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Getting back to racing, need outfitting help

post #1 of 28
Thread Starter 
Last night, I got suckered into joining a race team. Promises of Glory, Comaraderie, and BEER...

Saturdays SL, Sundays GS

I used to race in high school and in college (20 years ago).

Not that I want to win but I'd like to do well.

I have a helmet, and regular ski wear.

Do I need to get a GS suit? I'd rather not.

Are there other options, such as seperate race shirts and pants? Do they still make those padded 'race' sweaters?

I have some older (2003?) Atomic GS 11.21 and Atomic race boots. I just cruised groomers, never raced on them. I also have last years Falcon 10 boots. They are in great shape.

I have some 186 Nordica Afterburners (new) and some 176 Rossi Z-9's (beaten) in addition to the GS 11's. I also have a few others (twin tips).

Should I get new boards, pick up some used race stock skis?

Help me.....:
post #2 of 28
The world did not want to see me in a GS suit with middle aged paunch.

I recommend ditching any jacket .... that will slow you down ..... I would just run with a windstopper (North Face), vest over a fleece. It was a reasonable compromise.

Cold weather and a long ride up the lift ... heck ... our hill was only 600' so it was a short ride back up, but if I had a longer ride in the cold I would have considered buying an SL top a bit on the loose side .... plus the arm padding would have been nice.

Consider buying a used SL ski ... ???

Something like a Stockli SC would probably get you through both.
post #3 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
Last night, I got suckered into joining a race team. Promises of Glory, Comaraderie, and BEER...

Saturdays SL, Sundays GS

I used to race in high school and in college (20 years ago).

Not that I want to win but I'd like to do well.

I have a helmet, and regular ski wear.

Do I need to get a GS suit? I'd rather not.

Are there other options, such as seperate race shirts and pants? Do they still make those padded 'race' sweaters?

I have some older (2003?) Atomic GS 11.21 and Atomic race boots. I just cruised groomers, never raced on them. I also have last years Falcon 10 boots. They are in great shape.

I have some 186 Nordica Afterburners (new) and some 176 Rossi Z-9's (beaten) in addition to the GS 11's. I also have a few others (twin tips).

Should I get new boards, pick up some used race stock skis?

Help me.....:
At my hill, we have a rule---well I am lobbying for a rule---that if your girth in cm exceeds the length of your ski, in cm, spandex in any way, shape or fashion is NOT allowed:
post #4 of 28
First of all, find out how it's scored. If it's handicap based on you need to improve over the season, don't worry about it. Go to the first couple of races and just stand-up and finish. See what everyone else is doing and go from there.
post #5 of 28
Thread Starter 
I was reading some of the rules. I think you have to register, and place within the 60% in NASTAR to qualify. I don't think this will be a problem.

My rather girlish waist measurement is 93 cm, over my trousers this AM. The GS 11's are 177 cm, I think. I'm more worried about freezing my package (shrinkage), than my abdomenal girth.

I do have a soft shell waterproof type jacket. I'm wondering about pants. Regular ski pants too bulky?

I'm remembering some of my racing moments of the past. Thinking some forearm pads or, padded gloves, may be in order. ie gates springing and hitting me in the forearms, face, crotch etc.
post #6 of 28
IMHO, a lot of that depends on the course and your ability to carry speed.

Our regular set was on not too difficult terrain with a few almost flat sections and the wind resistance from any kind of jacket could be felt ... you were trying to gain or maintain speed.

On a faster course where the speed can come when you want .. and .. can handle it ... the wind drag becomes less of an issue.

We often had warm, slow "snow" too, mid-atlantic conditions often would rise into the 40's and you would be straining for speed.

All things factor ...
post #7 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
I was reading some of the rules. I think you have to register, and place within the 60% in NASTAR to qualify. I don't think this will be a problem.

My rather girlish waist measurement is 93 cm, over my trousers this AM. The GS 11's are 177 cm, I think. I'm more worried about freezing my package (shrinkage), than my abdomenal girth.

I do have a soft shell waterproof type jacket. I'm wondering about pants. Regular ski pants too bulky?

I'm remembering some of my racing moments of the past. Thinking some forearm pads or, padded gloves, may be in order. ie gates springing and hitting me in the forearms, face, crotch etc.

My race suit is known as the home of the angry inch. Not to brag. :
post #8 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki View Post
The world did not want to see me in a GS suit with middle aged paunch.

I recommend ditching any jacket .... that will slow you down .....

Oct 26, 2007

Yuki San:

I'm with you on the "middle age" paunch(come on give me a break. I'd call it a "Cote Pot":. You're being too kind).

