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Binding Torsional Stiffness Tests: need your help for the research effort

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 
With all the debate over torsional stiffness of skis, the torsional stiffness of bindings has been almost completely overlooked. So I put together a test jig and have been measuring it for skis/bindings I own or have access to.

(A few of you may remember the discussion that went on towards the end of this thread...)

Anyway, I now have measurements from a few different Tyrolia and Salomon bindings. I have several Look/Rossis that I haven't tested yet, and probably soon some Marker Dukes.

What I need are more bindings to test, either on loan (preferred) or for sale cheap. New is preferred but used in good condition is OK.

Looking for:
-Atomic Neox (12 DIN or greater). I have a new-in-box pair of Look PX12 in full or partial trade for these.
-Any modern Marker, 12 DIN or greater, that can mount flat on a ski
-Salomon S912 or S914
-Tyrolia non-Railflex LD12, HD14, Mojo, etc.
-Any race stock Salomon or Look

Bindings are tested by mounting them to sacrificial straight skis, clicking in a test boot, and adjusting DIN a couple times...nothing significant will happen to them.

Please let me know if you can help out.
post #2 of 8
Thread Starter 
^ bump

Considering the controversy last time I brought this up and all the posts about the Lou Dawson article, I figured I'd get a little more response than this.
post #3 of 8
So what are your results so far in terms of fee-play and binding flex? Please also include elasticity with regard to how far the boot can move without causing a release. Thanks for the info.
post #4 of 8
Most everything I have is mounted. But it is an interesting concept.
post #5 of 8
I'll send you a pair if you can test them and send them back fairly quickly...

Send me a pm.
post #6 of 8
Pm sent about some s916s.
post #7 of 8
I have some loose Salomon 727E's that could be an interesting benchmark.

I could send those along with some S912's. What is your turn around time?
post #8 of 8
Thread Starter 
Good to see some interest!

The most important thing I'm finding is that tests like mine and Dawson's (measuring pure side-to-side flex) mostly measure the torsional stiffness of the heelpiece -- because, with the possible exception of Dynafit, the heelpiece holds the boot much more securely than the toepiece. (Think of Salomon toes, which are designed to have space *under* the toe when properly adjusted.) Therefore, properly measuring toepiece stiffness as it affects skiing would require 1) the ski to be flexed in a typical carving pattern while measuring, and 2) the "boot" to be flexed forward and to the side in a repeatable way, like a skier driving the tips in a turn. Neither is possible with my very simple rig, which uses a flat plane and an actual ski boot (plus modifications)...this would require a complicated jig, a fully rigid pseudo-boot, and actual sensors for measurement, instead of weights and a metal ruler like I'm using now.

However, the results are still interesting. One of the most interesting parts is simply being able to see what part of the system is flexing: with enough weight it's generally obvious. FWIW, I am testing at both lower and higher DIN.

Ghost: I'm not set up to test binding elasticity, which is a whole another set of issues (though I think it would be a very good test). Also, I'd rather post the results all at once rather than dribbling them out over time, as they're only useful in comparison.

UP Racer: you've got a PM.

stoicchris: you've got a PM.

Philpug: Turn around time would probably be about a week plus shipping on each side. I can probably do it much faster, but would rather overdeliver than disappoint.

Note: if you are local to the Bay Area and your bindings are already mounted to skis, that's not a problem, as I simply mount unmounted bindings to dumpster skis as part of setup. The process doesn't damage skis (although if you are a racer and/or very sensitive about your edge or base tune, I wouldn't want to be responsible for accidentally messing them up.)
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EpicSki › The Barking Bear Forums › On the Snow (Skiing Forums) › Ski Gear Discussion › Binding Torsional Stiffness Tests: need your help for the research effort