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What do you do? - Page 2

post #31 of 96
Mikla, thank you for your candor. This is a serious matter. I have some thoughts I'd like to share with you, albeit privately. Please e-mail me. bgreene@law66.com

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ November 28, 2001 06:14 AM: Message edited 1 time, by oboe ]</font>
post #32 of 96
I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers. My mom died a few years ago from smoking induced lung cancer, it was not a pretty sight. As you can see you will have support from this group. Good luck
post #33 of 96
What I tend to do is take a big deep breath and comment on how fresh the air is. Then I will start to cough and hack like mad. It is a subtle aproach, but I am not one for confrontation.
post #34 of 96
When I am in the lift line with someone and they light up I yell single. If they ask on the chair I tell them, please don't.
post #35 of 96
Being a smaller guy I tend only to complain about smokers smaller than me,the big ones I leave alone. If they aks I usually tell them that im young enough that they will have a cure for cancer by the time their second hand smoke gives it to me. That usually stops them.
post #36 of 96
Ah, loosen up!

To me, there's nothing more obnoxious than people who freak out at cigs or joints.

I mean, c'mon. You breath crap all day long and then you have the nerve to bitch at me for blowing a splifferd?

Then after doing so you go home and kick your dog and cuss at your wife.

Get a life and screw you.
post #37 of 96

Where you been, man?
post #38 of 96
This is an amazing thread!! I don't feel strongly one way or the other about smokers out in open air, but I sure would like to go skiing with this group; just to watch the brawl in the lift line when someone does light up! [img]tongue.gif[/img]
post #39 of 96
feallen: after reading this, Ill make sure not too smoke when you guys are in Fernie!!!

Seriously, IF I forget to ask someone if it's ok to smoke in the lift and they ask me if I can put it out, Ill put it out and apologise.
But if someone starts barking at me... MOST TIMES Ill put it out, but not always. Guess I'm still not over my teenage-rebell role :
post #40 of 96
rikswan said : If you are a smoker and you smoke around someone else, they are annoyed, even if they don't say it. Unlike you they are being polite.

Which part of my post gave you the impression that I am impolite? I only suggested that it is best to be reasonable, especially if you are not capable to take care of yourself, should the argument get into a fight. I know that a lot of people can talk the talk, but when faced with a maniac that is willing to kick some ass ... well, you know.

I do agree that it is somewhat impolite for smokers to push the stuff on you, but as Mikla's story shows, they are not all evil. After all 5 minutes of smoke will not kill you. Bye the way, I have never smoked a cigarette (or anything else) in my life.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ November 28, 2001 03:18 PM: Message edited 1 time, by TomB ]</font>
post #41 of 96
post #42 of 96
Let's see, what other behaviors might offend??

Noisy brat kids--toss 'em off the lift!
Invasive perfume--spray 'em with Lysol!
B.O.--carry some spare deodorant, make 'em use it!
Fat people--refuse to ride a lift with 'em!
Halitosis--make 'em chew breath mints!

Jeez, lighten up, people. last time I looked, smoking is a legal activity.
Just for the record, I am a virulent non-smoker-no one may smoke in my house or my motor vehicles, and I often select restaurants or bars based on their smoking policy.
I agree that smoking while skiing is indeed a tacky behavior, but, I have no legal or moral right to interfere in someone else's exercise of his/her legal rights. If it offends me, I certainly have the right to move away, or wait for another chair, or endure the smoke for the 5 minute chair ride.

Where will it end? If the color of my parka causes you to suffer migraines-who then is responsible?? This, I know, is taking the issue to it's illogical extreme, but it could happen.

When we have snow, all these petty irritations will disappear in the joy of perfect turns!
[img]smile.gif[/img] [img]smile.gif[/img] [img]smile.gif[/img]
post #43 of 96
Thread Starter 
At least this thread gives smokers an idea of what is going through the minds of non-smokers when they light up in public.

Flicking boogers onto other peoples clothes, shooting snot rockets across other peoples skis, and launching giant green loogies onto the tails of the person in front of you are all legal behaviors as well. It's just not socially acceptable, otherwise, we would all be standing around in the lift line discharging mucus on each other.

I am still amazed at the number of teens and 20 somethings that are smoking. With all of the data we have on the health risks, it just doesn't make sense to me. Then throw on top of that data the negative stereotypes (thanks SCSA for reinforcing one) associated with cigarette smokers I just can't see how people start.

The WWII generation I understand. Cigarettes were standard issue for the GIs. The summer of love folks, well, wasn't the summer of love '72? It's been a while. And wasn't that the first generation to get back into physical health launching the fitness trends of the 80s?

