - Delirium, Wild West, etc
The WA areas: Crystal, Alpental, Baker


The Utards here seem to think Alta/Bird is going to slide on you.
Jackson too.
And phantom slides in Tahoe.
post #56 of 157
This is all reminding me of a week in La Grave, France renting an apartment.

Every morning --- an included communal breakfast --- became a mad macho sausage fest.

La Grave is so gnar, that you need to wear and ice ax or harness or beacon to get your coffee and croissant. For Breakfast. Cuz your awesome. Just ridiculous.

Especially if you are going back to your room to get your gear.

It became so bad I started stuffing my underwear, clipping on my harness, slinging my shovel and tried my best to destroy the remaining Franco-US relations at 730am - or start new ones who got it.

Breakfast is gnar. In-bounds is gnar.

What is really going on here? Most people going to Utah should have an in-bounds beacon? Jackson for sure! Tahoe - hell ya!
post #57 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidude72 View Post
What ever Harry:.....did you read to end of the my original post or subsequent posts(dont just quotes bits, leave stuff out...and then claim I missed somthing)....no discounting done anywhere.....no claims of a whistle being the ultimate lifesaving tool either....wear a beacon if you feel it is necessary, but remember at the same time, as pointed out, the chances of being caught in an avalanche, inbounds in North America (different story in places like NZ) is extremely rare....so lets no go fear mongering either.

Educate yourself, take precautions, use your head. Best recipe for coming home in one piece.
I'm not about to start any fearmongering - but you're being an ass by accusing people of "misinformation" then spreading it yourself. "the chance of being caught in an avalanche incounds in North America is extremely rare"... It is rare to be killed inbounds, but but not rare to caught inbounds. I've been caught in several inbounds avalanches. I've helped search for people who have been in snow immersion burials, and as I pointed out, we have fatalities in or near the ski area every year. Maybe it's rare where you ski, don't assume so for all of North America.
post #58 of 157
I wear a beacon in places like Breckenridge and Keystone..Steamboat etc.

Sounds crazy but my wife dont ski, and I love trees. It would not be inconceivable for me to eat a tree, and end up unconscious in the middle of a forrest In-bounds.

In which case, when I didnt check in with my wife at the appropriate time, she could contact ski patrol and begin the search.
post #59 of 157
Most of the statements SkiDude72 took issue with were a twist on my words on page 1. My post was hardly analytical, but if we're going to dissect it, lets at least get the points right. I advocated that a beacon is part of a package that includes a partner, shovel, probe and training. The point is, missing any part of that package makes the beacon nearly useless as a RESCUE tool, but fine for recovery.

Thin snow cover is a precursor for depth hoar. I ski in a maritime climate where this is extremely rare. I am aware of the danger of extremely cold nights with shallow snow pack, and pointed out last year when the gradients were getting to dangerous levels. The picture below is the back-side of Kirkwood during such an event, released by patrol.

With regard to tree wells, I said nothing about the use of a beacon, but that whistles may not be viable because based on my experience, getting air is the first priority, and if that need is met, its unlikely a whistle or yelling will be heard. Again, my ass was dragged out because I had partners and a protocol, not because I had a beacon or whistle. What I did in response to this is buy an avalung.

Next time I'll try to be more specific, but your enthusiasm to criticize made you miss the point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirquerider View Post
Last year was such a bad snow-year in the Sierra, I kind of got out of the habit of using one inbounds. Shoot, I even have a BD Covert pack with an avalung that was just overkill due to snow conditions. The previous two years, I carried one all the time. Beacons are part of a package that includes shovel, probe and partner. If you're missing any of those, your chances for timely rescue go down.

Someone mentioned using a whistle earlier. Nice idea if you are lost or stuck, but not an option if you are really in danger of immersion in a tree well or slide. Snow is amazingly efficient at packing into your mouth and nose. It looks so airy and until you've had it happen, you just don't know how quickly it can totally shut down the availability of air. At least if you can call out or use a whistle, you have escaped the most dangerous aspect. Snow has an amazing ability to absorb sound. Yell as loud as you want when you are submerged, and I can almost guarantee you won't be heard. The idea of a whistle reminds me that as I get older, getting out of deep powder snow after a fall is getting harder, especially on flatter terrain. I could see how a person could become stranded if they ended up unable to get their feet under them.
March 3, 2007 Kirkwood, Thimble Peak

post #60 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by pattongb View Post
I wear a beacon in places like Breckenridge and Keystone..Steamboat etc.
.
Now things are getting a little too much....

Hopefully Christe does not slide on you.
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