Still have my "armored race sweater (Navy Blue/Red, Demetre)" as well as "padded stretch racing pants (Navy Blue, CB)" a la Mahre Brothers/Stenmark era. Still find them very practical as well as not providing much for wind/air to grab at.

Think snow,

CP
post #9 of 28
If you're a competitive type of guy (which I am guessing you are) you will soon want a speed suit especially if the guy that beats you is wearing one.

As far as your package, I think every other body part will feel cold before that does; at least it does with me.

I see those race sweaters on ebay once and a while, as well as the snug pants.

They do make two piece speed suits too.
post #10 of 28
Thread Starter 
I'm wondering what size GS suit that I would use (should I go this route). I would probably by a used one, sight unseen. I weigh about 215lbs. about 6'0" tall. I usually wear a Large ski pant and an XL jacket. I'm pretty wide across the shoulders, 45.5 inch chest (under the armpits). Would a Spyder XL fit?

About seperates. Where might someone find these on the net?
post #11 of 28

As somebody said...

...just go to some races, see how you do, and where you want to go from there and you'll pretty much figure it all out.

Having said all that, if you find that you're even semi-serious about it, you'll probably want to...

- Upgrade your technique and probably get in some training. Probably the best single source of today's race technique is the USSA Alpine Fundamentals 1 and 2 videos.

- Get some race wear. A suit is worth something like 4 to 6% in a GS course, and that's too much to give away. A two piece suit will work fine for SL and GS. In addition to having a slick paint job, you're also going to be buying into stuff that has padding. Protection is really important. In a lot of beer league GS, you can go pretty straight, as in right through the turning pole, so that's a reason to have protection.

In SL, you have to have protection...shinguards, forearm padding, handguards on your poles, and a helmet with a faceguard. The last is really important. My training partner and I were getting into Masters Racing and had everything except face protection. Result: I got whacked in the left ear by a SL pole that bounced back and couldn't hear for two days. He got nailed in the chin by a gate and lost a tooth and had 9 stitches in his chin. Another aspect of this is that if you don't have full on protection in SL, your tactics and line...and therefore your times...will suffer.

- Your GS skis are okay, but they are definitely old school. You don't want race stock FIS legal, at least to start with. Get something like an Atomic GS 12PB, the 19-meter sidecut, probably 180 cm. You're gonna want something better for SL, too, and here race stock is fine, as in Atomic SL 12PB, 165 cm.

Try it, you'll like it...
post #12 of 28
Quote:
Still have my "armored race sweater (Navy Blue/Red, Demetre
Man, why did I throw that away??!!??!???
post #13 of 28

You're probably a Spyder XL...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
I'm wondering what size GS suit that I would use (should I go this route). I would probably by a used one, sight unseen. I weigh about 215lbs. about 6'0" tall. I usually wear a Large ski pant and an XL jacket. I'm pretty wide across the shoulders, 45.5 inch chest (under the armpits). Would a Spyder XL fit?

About seperates. Where might someone find these on the net?
...some online sources:

Reliable Racing. They have all the usual suspects, including Energiapura two piece suits:


http://www.reliableracing.com/search...ch=Energiapura

Race Werks

http://www.race-werks.com/index.php

The Race Place

http://www.the-raceplace.com/

Ski Racing Development

http://www.skiracingdevelopment.com/...FQcYgQodaiKw8w

Fuxi Racing (also has two piece suits)

http://www.fuxiracingusa.com/
post #14 of 28
I'll sell you mine for cheap, although it's an XXL. I'm 6'2 185lb, the double x was necessary for it to be tall enough. I wear a Large in Spyder jackets and pants. This is a performance GS suit, the one that goes for 400ish. Used for 4 or 5 races, no training.

post #15 of 28
Top O' the line Spyder Gs suit that was over $600.00 9see the difference in the padding!

It has been worn once and is an XL.

Email me at Atomicman52@comcast.net if interested.
525x525px-LL-vbattach2193.jpg
post #16 of 28
Regarding the suit-I'd go XXL if I were you. I'm 5'10" 185-190 and wear an XL. I want a little room for extra layers if it's 10 degrees or so! If your league is good about having someone bring down coats that's great, but I usually bring an extra old coat and leave it at the bottom for the ride up.
post #17 of 28
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the offers on the suits. I think I'm going to wait at this point and see what happens. I think maybe I'm going to be an XXL but I'll try some on before I make the plunge.

Spyder sizing seems to be wacky. I have a XL Spyder ski jacket that fits perfect. I tried on a soft shell Spyder jacket in XL and it was too tight.

