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What is it about Wide ski?

post #1 of 27
3/19/07 at 10:34am
Thread Starter 
What is it about wide skis that make them so much fun? I have trended towards wider skis since the first pair I bought. From waist of 70,77(when that was wider remember?) and now 94mm. I bought the Mantras 2 yrs ago and cannot put them away.
I use them in bumps, hard packed, tress,etc.. The only time I put them away is when it's super icy, wind blown and cold!
I don't know if it's that they are more forgiving. Or if I like the more substancial feeling under foot. Or maybe they are softer than what I'm used to?
What ever it is, and I'd like to know, all I want to do it ride my wide skis.
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post #2 of 27
3/19/07 at 10:57am
For me, a wider ski underfoot makes it more fun to ski variable snow. I find it (a wider ski) won't get deflected as much or knocked around as much as a narrower ski when skiing variable off-piste conditions.

And IMO, you really don't sacrifice that much in maneuverability or edge-to-edge quickness. Yesterday at Mammoth I was skiing a 192 with a 114 waist in spring corn, slush bumps, and wide open bowls. Naturally, the ski ripped and was super stable at off-piste GS turns, but it was really fun bumps, and I could bust out short-radius turns too.

Video of what of our day was like yesterday is on the front page at www.mammoth-snowman.com. You have to sit through or foward through (after the entire video loads) this morning's mammoth conditions report, and then Splat talking about PMGear skis, but then immediately after is footage of me making all kinds of turns on the 192 (with dimensions of 143-114-132) (everyone else is on a slightly narrower ski with a 99 waist, but I'm on the 114 waist). I don't see why i'd go narrower for the type of skiing I do.
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post #3 of 27
3/19/07 at 11:22am
Great post and video. Thanks
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post #4 of 27
3/19/07 at 11:32am
Fat skis are for hosers.
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post #5 of 27
3/19/07 at 12:15pm
I think that wide skis make sense if you do a lot of skiing in areas with abundant natural snow, where the chances of going off-piste are more likely.

If your primary skiing venues are like the options immediate to my area, then they make very little sense. I opt for race carvers most days, here in the mid-Atlantic, and usually ski on either race carvers or GS race/cross skis when I head up to New England.

But when I'm back in the old Utah stomping grounds, a mid-fat or a full fat is a lot of fun - if you stick to the less-groomed stuff.
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post #6 of 27
3/19/07 at 1:38pm
I'm sold !

I really like the yellow skis, but the black and yellow ones are fun too.

I guess all the tools are good, Next time out, I'm taking the K2 710's, They say RACE on them. They must be fun.

Seriously, Wides skis are fun in soft snow, (east or west, on or off the marked trails) and that includes trees, fresh pow, spring corn, and rotten sun cup. Wide skis that can float you give a more uniform ride as you transition between snow depths. You ski in a layer of yielding snow, not hitting a hard bottom so often.

Thinner skis excel on the hard stuff, likely because you can stand so much closer to the edges. You are skiing ON the snow surface with only the edge penetration for grip.

When I think about the difficulties I have skiing, it's mostly a matter of fore and aft momentum accomodation. Fast and flat, then "boom", droping to knee deep, then ten yards later , back in someone elses cut up.

Consistancy

It all makes sense to me!

CalG
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post #7 of 27
3/19/07 at 7:33pm

?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer View Post
Fat skis are for hosers.
Joking, right? I ski to have a good time, and if fat means more fun, so be it. I used to have a buddy- excellent skier- trainer at The Canyons- that called shapes "cheater sticks". That was while I was grinning ear to ear leaving arcs in the snow that made him drool.

If this is not a joke, I assume you are on woodies with cable bindings and leather boots, right?

Hope I didn't miss the obvious fun here.
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post #8 of 27
3/19/07 at 8:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by warematt View Post

Hope I didn't miss the obvious fun here.
you did
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post #9 of 27
3/19/07 at 8:04pm

Jer was kidding . . . .

Wish the OP had done a bit of a search . . . .

http://forums.epicski.com/showthread.php?t=53214

This was 5 page thread less than a week ago where Jer took on some heavy weights about the benefits of width. I am in the same mind frame as Jer - width in SOFT snow is a great benefit and allows most skiers to experience more of the mountain with greater confidence.