But teens lighting up? What's up with that?
post #44 of 96
skiswift, although I'm pleased to read that you are claiming to be a "virulent anti-smoker", your credentials remain to be proven. It is legal for me to sing, but not loudly in a quiet neighborhood at 2 a.m. It is legal for me to walk my dog so that he can move his bowels, but not on your body. It is legal for you to put smoke into your lungs, but keep it the hell out of my lungs and nose. Sitting on a chairlift in close proximity to another person and spilling your smoke, your beer or your coffee on the other person need not be tolerated by the other person, legal or not. It's more than annoyance - it's assault, call it what you will. Apologists are not needed in this subject and perform no service which has any legitimacy. Over- reaction? I think the contrary. There rightfully should be MORE reaction. In the State of Vermont, smoking is prohibited in any public building unless the business therein has a "cabaret" license - in short, they sell booze and only incidental food. In my view, a chairlift as a common carrier ought to be subject to the same strictures.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ November 28, 2001 08:10 PM: Message edited 1 time, by oboe ]</font>
post #45 of 96
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BillH:
At least this thread gives smokers an idea of what is going through the minds of non-smokers when they light up in public.

Like they care?
post #46 of 96
Oboe-you make my point for me! Singing is not illegal, however, causing a public disturbance by singing at 2 am in a residential neighborhood has been defined as an illegal act, and should be treated as such. Same comment about your dog messing where it is expressly (by law or covenant) prohibited from doing so.
In both cases, you are talking about an illegal act!
Smoking in certain areas IS illegal, at present it is still legal outdoors, even in Vermont( I too live in Vermont).
Throwing coffee on a person is either an accident, or a misdemeanor assault, and should be treated as such.
Should smoking in any environment offend you, you do have certain rights. You have the right to petition for a change in the laws, and organize politically to do this.
You have the right to petition the entity in which the smoking is taking place to change it's rules regarding the practice.
You have the right to remove yourself from the vicinity of the smoker.
You have NO right to interfere with anyone doing a legal act in an approved (or not prohibited) place.
To mangle Voltaire: " I disagree with what you do, but will defend until death your right to do it". Even smokers have constitutional rights.
I am not now, nor have I ever been, a smoker. My "credentials" are intact, and I bow to no-one in how much I despise smoke in my surroundings, especially on the mountain.
I know of no instructor colleagues who smoke, it certainly is incompatible with the environment while skiing, and certainly is incompatible with the fitness level needed to be a ski instructor.
Just as the ACLU defended the First Ammendment rights of Nazi sympathizers in Skokie , Il--even proponents of unpopular, but legal, behaviors should have their rights protected. Who knows when one of my, or your, behaviors/activities become unpopular to the community.
post #47 of 96
This thread is getting rather heated...Right now I would rather be in a chair with a chain smoker than sitting at my desk...it is all relative I guess
post #48 of 96
It's just not socially acceptable, otherwise, we would all be standing around in the lift line discharging mucus on each other.
Because really, what could be more fun than that? Alas, the downside of etiquette.
post #49 of 96
[img]smile.gif[/img] !!!!!!
post #50 of 96
Legal, schmegal! Put your crap on me, and expect a fight. And as to the rights of Nazis? What a crock! The ACLU and Voltaire are not gods to me. I have zero interest in the rights of smokers to get their smoke on me, and I have zero interest in the "rights" of Nazis or their apologists to preach that I and my family ought to be iliminated. In some very civilized countries,the right of Nazis to spew race hate has been legally eliminated. I have every interest in utilizing legislation and, when that won't work, whatever else will. So far as I am concerned, law or no law, your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins - and your right to inhale cigarette smoke ends where my body begins. The law may or may not choose to recognize and protect those rights - but I do. Honestly, do you really feel that if the esteemed legislators made it legal for the bozo to spill coffee on my parka, that would make it ok?! puhLEEZE!
post #51 of 96

Did Oboe actually read my post?? I re-read it and found nothing about legalizing throwing coffee! Jeez
post #52 of 96
I'd be willing to bet most Illinois Nazis are smokers. But not all smokers are Illinois Nazis.

What the hell does that mean? Not sure but I thought I'd toss it out there as I used to live in Skokie as a kid.

And I used to smoke cigarettes.

I still smoke but not tobacco and what I do smoke is smoked away from others. But that is another thread...

"I hate Illinois Nazis."
--Blues Brothers

post #53 of 96
skiswift, your post clearly states to me that spilling coffee on me is illegal and therefore "not ok", and then you point out that smoking, on the other hand is legal, and therefore I have no right to interfere with it - because it is a legal activity. Go ahead, show me a Nazi bastard engaging in his LEGAL right to free speech. Watch what I do. Then show me a smoker engaging in his legal right to smoke, while getting the crap on me. Watch again.
post #54 of 96
Talk about taking things to extremes.

Oboe's post sounds like it could be lifted off the ELF's discussion boards, only this time substitute Vail's expansion for smoking. So what do you do, Oboe? If a person lights up on the chair next to you (legal activity), would you:
1) Physically assault them? (illegal, and potentially dangerous. How big are you? How big is your husband? Do you really want to risk it?)
2) Threaten their person? (also illegal, and dangerous for the reasons above)
3) Verbally assault them? (illegal if it extends to harrassment, and again dangerous).
4) Annoy them in some other way? (perfectly legal, and it might better get your point across).

