New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

To Scrape or not to Scrape

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
I have tried both ways after waxing, I could not notice the difference. Perhaps my skill level is too low to notice and I am not in a racing mode either.

For everyday skiing, I think to scrape and broom wax is a waste of time. After few runs, the base is flat as ever.
post #2 of 18
Scrape thin
Then Brush,

It's fun!
And that nice surface is a joy to behold!
post #3 of 18
Most of the time, I don't scrape. The skis are sticky for the first 20-50 feet or so on the snow, but beyond that they are just fine (and the bases end up looking like they were scraped and brushed). I think for general recreational use, this is a fine way to deal with wax.
post #4 of 18
Just to don't scrape after you hot wax? Do you drip your wax on, or just crayon? I could see getting away with not scraping if you just crayon, but not if you drip.

Does your wax last any longer if ou don't scrape?
post #5 of 18
: OH NO! not another scrape/not scrape debate. I say scrape, it looks better!
post #6 of 18
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by billyymc View Post
Just to don't scrape after you hot wax? Do you drip your wax on, or just crayon? I could see getting away with not scraping if you just crayon, but not if you drip.

Does your wax last any longer if ou don't scrape?
I forgot to mention that I drip the wax on, iron it flat, leave it over night and ski on it. The difference between scraping and not scraping after the wax is dried has little affect on my skiing.
post #7 of 18
I scrape because it looks sexy.
post #8 of 18
If you scrape and brush, you're allowed to use 'traverse' as a dirty word.
post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by comprex View Post
If you scrape and brush, you're allowed to use 'traverse' as a dirty word.
Is that including "dripping"?
post #10 of 18
The people in the know say: You want the wax in the base not on it. If you have a nicely conditioned base (one with lots of good wax jobs on it) it will be a fast ski. If you do not scrape a freshly ironed on wax job the excess wax on the base can chunk out tearing out the good inpregnated wax in the structure. That is bad because all of your waxing will be for not and the bases will be unprotected.

It is really nice to have a fast ski and not have to skate down a road. Not to mention the fun of passing your buddies with slow skis.

We will do a race scrape and brush which is basically get it all off. Ski to the start and inspect on other skis. Put on your race skis, take a hot lap to warm up with your race skis, then get into the starting gate.

And we do a train scrape which is a lighter scrape which takes off the high spots and blends the wax to a uniform smooth layer. Then brush it to further smooth and polish it for durability. This woeks very well and can last one to a max. of two ski days. If you are recreational skiing this is what I would do.

The race scrape is actually probably just as long lasting due to the wax we have in the structure but we feel safer ensuring it remains in the ski to do the train scrape.

I have seen the chunk out I explained earlier and it is not good. You will see cracking in the thick unscraped wax, even with warm conditions softer waxes, and much more so with colder waxes. This cracking is one of the pre-chunk out symptoms.
post #11 of 18
Coarse spring snow, don't bother.

All other conditions, scrape.

Races, scrape, use several brushes etc, fret all night and morning about it.
post #12 of 18
On days when I'm too lazy or rushed to do a good scrape and brush, I find it takes about an hour or two of skiing before I don't feel the built up wax slowing me down.
post #13 of 18
It's better to scrape and brush to free the structure to minimize suction than not. As stated, you are trying to put the wax, (in the form of a micro thin layer) in the bases, not on the bases.

A case in point was this past Sunday where I was expecting frozen corn and gradual warming/softening. It turns out that it was a surprise 'powder' day. Wet at lower elevations and drier, higher up. Had I not scraped and brushed, it would have been a drag (in more ways than one) because the softer snow would not have removed the wax all day and we couldn't have glided well and really enjoyed the day. Scraping and manual brushing can be done in less than 5 or 10 minutes. Roto brushes reduce scraping time and overall time.

Liquids & sprays take scraping out of the loop, minimizes brushing, mess and time.
post #14 of 18
If you don't have the time to scrape...don't fricken wax, you'll get better performance. Seriously.
post #15 of 18
The only advantage you get to a ski that is not scraped is a long-lasting/poor-performing glide. Yay.

some think all the wax scrapes off in the first run.

