Originally Posted by cirquerider
There are some good discussions going on. This isn't one of them.
While the tone my vary wildly, I think it's actually just what is needed for the majority of EpicSki readers to help them see and consider the relevant issues. *Not* talking about it has allowed bad behavior to increase since everyone sees it go undeclared and unpunished.
Originally Posted by cirquerider
...like many threads in the technique section, it has become about both Max and PMTS, because that is the direction he chose to take the conversation. This happens so frequently that it appears the majority of our ski instruction threads have come to be about those subjects.
No doubt each person will report their own perception
about this but I think your statement nails one of the biggest irritations.
The more we are harassed, harangued and proselytized with a given ideology, the more sensitive and retaliatory we become to new occurances of that behavior. We can live with chasing the Moonies away from our front door once or twice a year
. When they show up at our doorstep six times a month, that's not OK. When they show up to proselytize us virtually everywhere we go, we've no other choice but to deal with it.We
fully understand the deep emotional attachment such people have to their own convictions. They
just don't seem to understand that we don't want their convictions
Do you see why I suggested earlier that it's pointless to answer Max's demand for "proof"? Yes, we can find hundreds, perhaps thousands of examples - but Max (or any other person for that matter) can re-weave each individual example
into a different meaning, a different intent, a different perspective, etc. Every isolated instance
of bad behavior can be denied as such
by re-framing or justifying it with both real and fallacious logic. If a clever Sophist is any good at all, readers will generally be more swayed by the portrayed appearance of Truth
than by the actual truth itself.
Trying to "prove it" with an individual post is like trying to pick a single wet spaghetti noodle out of a hot colander - it just slips away by clinging to the tangled mass of noodles it's embedded in - while you get burned. The only mechanism to demonstrate a disingenuous party's intent
is to look at their larger Pattern of behavior
instead. An overall pattern
cannot be so easily 'explained away' or rationalized into acceptance.
While I agree with EpicSki concerns about Viral Marketing I would also suggest people look at the definition for Stealth Marketing
There was also a very nice story on stealth marketing by 60-Minutes
a while back.
I think your premature reference to Godwin's Law actually skewed demonstration of the Law. As I recall, there is another law that states "The more we observe a Thing, the more we Change that thing..." In this case, by revealing to the kids that you're "aware of the cookie on the table" you defer/alter their attempts to swipe it.
This idea is also important to this discusion. Hopefully, Readers on EpicSki will learn to quickly recognize the deliberately fallacious reasoning
that is used to deliver misinformation and duplicitously pique a readers emotions. In an ideal world, everyone will come to easily recognize every deliberate bundling of False Information
with emotional lures and subtle intimidations
for what it is: A Deliberate Con Job.
All the wailing appeals to victimization and protestations of innocence to capture the readers sympathy simply fail when sufficiently educated readers take a comprehensive look at the Patterns of Misbehavior
hidden behind Patterns of Fallacy
Originally Posted by newfydog
...please explain the difference between enthusiastic participation by opinionated participants and ad nauseum drumbeats.
And as an example, let me provide a link to the best coach I ever had:http://www.skicamps.com/expenses.html
OK, since you asked.... Just go ahead and post that link again 30 or more times.
Now go post every other link you can find related to that site, that fellow, his methods of skiing, his methods of teaching and regurgitations of his every word. Over the course of 500 posts, report every success you've ever had with him. Be sure to interpret something
he has said into some kind of 'relevance' into every thread, every concept, every mechanical discussion on the forum (pick anything at all that will seem to 'fit' the thread). Also mention his name and the name of his business entity every chance you get even when totally unnecessary.
There you go: You have just created an "ad nauseum drumbeat". (NOTE: It works best when you work with Like-Minded Tag-Team partners.)