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Anyone used Maplus diamond 'stones'

post #1 of 11
Thread Starter 
why do we call them stones when they are diamond powder bonded to a plastic or metal surface? Anyway has anyone used the Maplus files and are they better than moonflex? Is moonflex the same pattern as used on Vallorbe diamond files?
post #2 of 11
Sorma describe their Moonflex products as diamond files, not stones.
post #3 of 11
I'm not aware of Vallorbe diamond files, only their Icecut (laser cut) metal files.

Diamond 'files' or 'stones' are made much like sandpaper AFAIK, where the diamonds are adhered to a paper backing which is attached to flexible plastic (Moonflex) or rigid aluminum (Maplus). Additionally, I think, the Maplus diamond stones use a higher grade paper backing.

Personally, I like the Maplus stones better than the Moonflexes as I get a better 'feedback/feel' due to more rigidity. The flexibility of the Moonflexes is really very slight and in a guide with full support (ie, T4B Razor or Xact), I can't feel the difference between them and the Maplus. I do feel the difference using them by hand or with metal guides with a 1" wide spring clamp. Note, you should never bear down hard with stones and files, but let the tool do the cutting.

The Moonflexes have more surface area of cutting diamonds than the Maplus.

Here's a photo of Maplus & Moonflex diamond stones:



Additionally, from DiaFace Makers of Moonflex in Italy):

Quote:
The DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® diamond files should be used lubricated, spraying on them a solution of 50% water and 50% denatured alcohol. In emergency, on the ski slope, the snow could be enough to keep them lubricated. The preparation of the edge should be made as follows:
· Create the edge with DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® 100 grit (black) using then the various grits in sequence for obtaining the mirror finishing (200-400-600-1500). Three or four passes of each grit, without exerting pressure, are enough to obtain a perfect result.
· If you wish to lap the edge use DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® 1500/3000 Resin.
· An adequate instrument is needed to keep the tool stable and perfectly flat (it is inadvisable the free hand use of the tool).
· DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® can be used for the preparation and finishing of the side edge as well as for the tuning.
· After use, clean the DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® file with the solution of water and alcohol using a small bronze brush.
The correct use of DIAFACE® MOONFLEX® allows the preparation of hundreds of perfect edges.
post #4 of 11
I am pretty sure the Moonflex is diamond powder adhered to metal, not paper.
post #5 of 11
Looks like we are both inaccurate (from DiaFace):

Quote:
DIAFACE® and MOONFLEX® are employed in high-potential industrial fields to facilitate the production process and to improve quality of the finished product. They are used for a great variety of applications in the industrial field (glass, stone and mechanical industries), as well as in the field of sport (working of ski, snowboard and speedskate edges).
Every step of the productive process is constantly controlled by us in order to ensure a high-quality standard.
DIAFACE® and MOONFLEX® are studied to set off the flexibility of the product and to allow an efficacious bottom removal.
The carefully chosen diamond powders are applied to a cloth which is extremely flexible and long lasting.

The design of our cloths, in which areas with diamond alternate with areas without diamond, has been the object of careful studies, to enhance the characteristics of the product.
The diamond is not covering the whole surfaceIAFACE® products show a design with circular pellets, as to ensure the greatest flexibility, and the design with half-moons of the MOONFLEX® cloth guarantees long life as well as a perfect cutting action and a uniform surface.
The backing on the MoonFlexes sound more like an emery cloth than sandpaper.

Regarding longevity of the Maplus versus MoonFlex, I had a MoonFlex 400 wear out after one year and have yet to wear out my Maplus stones nor my newer MoonFlexes (not enough mileage to determine a real comparison).
post #6 of 11
A bit of a disclamer:

Terry asked me to join in here. Before this past season I never tuned my own gear before.



I started out the season with the 200 and 400 Maplus diamond stones and a Razor multi-tool. This combination, along with a panzer file, served quite well to tune up my already established edges and to set some badly abused edges.

I did notice that the 200 was not agressive enough to take out the nicks and scrapes from rock damage, so I purchased a 100 grit. Terry was ot of the Maplus stones, so he sent me a Moonflex.