A) often the first run is the most fun and hence I like a fast ski then.
B) even after I scrape and brush, I can still see my fingernail marks in the base if I scratch it after a day of skiing. That tells me even well finished wax jobs last longer than one run.
C) wax is sticky stuff. globs of it will absorb dirt into your base. Another yay for sandpaper textures!
D) slow/sticky bases are MUCH more fatiguing than ones that slide. Notice how exhausted your buddy is after half a day of skiing? That is largely in part due to the fact that he has to work just to make his ski slide.

If you spend 30 minutes waxing... why not 5 scraping? Oh, right... you waxed for a slow ride that exhausts you. forgot.
post #16 of 18
I find unscraped and brushed skis gross. Carrying them on my shoulder I get wax on my coat from the edges.

The bases are not flat they have an uneven surface.

Skis with wax on them that hasn't been scraped and brushed?

post #17 of 18
I get the impression that some of you who are against 'not scraping' have not even tried it. I do it both ways and there is not a noticeable difference on the hill. Really. Maybe the scraped and brushed ski gives an extra few % performance, but I don't notice it. Now admittedly, the scraped and brushed ski looks better on the workbench, but at the end of a day of skiing I am hard pressed to notice a difference.

As far as longevity, I generally have to re-wax after 2-3 days of skiing no matter how I treat the wax -- scraping/brushing or not. The man-made snow around here is tough on wax. If there is a difference between scraping or not scraping, it's small compared to the abuse the wax takes from the snow.

Samurai, for your points A and D -- the wax is gone after 20-50 ft of skiing. I have checked this myself as I often ski down to a lodge from my car and take off my skis to go inside before my first run. Except for the tips and tails, the ski bases are generally free of wax and smooth after that short jaunt, with the structure well defined. I honestly only notice extra stickiness in the first few seconds after the skis first hit the snow.
post #18 of 18
well, I don't know what kind of wax you are using, but if it scrapes off in 20-50 ft of skiing, I would be surprised if you could go 2-3 days with any wax job. :

I have tried both. I've been hand-tuning my skis for over 20 seasons and have had more than a few random; "F*** it. I'm in a hurry." scenarios where I didn't scrape. If you don't notice a difference, perhaps you've never even really freed your structure in the first place. Giving you the exact same perception as a non-finished ride.

The truth is that base material is actually more water resistant than any wax as a material. We aren't waxing to actually improve our water-repellancy, but rather to treat the surface in an attempt to give the water a place to go... hence structure. If low-fluoros, graphites, or any wax was actually faster than base material, we would construct our bases out of a harder derivitive of any of those waxes. But it's not, so we don't. In an ideal world, we would only machine grind our bases' structures to meet the day's conditions. But that is not ideal. So we apply a temporary composition and adjust it along with our standard structure to best meet those needs.

snow crystals' shape, as well as temperature, play a huge role in that structure. Cold waxes are harder than warm-temp waxes, not because they are (or need to be) less water-repellent, but because they defend against the sharp crystals of colder snow better. (Imagine trying to ride a cotton shirt down a hill covered in needles... you wouldn't move.) Warm waxes are soft so we can easily manipulate them with brushes etc, to make strong/apparent structures to move the excessive amounts of water we ride on in spring time. Quite frankly, if you had the tools to manipulate a hard/cold wax as easily as we manipulate softer waxes, we wouldn't even have warm-temp waxes.

Every day I see people (specifically snowboarders because their bases show me such a larger picture) who have gobs of very old, white, cracked wax on their boards. Surely they've ridden longer than 50 feet? and based on the generalizations I make about that rider's ability based on their dress/the way they walk/carry a board, it is blatantly obvious that that wax job is perhaps weeks or even a season old. To them, a well waxed snowboard is similar to a well waxed surfboard, forgetting that the whole point to keeping wax on your surfboard is to provide traction to slippery surfaces in wet conditions.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Tuning, Maintenance and Repairs