Tell you the truth, this makes me want to take up smoking just in the hopes of meeting some smoke-nazi on the chair sometime, just to see what happened.

Socrates refused multiple guaranteed opportunities to escape from the hemlock, purportedly to help preserve the sanctity of the laws. If your anti-smoking lobbying efforts fail, why not just sit down and shut up; it's better for all of us.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ November 29, 2001 11:50 AM: Message edited 1 time, by LH ]</font>
post #55 of 96
- oboe -

I am blowing smoke in your face right now.

What do you think of that?
post #56 of 96
I think there's too many bears that are high and dry in terms of snow......
post #57 of 96
You're sure squeezin some dirt there brother! :
post #58 of 96
TomB: I apologize the wording where it appeared you were the "Impolite Smoker."

When I said "If you are a smoker and you smoke around someone else, they are annoyed, even if they don't say it. Unlike you they are being polite" it was directed at smokers who think it's their right to smoke where and whenever they want. People like SCSA who said "Ah, loosen up! You breath crap all day long and then you have the nerve to bitch at me for blowing a splifferd?" His logic proves he's bright like dirt.

I feel sorry for Milka and all the others who are hooked. My Dad had a stroke last year that was caused by 30 years of smoking. My sister (who sounds exactly like Milka) still smokes. She even smoked more after the stroke because she was stressed. How sadly ironic is that?

I guess it just baffles me how people can smoke. I know it's addictive but not all smokers want to quit (or at least that's what they say so people can think they're cool right SCSA, aka Joe Cancer). There are no good excuses for it. If you're a smoker (I'm not accusing you Tom) and you think of one, mention it to the cardiologist when he tells you your main arteries are plugged from the crap you sucked into your body.

Finally, Tom, I too wouldn't resort to getting into a situation that could lead to a fight over something as stupid as a smoke. The harmful effects of a ski pole through the chest are far worse than 5 minutes of second hand smoke. That said, asking someone politely not to smoke is hardly aggressive and if someone asked if they could light up, I'd say "I'd appreciate it if you didn't." They wouldn't have asked the question if it wasn't an option.
post #59 of 96
Right on the money on how to deal with a smoker! I have, many times, been in both situations you describe, and politeness and courtesy always achieve a good outcome.
After having been in the military to protect our rights, it is galling to see someone consign the 1st Amendment to the scrap heap.

One wonders which other rights we have fought so hard to protect, are so optional?

There is a county in Maryland that tried to make smoking illegal in one's own home!
Almost makes me want to start smoking just to confront the smoke police.
Oboe-why such violent words? You come across as the skiing Newt Gingrich.
Shalom y'all-let's think snow.
post #60 of 96
LH and Jaws, your reactions are, of course, to be expected. After all,I screamed, I shouted, and I kicked sand in someone's face. To respond to Jaws, I have not noticed your smoke, though if it actually were blown in my face, I may react in any number of ways. Sometimes, on this subject, I'm just waiting for something to fight about, and sometimes there are others out there who are accomodating. I've been known on this site for a different affect, if I say so myself, but being more than feisty about this subject seems appropriate. LH, I am not very large - about 140 to 145 pounds depending on recent eating and exercise. I have not considered having a husband - I have a wife, and I'm keeping her if she's willing - but as you may know, for people living in Vermont, anything is possible. So just what WOULD I do - REALLY, I mean? What I HAVE done, as reported above, is to speak my mind beginning at a modest level and reaching whatever level I need to accomplish the task. So far, it hasn't been all that difficult. However, my point was, and is, just because it's legal does not mean it should be tolerated. I have, in fact, lobbied our legislature with some success - at least once on this issue of smoking in public places. However, it has not always been my policy, when lobbying fails to change the law, to just "sit down and shut up". I believe that in some cases, action must be taken - as was taken, for example, in the South during the sixties. Actually, although I have been strident, hyper and emotional in my posts on this thread, it is not fully indicative of me - I am a rather ordinary, cooperative member of the business and legal community here. This thread about smoking is really, really long - a lot of emotion well spent, so far as I am concerned, anyway. As if you didn't already know, smoking - not in small part because of its odor and the tendency of tobacco smoke to stick like glue - is an area in which my intolerance reaches near its peak. Part of my wife's work is to devise school programs which discourage young people from smoking. In fact, some of her young recruits actually go out to find smokers among the students and tell them they should stop - and guess what she calls the li'l darlin's who do that? She calls them her tobacco Nazis. OK, I've said enough, I stand by my remarks, and - just for now - I'll sit down and shut up. Important as this subject is to me, my mind and heart are where the air is fresh and clean and the snow is fresh and deep - and I dream that it will be here in Vermont soon, like last year . . .

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ November 29, 2001 04:07 PM: Message edited 1 time, by oboe ]</font>
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