EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Tuning, Maintenance and Repairs › Two base edge angles - Helpful or fiction?
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Two base edge angles - Helpful or fiction?

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
Someone recently told me that varying the base edge angle can have a positive effect on the skis turning ability. Specifically, he suggested a 0.5 degree bevel throughout all but the last 5 or so cm of the base edge (that contacts the snow) at the tip and tail, and 0.7 degree bevel in the last 5 cm of the tip and tail. He suggested that this provided smoother turn initiation /reduced tendency to overly hook up the edges. Has anyone tired this type of edge angle? Is this little bit of extra work worth the time? Or this just another oddball opinion that I don’t want to try?
post #2 of 18
Unless you are a seriously seriously accomplished skier/racer on very firm snow, I highly doubt a .2 degree bas bev diff on 5 CM of tips and tails would make ANY noticeable difference.
post #3 of 18
Stockli's factory tune is sort of like that. They use slightly more angle in the first and last 1/3 of the ski and a .5 underfoot.

I always prefer the way they ski after I tune them with a staight 1/2 or 1/3
post #4 of 18
slightly more base bevel in the tip and tail can definetly make transioins smoother when usin a .5 elsewhere. Particuularly if you have an alignment issue and also what kind of snow you are skiing on, but also in general.

I have found man-made snow for instance to be extremely unforgiving to a .5 base bevel. A bit of x-tra bevel in the tip and tail works well.

and yes the x-tra .2 degrees makes a big difference.

In fact I have been using a .7 as an excellent compromise between the harshness of a .5 and the looseness of a 1 degree.

I simply can't agree with the poster above that says .2 degrees increase is undetectable on a ski with a .5 base bevel.

.2/.5 is a 40% increase in base bevel!!!!!
post #5 of 18
I only wish shops were able to actually do such accurate work. My experience is that they can either detune the tips/tails or leave them the same.
post #6 of 18
TomB,


They'll do anything you want............



so long as it's 1 base, 2 side.
post #7 of 18
A friend who is an excellent skier and former freestyle competitor prefers his Head Supershapes with the base 0.75° except 1°at the tips & tails. I haven't tried that, and don't know if I'd feel the difference.

I do suggest that you order your skis tuned sharp all the way to the tips--no detuning--and carry a small stone with you so you can detune as you prefer.
post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the replies. Interesting points of view. I do all my own tuning - have for years. I just bought some Sun Valley Ski Tool Final Cut Base Edge Beveling Tools that will make this a breeze to do. (These are the best base edge tools that I've seen.) I might give this a try just for an experiment to see if it makes a difference on hard snow. I can't imagine that dual base angles would make much difference on soft snow. If this makes a difference, it would be similar to detuning, but perhaps more precise.
post #9 of 18
"Sun Valley Ski Tool Final Cut Base Edge Beveling Tools"...Now that's a mouthfull, eh!
post #10 of 18
Interesting refinement of the detuning concept.
post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by canadianskier View Post
Someone recently told me that varying the base edge angle can have a positive effect on the skis turning ability. Specifically, he suggested a 0.5 degree bevel throughout all but the last 5 or so cm of the base edge (that contacts the snow) at the tip and tail, and 0.7 degree bevel in the last 5 cm of the tip and tail. He suggested that this provided smoother turn initiation /reduced tendency to overly hook up the edges. Has anyone tired this type of edge angle? Is this little bit of extra work worth the time? Or this just another oddball opinion that I don’t want to try?
I think you got your answer...but just to give it some more cred...the idea definatley has merit....top racers have been doing varients of above for years...ie more bevel at the tip and tail, less in the middle...I have heard of guys going for up to 3 bevels on one ski.
post #12 of 18
The difficult part of varying base bevel is maintaining consistency. It's hard enough to find a good shop that can do a solid .5 base. The Stockli factory tunes are done by machine. Just to keep things simple, I prefer a single bevel along the entire length
post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voltron View Post
The difficult part of varying base bevel is maintaining consistency. It's hard enough to find a good shop that can do a solid .5 base. The Stockli factory tunes are done by machine. Just to keep things simple, I prefer a single bevel along the entire length
It is not that difficult to do a .5 along the entire length of the skis and then measure and mark equal distances on the tuip and tail and increase those areas to a .7 or 1.0.

Finding a shop do any decent tune is a challenge and is what motivated me to learn to do my own. I become very frustrated getting my skis back and having them ski poorly and from some very reputable specialty tuning shops too!
post #14 of 18
A-man I defer to your greater expereince. With all due respect, what pecent of what percent is 40% of half a degree on 10 cm of a 180 cm ski?

Give it a shot. Even if it makes you THINK it makes you better, it makes you better.
post #15 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer256 View Post
A-man I defer to your greater expereince. With all due respect, what pecent of what percent is 40% of half a degree on 10 cm of a 180 cm ski?

Give it a shot. Even if it makes you THINK it makes you better, it makes you better.
Is that there that calculus stuff?
post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
Detuning has always been done on a small portion of the edge, yet many find detuning can improve (or harm) turning.
post #17 of 18
I've done this madness of which you speak. .5 to 1 on base. I did notice it too. But that was like 10 years ago and I just can't be farked anymore. .7 is my request after a stone grind these days from the racing shop. But I'm not a techy amymore.

I do still polish daily and keep them razor-like with diamonds and all and my friends think that's insane... being as I'm a powder skier.
post #18 of 18
I don't think you can really discuss base edge bevels and detuning without considering also the skiers ablility, snow conditions and type of ski and length as it relates to the skiers ability and snowconditions. Now that we have skis with sidecuts where the widest part of the ski is infront of the contact point of the shovel it seems counterproductive to ski design to be detuning the ski to the contact point or beyond. Increasing base edge bevel from a truly flat ski can make a ski easier to roll over on edge but to much will hinder grip on hard snow. For less accomplished skiers this can make turning easier because the edge does not hook up as quick, but a lesson on carving a turn might also achieve the desired results. I thought the whole shape ski idea was to get the ski to hook up easier not less, maybe if you don't like the way your skis are skiing it might be the skis, it could be the pilot or it could be the tune. Think about it.
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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Tuning, Maintenance and Repairs › Two base edge angles - Helpful or fiction?