Please . . . I don't think I can read another 5 page argument - wide skis are great if you like them and if it makes skiing fun for you. I take a bit of pride in being the final poster in the thread mentioned above


Originally Posted by Jer
1600 micrograms of pure LSD

Reply Posted by tchpdx
mmmmmmm . . . . . sounds like a thigh deep day on fat skis. Floating, bouncing, smiling, and uncontrollable laughter. Wow, I couldn't have said it any betterMarch 9th, 2007 06:24 PM
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post #10 of 27
3/20/07 at 3:58am
I was skiing my Seths all weekend and loving them. My Titans are my "narrow" skis at 86 in the waist, I take them all over and enjoy them in hte bumps too. What I am finding to be better as much as a ski being fatter, I am going with less sidecut. I went from the Metrons being around 12M to enjoying a ski around 20M TR.
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post #11 of 27
3/20/07 at 9:13am
I have skied on wide skis that were a blast, and wide skis that sucked. I think there is a lot more to it than just width -- length, ski construction, shape, stiffness, energy, and other characteristics really come into play. This is especially true when you move into the regime of variable conditions, where a ski's strengths and weaknesses become more apparent. For sure, wide skis are generally better and more fun on soft snow and in powder, and narrow skis are generally more rewarding on hardpack (all else equal). It's the huge range of skiing in between those conditions that can defy the wide vs. narrow classification/debate.
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post #12 of 27
3/20/07 at 9:29am
Those were some nice turns Tyron, You and Splat looked like you were having a fun day in some so-so spring conditions.
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post #13 of 27
3/20/07 at 11:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by warematt View Post
Joking, right?
Yes. The skinniest ski in my current quiver is 95mm at the waist. I love wide, long skis with minimal sidecut. I also love large turns in powder, various stages of crud and corn (which is probably why I gravitate toward these types of skis). They feel more stable and "solid" in variable/soft snow.

Usually, these fat ski threads get totally clogged by the second page with guys crying about how they aren't that "versatile" when it comes to groomers and moguls. For the most part, I agree with them. However, most of these fat ski threads aren't about a guy looking for one ski to do it all. Personally, I think that skiing groomers is about as exciting as surfing a wave pool and I regard moguls (as another poster so elegantly put it) as other people's sewage. I'm not interested in versitality - if it comes down to skiing bumps/groomers or going home, I'll go home.


Quote:
If this is not a joke, I assume you are on woodies with cable bindings and leather boots, right?
Actually, I'd really like to try skiing on 16ft. longboards. There's a guy here in SLC who makes them. Maybe next season.
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post #14 of 27
3/20/07 at 11:44am
Come on now Jer...bumps can be fun...spring bumps are lotsa fun...

...and they can be fun on fatties if your good enough
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post #15 of 27
3/20/07 at 12:23pm
Fun is a relative term. I've heard all kinds of wierd opinions as to what constitutes fun - frisbee golf, fruit-booting, paintball - the list goes on and on. Don't get me wrong - I don't take off my skis and walk downhill when it comes to bumps/groomers, but I do see them as something to be tolerated rather than sought-out.
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post #16 of 27
3/20/07 at 1:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
For me, a wider ski underfoot makes it more fun to ski variable snow. I find it (a wider ski) won't get deflected as much or knocked around as much as a narrower ski when skiing variable off-piste conditions.

And IMO, you really don't sacrifice that much in maneuverability or edge-to-edge quickness. Yesterday at Mammoth I was skiing a 192 with a 114 waist in spring corn, slush bumps, and wide open bowls. Naturally, the ski ripped and was super stable at off-piste GS turns, but it was really fun bumps, and I could bust out short-radius turns too.

Video of what of our day was like yesterday is on the front page at www.mammoth-snowman.com. You have to sit through or foward through (after the entire video loads) this morning's mammoth conditions report, and then Splat talking about PMGear skis, but then immediately after is footage of me making all kinds of turns on the 192 (with dimensions of 143-114-132) (everyone else is on a slightly narrower ski with a 99 waist, but I'm on the 114 waist). I don't see why i'd go narrower for the type of skiing I do.


Awsome video!!! The Bros that you guys are riding in the video, are they they the softs, stiffs or super stiffs?
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post #17 of 27
3/20/07 at 1:47pm
sorry for the double post. I'm gonna get the papers, get the papers.
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post #18 of 27
3/20/07 at 2:28pm
Jer: I love wide, long skis with minimal sidecut.

