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MA: SL Turns, Breck 4-12

post #1 of 15
Thread Starter 
I thought I'd throw some of the video that I shot with Heluva up here for discussion.

I don't particularly like them, but Greg and Rick both said they are an improvement over last year's stuff, so I'll give it a shot.

I'm not a youtube fan, at least for MA, so here are the actual files (they are small):
http://nnskiing.org/G Pics/GregBreck4.wmv
http://nnskiing.org/G Pics/GregBreck5.wmv

Equipment: 06 Nordica Dobermann SLR; 165 with Marker Piston Plate and 14.0 binders
Nordica Dobie 150 boots, aligned etc by Greg Hoffman


I had been messing around on groomers with Heluva and Rick (fastman) for a few hours after skiing pow in the morning, and I had been doing javelins and the schlopy drill to try to aid in removing some of the tippiness from my right turns. I had also been skiing on one ski a lot.

In the GB4 video, I was on a VERY flat piece of groomer. My focus was on trying to keep my shoulders level to create angulation. The lack of pitch results in slow speeds and low-power turns.

In GB5, it is a significantly steeper pitch. I wasn't really focusing on anything specific. FWIW, here's the same exact pitch skied by someone far better than me.

Thanks in advance for any advice.
post #2 of 15
I like your style. I did see one thing. Notice anything different about your skiing and the guy skiing the same pitch from the bottom video. It looks like Heluva skier? His outside hand drives through the turn which keeps his hips over the skis. Exaggerate this movement at first. It's the gas pedal.
post #3 of 15
I see your tails converging some, a sign that you need to move your inside hip toward the tip of your inside ski more aggressively. This convergence often happens when the body moves too far in a tipped fashion in toward the center of the turn and the inside foot needs to pivot a bit to provide a stable stance. By moving more directly in the direction that you want to go, the skis can stay at a more constant width throughout the turn. Nice stuff though...
post #4 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublediamond223 View Post
My focus was on trying to keep my shoulders level to create angulation. .
You might want to try moving your focus from your shoulders to your pelvis. A strong counter balanced position is the inside hip being level with (or even better) higher than the outside hip.

Take at look at the 2nd video where you ski by the camera. Note that you are slightly rotated into the turn showing a lack of hip counter and very little counter balance (angulation). Also, is that inside foot getting away from you?

Not sure what type of release you were intending to do, but if OLR you have a bit of pop between turns.
post #5 of 15
Wow! those are some very un-TGR like turns on short skis in that first clip!
Now behave yourself or I'll turn you in.

As you know, I'm not in a position to judge, but what do you think happened in that 9th (right) turn on GB5. Looked like my classic tip. I did exactly that skiing with X-Eastcoaster and Dookey67 at Squaw and landed on my ass, making a hopfully invisible recovery. Probably no such luck.

I suspect you can add something to interpret your intention and what you see in these videos. What would you like to see changed? (besides the length of your skis. Please give them back to your kid sister now. ).
post #6 of 15
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirquerider View Post
As you know, I'm not in a position to judge, but what do you think happened in that 9th (right) turn on GB5.
There was a bump in the terrain. It happened as a consequence of the transition, not so much the turn. I hit the bump and did not retract/absorb enough, and got thrown onto the inside ski. I had been carving around on one ski a lot, so getting back into balance was not an issue.

If you watch heluva's other clip on that pitch, you can see him hit the same bump and retract his knees almost to his chest, avoiding the bobble that I had. (~10 second mark)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cirquerider
I suspect you can add something to interpret your intention and what you see in these videos. What would you like to see changed? (besides the length of your skis. Please give them back to your kid sister now. ).
Haha. We skied fat skis in the morning crud and occasional pow until about 1 o'clock every day. We switched to race skis mostly because our legs and/or lungs just couldn't deal with the crud anymore (at least mine couldn't ). I see many things wrong with this video, primarily that the right turns are tippy as hell, but I'll wait for others to chime in. The intent (I hate the connotations of that word on this forum) was SL race turns. I hope to look more like heluva, and just generally improve.

I made up for my tons of short, slow turns on friday, where I made about 1 turn on the A-basin groomers on the Bros for every 15 I made the day before on the SLRs.

(Besides, just having an MA thread is already enough to screw me on TGR anyway)
post #7 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublediamond223 View Post
...The intent (I hate the connotations of that word on this forum)...
What are those connotations and why do you hate them?
post #8 of 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgeib View Post
What are those connotations and why do you hate them?
Its often used as an excuse for less than perfect turns.
post #9 of 15
Hi Doublediamond223,

Hey, thems some nice turns! I haven’t seen any of your other clips, but these are good for doing MAs on.