Maybe I'll look like a poser, or a..... whats the word? Gaper. I just tried on some of my cycling tights and they stretch over the top of my boots. The tights and the soft shell jacket should get me started.
post #18 of 28
Johnny,
The forum has already given you some sound advise, and it looks like you made up your mind on outerwear. Enjoy your race season!

Dennis
post #19 of 28
I say screw the suit. Show up in padded pants and a race sweater and kick some ass!
post #20 of 28
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voltron View Post
I say screw the suit. Show up in padded pants and a race sweater and kick some ass!
Thank you... Pretty much what I was thinking. Maybe a suit in the future. It does seem like a lot of people are trying to unload their race suits.

Lets talk about skis. I'm really having trouble grasping skiing a SL ski in the 160's. I mean....I used to run SGS on a 223cm Fischer. Are 2003 Atomics GS 11's already old school? How have the newer models changed? And why not a used Race Stock GS ski?
post #21 of 28

Your GS 11s are okay...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
Thank you... Pretty much what I was thinking. Maybe a suit in the future. It does seem like a lot of people are trying to unload their race suits.

Lets talk about skis. I'm really having trouble grasping skiing a SL ski in the 160's. I mean....I used to run SGS on a 223cm Fischer. Are 2003 Atomics GS 11's already old school? How have the newer models changed? And why not a used Race Stock GS ski?
...so just get started on them and see where it goes. I went from the GS 11 to the GS 11M to the GS 12PB, and it was a step up every time in terms of ease of turn initiation, ability to carve and hold, etc. I'm talking about the non-FIS versions, all of which had 19 meter sidecuts. IMHO, for beer league racing, this is what you want. Last season, I went to a FIS legal sidecut ski, Head IGS RD, 183 cm., 25.2 meter sidecut (this year the FIS legal sidecut is 27 m or greater). It works for me in Masters GS, where we have 70 second courses with challenging terrain, higher speeds, etc. compared to beer league races. I'd feel like the length and sidecut would be a little bit of a handicap in a beer league race. As for slalom...all I can tell you is that the FIS minimum length for Men's SL is 165 cm., and this is pretty much what everybody...World Cup, Masters, and so forth, is currently using. Okay, there are some guys on the Masters circuit who are skiing 155s or 157s, and there are probably some guys on the WC that are skiing a 168 or 170 or something similar. For what you're going to be doing, I'd think, at your size, you'd want to go with a 165...
post #22 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Voltron View Post
I say screw the suit. Show up in padded pants and a race sweater and kick some ass!
Hey... I do that for the last regular season slalom in my league after I have enough points to qualify for finals. Some guys get a chuckle from a lime green Spyder "Rad Pads" and the matching silver and lime green pants. My response to them is this: I've owned this outfit since 1987, and it still fits!
post #23 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denny1969 View Post
Hey... I do that for the last regular season slalom in my league after I have enough points to qualify for finals. Some guys get a chuckle from a lime green Spyder "Rad Pads" and the matching silver and lime green pants. My response to them is this: I've owned this outfit since 1987, and it still fits!
IMO, that sounds awesome actually. :
post #24 of 28
Thread Starter 
I was just watching some of those race crash videos. That really brought back some memories. Nothing like hitting a snow fence at speed.

I was checking out some bindings at the local ski shop. I know the owner. He was like what DIN are you looking for. I said probably a 14. He said "you aren't getting any younger you know." What the hey.
post #25 of 28

Just remember...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
I was just watching some of those race crash videos. That really brought back some memories. Nothing like hitting a snow fence at speed.

I was checking out some bindings at the local ski shop. I know the owner. He was like what DIN are you looking for. I said probably a 14. He said "you aren't getting any younger you know." What the hey.
...you can't get hurt in the air!
post #26 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnys Zoo View Post
I was just watching some of those race crash videos. That really brought back some memories. Nothing like hitting a snow fence at speed.
What about a SG gate at speed?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20qB1dXAM78

Dennis

PS Anyone feel free to embed the link.
post #27 of 28
Quote:
Fuxi Racing (also has two piece suits)

http://www.fuxiracingusa.com/
Reply With Quote
I met Fuxi at Mt. Hood last summer. What a character! Anyway, he has some bargains during the summer and some interesting items that seem to be his U.S exclusives.
post #28 of 28

Yeah, Fuxi is a trip...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoftSnowGuy View Post
I met Fuxi at Mt. Hood last summer. What a character! Anyway, he has some bargains during the summer and some interesting items that seem to be his U.S exclusives.
...I think he could sell snow to the Eskimos and get reorders. Okay, the truth...he does have a lot of cool stuff, and goes out of his way to make the customer happy. Definitely give him a try...
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