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Ski shop put dimples in my bases. Now what? - Page 2

post #31 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by moguljunkie View Post
next time, I'll buy Looks and see if The Pro can mount).
He can....He has all the major binding manufacturer's jigs....
FYI, it is a common and easy mistake to make. I did it once when a customer brought in used bindings and didn't tell me he switched risers. I now look at all used bindings to see how far the screws protrude.
post #32 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philpug View Post
Before you go back to the shop, print this out and take it with you. I personally would want noew skis out of it. Not so much for durability sake, but resale..if anyone of us were looking at used skis to buy and saw dimples in the bases....either how fast would you walk away from them or you would offer pennies on the dollar for them. It also bothers me that he tried to cover it up. I hope they don't have a convienent memory when you go back to them this year, did you get anything in writting from when you are that last year?
For the record, Phil is serious about this.
When a ski shop turned my new skis into swiss cheese last year, He haunted me until I went back to the shop to give the shop the opportunity to make it right.
I approached them in that manner. I gave them the opportunity to take care of me, and they did.
The shop asked me to bring in my receipt for my original purchase of the skis(which were not bought at their shop) and they gave me store credit in that amount.
Thanks Phil!
post #33 of 42
Thread Starter 
Owner was very nice on the phone last spring (nothing in writing, though), so maybe he'll be open to the possibility of replacing the skis. I will mention his employee's deception...and bring a copy of this thread. Since there doesn't seem to be too much concern from the techs/former techs who've posted here that any significant lasting damage to the skis has been done (even with the use of the sander and my having skied on them twice with dimples), I probably won't push too hard for the new skis. Some cash back will likely suffice.

Not too concerned about resale value, since I can't imagine ever selling these skis. Skiing on them was a revelation for me. Never had so much fun. Just an aside: I think all the folks on the East Coast buying burly West Coast-type powder skis for East Coast use are really missing out -- a soft, wide ski with some sidecut is perfect for New England-type terrain, no matter how good you are (ask Alfonse or Epic).
post #34 of 42
As far a scutiny goes..just got my rossi bindings mouted on my new karmasutra's and i did a real up close on them out side..Do not trust anybody anymore after last yrs problem with a tune on my metrons
post #35 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by tromano View Post
If it were me, I would:

1. Demand a new ski.
2. Post the name of the shop in this thread as a community service.
3. Never go back to that shop for service related work.
I would out the shop only if they didn't make-up for the mistake to your satisfaction.
post #36 of 42
Dimpling skis is not completely uncomon. It is never right, but it isn't really uncommon. It can happen for a variety of reasons. In this case, the forgetting to put risers on is kind of a big boo-boo when installing bindings, I agree. However, I have seen dimpling happen on certain skis where the thickness at the binding area is less than the average. Sometimes on shorter length skis, the thickness at the hole points may also be a little thinner. Obviously, there are minimum thicknesses that must be adhered to by ski manufacturers as well as the hardware supplied by the binding manufacturers. However, certain combinations (thin ski / long hardware) can make the mounting process more sensitive to issues such as the "sawdust" not blown out sufficiently with compressed air after drilling the mounting holes or the holes not being drilled deep enough. In other case, there is too much material in the hole when the screws are inserted. In such cases, the extra material in the hole has no place to go but down and this can cause the dimples. In most cases, the bottom of the ski doesn't actually rip open, there are just slight visible protrusions.
The dimples can, however, be removed. In most cases, the screws can be removed and then the dimple flattened by applying pressure over a steel scraper laid flat on the ski or by tapping the raised hole by a light hammer. Any repair being made to remove the dimple must be made with the mounting hardware removed.
Once the dimple is flattened the screws can be reinstalled. In many cases, the tech will grind the end of the screw a small amount as well as making sure the hole is cleaned and drilled to the right depth before reinstalling the mounting hardware. There will be no visiible damage to the base of the ski when the repair is complete.
So I am trying to make two points here: if, as you say, the tech was running your skis through the belt sander to remove the dimples with the bindings installed, he would be removing more material at the location of the dimples and making the bases thinner at those location. (Even if he were running the skis through the belt sander without bindings, he would be doing the same thing.) Attempting to sand out the dimples is the wrong way to remove them. And as you can see, it doesn't work very well.
The other point that I am trying to make here is that removing dimples on a ski can be done with no visible artifacts.
I learned the above information because I bought a new pair of skis, brought them home, and began prepping the bases. Immediately, I noticed a dimple in one of the bases. I returned the skis the following day. The repair was performed as above. It took about five minutes and the bases looked perfect. I do a lot of tuning, so I am pretty used to looking at bases. Nevertheless, I requested a refund and received it. However, someone did buy those skis (they went back out on the rack), and I'm sure the buyer was none the wiser.
Just some thoughts.
Good luck and let us know what happens.
post #37 of 42
New skis. Without question. Be sure to start writing stuff down, too, and of course save any paperwork. Trust me -- I'm good at this sort of thing. Hopefully, all will go smoothly. That usually happens, in my experience.