Nothing wrong with that. I love all skis, but what I love the most is the radically different characteristic specifc skis have. Going from a Head Supershape to a Head iM88 brings out that "difference". I love to experience it. Heck I even love skiboards (although that seems to be a dirty word these days).
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post #19 of 27
3/20/07 at 2:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirel View Post
Awsome video!!! The Bros that you guys are riding in the video, are they they the softs, stiffs or super stiffs?
hmm..lemme see if I can remember...

Alex...the first guy in the vid in the blue jacket is on 188 super stiffs (he's on my old skis actually)

Tol - "the intern from Cham" - is on 188 regular stiffs.

And I'm on the 192's in what I'm thinking might be the only flex it will come in ultimately since it's skiing so sweet for alot of different folks styles. If I had to label it...it's definitely on the stiff to superstiff side of the spectrum.
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post #20 of 27
3/20/07 at 2:59pm
Right on. Are you guys planning anymore demo days at Mammoth this season?
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post #21 of 27
3/20/07 at 3:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirel View Post
Right on. Are you guys planning anymore demo days at Mammoth this season?
this wasn't really a 'demo days' type thing, but sometimes we bring an extra pair or two along might be back down in mid-to-late April conditions pending.
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post #22 of 27
3/20/07 at 4:27pm
^^ go to squaw on saturday...

...I wouldn't mind trying the fatties for a run or two...you can ride my 9.1ffs (or blowers, or axioms, or legend pros or 10:exs, or 188 soft bros) while I'm demoing
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post #23 of 27
3/20/07 at 4:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyrone Shoelaces View Post
this wasn't really a 'demo days' type thing, but sometimes we bring an extra pair or two along might be back down in mid-to-late April conditions pending.

Cool. Keep us posted!
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post #24 of 27
3/20/07 at 6:50pm
Wider skis allow you to ski less steep slopes (on the way to or from the good stuff) without getting bogged down and having to "cross-country" ski, like you would on your old SG skis.
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post #25 of 27
3/21/07 at 8:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by X-EastCoaster View Post
^^ go to squaw on saturday...

...I wouldn't mind trying the fatties for a run or two...you can ride my 9.1ffs (or blowers, or axioms, or legend pros or 10:exs, or 188 soft bros) while I'm demoing
ahh, any other weekend I might take you up on that, no can do man. Skiing Kirkwood this weekend for a South Lake bachelor party thing (not mine), plus I need to start planning & skiing my qualifying lines for the big mountain comp next week (qualifiers are next wednesday).
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post #26 of 27
3/21/07 at 2:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ski=free View Post
What is it about wide skis that make them so much fun? I have trended towards wider skis since the first pair I bought. From waist of 70,77(when that was wider remember?) and now 94mm. I bought the Mantras 2 yrs ago and cannot put them away.
I use them in bumps, hard packed, tress,etc.. The only time I put them away is when it's super icy, wind blown and cold!
I don't know if it's that they are more forgiving. Or if I like the more substancial feeling under foot. Or maybe they are softer than what I'm used to?
What ever it is, and I'd like to know, all I want to do it ride my wide skis.
Yo free, I am in your camp.....old school, waybacker...spent years on skis like 7' head standards, rossi 7g's 208's and Olin dxk 207, Olin rts 205's are but a few, you get the idea, long race or near race skis.

jumped on the short carver bandwagon last year and learned how to ski new school...built a full stable of carvers...2 pair of RX 8's and allstars....with a huge amount of help from my Italian ski instructors found in the link below

bought some mint volkl explosivs with rossi TT's which ski sooo sweet and surprise! - effortless. Even more surprising is now that is have dialed in the new school moves I can ski railroad tracks on 95 mid skis. Crazy fun that is. Taking some air on the exploders is a lot smoother on the landing than on RX 8's folks.

Bottom line as long as it is soft snow I am gonna be on the exploders...if I go to the rockies they will be the only ski I bring.

I encourage all bears, particularly eastern bears who thumb their nose at fat skis, to give em a whirl. It is a crazy new world out there....try it all.

This old school dude is walking proof, the new gear is bomber.

All of it:
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post #27 of 27
3/21/07 at 2:47pm
I had a relatively skinny ski and went to a wider ski this season. Although that was far from being the ONLY difference between the two skis, I think I have a good idea of what a wide ski allowed me to do. It definitely made me go faster. I could really carve my turns without slowing down to a painfully slow pace. They glide really well, and do decently well on almost all types of snow. Actually the ski is a bit too stiff to do soft, fluffy powder, so when we really get the perfect conditions, my skis can't do too well. But as long as it's not fluffy or icy, the skis can do it. Which doesn't leave much, but you get the idea.
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