EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › sidecut revolution => width revolution => camber revolution => ????
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sidecut revolution => width revolution => camber revolution => ????

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
After half a day on K2 Fours in 1997 I bought a set and all of my skis since then have had a comparable sidecut.

Since then every time I have bought new skis they have been wider than the ones before: 65mm (Four), 70mm (Powertrac), 80mm (Legend 8000), 94mm (Mantra) and every time it was a step up in versatility and off-piste performance.

Now I have just spent my first whole day on reverse camber skis (Hellbents) and have come to the conclusion that regular camber is a huge handicap when skiing fresh snow. I believe that skis like the Seth with its mini-rocker will be the all mountain skis of the future and that regular camber will be reserved only for race skis and those with less than 80mm at the waist.

So now that almost every sacred cow in ski design has been killed what is left? What fundamental belief about ski design is the next to go? Ten years ago skis like Hellbents were beyond anyone's imagination, so what crazy ideas are floating out there waiting for their time to be recognised?
post #2 of 15
Lazers and fins, dude, lazers and fins.
post #3 of 15
Haven't you seen spiderman 3? air-boards, all the way.
post #4 of 15
Obviously Jer is clueless...............no lazers......................just fins......(biiiig finzzz)

SJ
post #5 of 15
Thread Starter 
Where would these fins go?
post #6 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwiski View Post
Where would these fins go?
Supposedly, IIRC there was a version of the Salomon Rocker with a fin thingy...

Regarding the Hell Bents - where'd you mount them? How'd they ski at the mount point you chose? What bindings?

BTW - when I skied Pontoons in the slush at TC a few weeks back, it was clear that fat/rockered skis were not yet the norm over in your neck of the woods. Nonetheless, always feels good to bring merriment and laughter to so many
post #7 of 15
Thread Starter 
The ones I demoed were at +2, I had mine mounted at +1 with FKS155.

They ski great, the sweet spot on them is about 1.5m so whatever you do is ok, ride the tails, press the tips, whatever. Fatties are still pretty rare at the commercial areas, most of the punters have never even heard of them, but at the club fields fat skis are the norm - it is just a function of less crowded slopes and a higher standard of skiers.
post #8 of 15
The next big advancement will be skis that leave tracks that disappear after 5 min, like disappearing ink. That way you can look at and enjoy your tracks from the bottom of the run, but the powder will never get tracked up.
post #9 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by mudfoot View Post
The next big advancement will be skis that leave tracks that disappear after 5 min, like disappearing ink. That way you can look at and enjoy your tracks from the bottom of the run, but the powder will never get tracked up.

I'd buy that for a dollar!!
post #10 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwiski View Post
The ones I demoed were at +2, I had mine mounted at +1 with FKS155.

They ski great, the sweet spot on them is about 1.5m so whatever you do is ok, ride the tails, press the tips, whatever. Fatties are still pretty rare at the commercial areas, most of the punters have never even heard of them, but at the club fields fat skis are the norm - it is just a function of less crowded slopes and a higher standard of skiers.
I should have been more specific in my question... The original shipments (at least I gather they were the early shipments) of Hell Bents here were stamped with a typical K2 factory line 7.5 cm range. The back mark was labeled "midsole" and the front "core center". More recent shipments have three marks. The original two plus another labeled "suggested" that looks to be +2 from the rear mark. Is your base of reference that usual rear mark or from the slightly more forward "suggested" mark. At least in my neighborhood, there is a fair bit of debate about where to mount for various purposes - and not enough people have skied them to produce a body of "common wisdom" yet. The only common theme seems to be that no one suggests going all the way to that rear mark. And that there is much interest and excitement about the skis...

Sounds like your take is that as long as someone is in the general range, it almost does not matter to get too hung up. Is this a correct interpretation?

[/semi-hijack]
post #11 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spindrift View Post
Sounds like your take is that as long as someone is in the general range, it almost does not matter to get too hung up. Is this a correct interpretation?
Yeah, don't get hung up on it, with these skis it really doesn't make much difference.

And it looks like I have the older style markings, and mine also have a red background colour on the bases, most of the others I have seen have a white background colour.

post #12 of 15
I'd say wait till you try the Hellbents in something other than pow.

Camber can definitely be a benefit in crud/chop.
post #13 of 15
whaddya call those bugged out tails on the 205cm Fischers they've got this season?

the tail has like a nib or something.

is that the future?

personally a ski shooting a fine stream of compressed air so you hover above the snow about .5mm would be sweet. Maybe.
post #14 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAGGOT View Post
I'd say wait till you try the Hellbents in something other than pow.

Camber can definitely be a benefit in crud/chop.
These were the conditions I skied three days ago:



About 10-20cm of fresh on top of a hard, refrozen spring layer. There were no clean powder runs to be had. Started turning to spring conditions on the lower mountain later in the day. The Hellbents loved it, with the extra width I was hitting the lower harder layer less but it was more jarring when I did.

I have also used them on a windswept icy groomer and that wasn't much fun. Basically if there is any chance of fresh snow I will choose the Hellbent over the Mantra.
post #15 of 15
Thats odd, I would want something very very different than Hellbents in those conditions, maybe ANTs or Squads, depending how steep/open it was and how fast you'd be going.

Some people seem to love the rockered skis in all conditions though, so if they work for you, more power to ya, and enjoy em. They just aren't for everyone.
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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › sidecut revolution => width revolution => camber revolution => ????