If things don't go smoothly with request for replacement, then take Phil's idea of coming in with a printed copy of the thread, but also, make sure that, if they give you any trouble, you contact the BBB.org and fill out a business complaint online. I have found this tool VERY effective in getting recompense from bad businesses. If they are not cooperative, be sure to name and shame on this site.

I wouldn't use small claims unless things get really nasty. Too much hassle.

Good luck!
post #38 of 42
Thread Starter 
So, i called the owner of the shop today and reminded him about my situation (including a reference to his employee's attempt to cover up the damage). He asked if I could drive over and show him the skis. On the way over there, I thought about what I really wanted. I just couldn't convince myself that I needed new skis to be made whole. These are soft snow skis and won't get many base grinds down the road. I can't possibly see myself selling these skis in the future...in fact, after skiing these twice, I'm selling three other skis I own (once you go fat, you never go back). And I was inclined to agree with Garrett's, Brewski2's, and JDoyal's assessments that the dimples were not that big a deal. So, what I decided I wanted was a guarantee that the skis would be repaired well and that I'd have no future problems with them, a store credit for somewhere between $50 and $75, and an apology.

When I got to the shop, I showed the owner the damaged ski (it was actually only one base that had dimples) and asked what he thought was a fair resolution. Before he offered anything, he ran his fingers over the ski and said, "I don't see any damage." I found this kind of annoying. I always hate when I don't get the full "the customer's always right" treatment. Now, maybe the remnants of the off-season wax made it a little harder to tell there were dimples, but I could definitely still feel them. Eventually, I convinced him there were indeed dimples.

At that point, he said he could repair them, they'd be as good as new, and wanted to know if I wanted cash back. I told him a store credit would be fine and he offered me $50. Since that was in the range of what I wanted and -- unlike Trotski -- I don't like to haggle, I accepted his offer.

And I did get an apology of sorts. He apologized for the damage to the skis; however, he did not apologize for his employee lying to me and half-assedly trying to cover up his damage. That was pretty disappointing. Is it enough for me to out the shop? Probably not. Especially since we'll never know what he would have said had I asked for new skis.

Even without the full apology, I have to say I'm pretty happy. The skis will be finished next week and I'll be ready, at a moment's notice, to head up for Vermont's first big storm with the perfect MRG powder skis freshly tuned and ready to slay Chute and Liftline. Life is good.


EDIT: Thanks by the way for all the feedback. Really helped me make an informed decision.
post #39 of 42
Good for you. There was no need to hold their feet to the fire. Karma will pay you back with a powder day at MRG. I hope to be there with you. See you on the slope.
post #40 of 42
Thread Starter 
Would be great to meet up at MRG this year. Although I have to admit, after skiing Magic twice last year, it's really a tough call between the two places (especially factoring in the shorter drive from NY), so I might not get as far north as often this year.
post #41 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by moguljunkie View Post
Would be great to meet up at MRG this year. Although I have to admit, after skiing Magic twice last year, it's really a tough call between the two places (especially factoring in the shorter drive from NY), so I might not get as far north as often this year.
I am up for hitting Magic. If the snow is there, I will hit it. Magic is about an hour closer for me than MRG.
post #42 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by moguljunkie View Post
And I did get an apology of sorts. He apologized for the damage to the skis; however, he did not apologize for his employee lying to me and half-assedly trying to cover up his damage. .

He got that backwards. The dimples are really nothing. I'd jump at a chance to by some dimpled skis at a nice discount.

The lying and half ass cover up is bad.

good resolution from a shop that has shown it is not trustworthy.
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