I like the DIRT in both clips, very consistent. I would call both turn types short radius. You are moving down the hill smoothly and the timing is good. You have great control of managing your tip lead, very little that I could see. I like the width of the stance and I’m sure you are having way too much fun!

A few things that I noticed are that the stance is a bit low causing some hinging. This might have something to do with the upward move to start the turn. Also you are showing both legs bent showing absents of long leg short leg, which IMHO, would cause the lack of angles to develop from the top of the turn to the apex of the turn. I would really like to see more clips with a MED radius turn to see if you let these angles develop to a higher degree. In your left turn, I see counter with the right shoulder and in a lesser amount, the hip. It looks as though the shoulder is being left behind. I am aware of this because I have a tendency to do this myself, and I’m working very hard to stay squarer with both my shoulders and hips.

So things to work on would be IMHO,

•Stand taller. Try to show more long leg short leg through the turn. Really work on keeping your outside leg straighter through the turn until your move to the transition. Try and bring the inside leg up into the chest more and really get it involved in the turn. There’s nothing wrong with showing some inclination at the top of the turn and then leveling out after the apex.
•Try and move more laterally when starting the turn and not with a vertical move. Let the new inside foot and leg pass underneath the body mass when starting the new turn. Again, this will help with the development of angles and extension of the outside leg.
•With the counter question, what has helped me is to make sure that I keep the outside hand and arm in view. A simple thing, but it works for me. Try and be more aggressive with working the outside ski through the turn.


These are my thought on what you might work on. I think you are on a good path for improving your skiing. No one is ever through learning, unless they think they are, and then they are left behind. My two cents worth.------Wigs
post #10 of 15
Greg,

This is a big improvement over last years skiing. Your turns are much smoother and there is much less pop in your skiing. There's also a lot more power and stability. I guess it comes from smoothness because I'm seeing less effective use of edging than in last years arc2 clip. That's strange. I like the group consensus on counter as an issue to work on. I don't have anything different to add on that account. I suspect that as you work on this, you'll be able to get on higher edge angles again. As much as Weems is exhorting you to stand taller, you are already standing taller than Heluva and I'll bet his hunchback position is influencing you somewhat. Speaking of hot shots, all good racers know to watch the skier in front of them to be able to see and anticipate those nasty terrain surprises instead of getting hit by the same crap (play Heluva's clip in slow motion in the same spot and you'll see a very similar bobble). But at least you're entertaining the videographer. We love to see train wrecks keep happening in the same spot over and over.
post #11 of 15
[quote=therusty;696280]Greg,

>>As much as Weems is exhorting you to stand taller, you are already standing taller than Heluva and I'll bet his hunchback position is influencing you somewhat.<<

I think you meant Wigs, but that's okay, this mistake in identity has happened before.

I still think that he would benefit more by standing taller. If you notice, both knees are bent. I would like to see the outside knee straighter. This could develop into a much more powerful turn for him.---Wigs
post #12 of 15
Sorry Wigs,

I missed of (cough) wigged out there. But I blame it on that rusty guy behind the keyboard.

I'm not disagreeing at all. I was just observing that DD was already a lot taller than the hell of a guy he was skiing with.
post #13 of 15
I didn't see Heluva's turns on this outing. Although the clips that I have seen, I liked. I will have to backtrack and look again.---Wigs
post #14 of 15
The link was in earlier post in this thread
Quote:
If you watch heluva's other clip on that pitch, you can see him hit the same bump and retract his knees almost to his chest, avoiding the bobble that I had. (~10 second mark)
and in Heluva's MA thread.
post #15 of 15
Great skiing some of the better stuff posted here except well Helvaskiers.

I know this is repeating what I said in are IM convo for the most part.

Alot of tipping, you start every turn with it. More so on your right turns as you are probably favoring your right leg.

More counter too!!! your hips follow every turns which causes the shoulder to do the same thing.

You move in to the turn fine but stop moving after that sometime putting you aft(not back seat just not as forward as you could or should be).

something that could get you moving down the hill better, and some more counter would be to draw a line straight down the hill and try to move along during the transtions. this can normally kill 2 birds with one stone.

On the tipping get on those bros and try to arc clean arc on wide open groomers, concentrate on you outside foots big toe.

again nice skiing I dont think I could make Sl turns that nice.
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