My first impression was that there is a lot more area to the Moonflex! However, when you really look at it, I think do to distribution of diamond, there is probably more abrasive on the Maplus stones.

The Moonflex stones do not fit in the razor in one orientation, I had to disasemble the tool and cut down the plastic nub that the adjustment screw locks down on by a little bit more then 1/16.

I think I've done two tunes with the combination of the 100 grit Moonflex and the 200 & 400 Maplus stones. I start out with the moonflex to hit the bad spots and to soften up the work hardening and then move up.

While the Moonflex does "flex" a tiny bit, once it is in a holder or clamped to a guide I really don't think it is going anywhere.

I really can't say that there are any clear advantages to one brand over the other (unless we are talking DMT, those are tiny and the diamonds look almost non-existant). However, after using these three stones, I prefer the Maplus.

I think that the pattern on the Moonflex stones leaves a lot of edge hitting nothing but the backing of the stone. The Maplus pattern seems to allow the edge to only ride over the abrasive, and it felt "smoother" to me over the length of the ski. I could feel the diamonds doing there job the entire time, where it felt like the mooflex would hit gaps where nothing was happening.

This feeling may have been the difference in grit, but I personally don't think so.
post #7 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
.......Additionally, from DiaFace Makers of Moonflex in Italy):
Just to be pedantic, DiaFace is the name of the product range. The company that makes them is called Sorma
http://www.sorma.net
post #8 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by krp8128 View Post
A bit of a disclamer:

Terry asked me to join in here. Before this past season I never tuned my own gear before.



I started out the season with the 200 and 400 Maplus diamond stones and a Razor multi-tool. This combination, along with a panzer file, served quite well to tune up my already established edges and to set some badly abused edges.

I did notice that the 200 was not agressive enough to take out the nicks and scrapes from rock damage, so I purchased a 100 grit. Terry was ot of the Maplus stones, so he sent me a Moonflex.

My first impression was that there is a lot more area to the Moonflex! However, when you really look at it, I think do to distribution of diamond, there is probably more abrasive on the Maplus stones.

The Moonflex stones do not fit in the razor in one orientation, I had to disasemble the tool and cut down the plastic nub that the adjustment screw locks down on by a little bit more then 1/16.

I think I've done two tunes with the combination of the 100 grit Moonflex and the 200 & 400 Maplus stones. I start out with the moonflex to hit the bad spots and to soften up the work hardening and then move up.

While the Moonflex does "flex" a tiny bit, once it is in a holder or clamped to a guide I really don't think it is going anywhere.

I really can't say that there are any clear advantages to one brand over the other (unless we are talking DMT, those are tiny and the diamonds look almost non-existant). However, after using these three stones, I prefer the Maplus.

I think that the pattern on the Moonflex stones leaves a lot of edge hitting nothing but the backing of the stone. The Maplus pattern seems to allow the edge to only ride over the abrasive, and it felt "smoother" to me over the length of the ski. I could feel the diamonds doing there job the entire time, where it felt like the mooflex would hit gaps where nothing was happening.

This feeling may have been the difference in grit, but I personally don't think so.
I think that if you are pressing the stone so hard as to flex it (it is rigid plastic), then you are doing something wrong. I dont doubt that the Maplus product is very good, but the Moonflex are more than adequate IMHO. But I too have wondered about the spaces in all of these diamond tools, I dont see why they are not simply completley covered in abrasive media.
post #9 of 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie-Rich View Post
But I too have wondered about the spaces in all of these diamond tools, I dont see why they are not simply completley covered in abrasive media.
I believe the spaces serve as little "pockets" to collect minute shavings so that you are not as prone to grind them back into the surface you are working. That is why you need to clean the stones regularly as you work.
post #10 of 11
Thread Starter 
That is also why you should use them 'wet' so that there is fluid to allow the debris to flow to the pockets. A regular wash under some running cold water and a brush with a nail brush cleans the debris out.
post #11 of 11
FWIW, my SOP is to use a 4 oz spray bottle with 50/50 denatured alcohol. along with a stiff nylon brush and sanding belt eraser mounted on my stand to keep the stones clean every handful of strokes or so.
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