Ruh Roh, Raggy!
Big E wrote- "Yes you DO need to teach rotary skills EVENTUALLY. I do not advocate NO rotary whatsoever. Just rotary at the right time in a skiers development. Afterall, you don't teach hockey stops to never-evers. But, you DO teach the braking wedge."
I think Big E is about to have his own reality program- "Making the 'BANNED'"! Imagine him saying that any rotary movement is acceptable, at any time.... Such HERESY!!!!!
So sayeth The HOOOP HOGG!
TomB wrote- "PMTS does appear to be a better teaching method with a stronger chance of success, due to the uniform approach."
Well, I can't disagree with TomB's logic in part because to begin with there are not very many PMTS instrs out there! The fewer instrs there are, the easier it is to control the product.
With PSIA having close to 30,000 instrs, (and another several thousand foreign instrs working in PSIA operations) obviously it is impossible to control the product to the umpteenth degree as HH does with PMTS. But, just for an instant, let's say PMTS had the same number of instrs as PSIA. HH would have as little control over them as PSIA does over its members. Every pro would be out there diluting his message with their own interpretations, blends, and modifications that are so prevalent in PSIA. Each would have their own color of tongue! And it wouldn't necessarily be the same as HH's!
At this point, HH would have a choice. Either cancel the PMTS certification of each instr who has a different colored tongue, or for the sake of the business (read $$$), accept the dilution of his system. Which do you think he will choose? Or by that time, will he even have a say?
TomB also wrote- "I am constantly amazed how dogmatic PMTS skiers can be about their style, only to learn that they are average joe skiers with no professional or race aspirations."
This is a very interesting statement! I have read post after post about how PMTS is THE WAY to becoming an expert skier. I am very happy for those who feel PMTS has helped them! It obviously works for some people. But not all people learn the same way. I might guess that the majority of first time skiers tend to be quite cautious, and therefore may not feel comfortable with the physical, emotional, or technical demands placed upon them at such an early point in their development.
But to realize that those vocal proponents of the system have very little interest in becoming instrs or taking their skiing to any sort of career level themselves, says something about those doing the talking... That being a "it worked for me, therefore it has to work for you" mentality, without any background in working with a variety of different student types.
Here is where several PMTS instrs will jump on my back, professing the contrary. But I know several good instrs who HAVE taken the PMTS instr courses, gotten their green and blues, and still came back saying it was BS! Because I do know these instrs, and respect them, I have to accept their perception of the courses they went through. Maybe one day, I will attend one of HH's camps, to judge for myself the veracity of his claims.
Do you think he will accept my application? (Hmmmmm... gonna have to think about that one...)
At this point I would like to make a statement which I feel is true about both PMTS and PSIA. A student goes into a lesson expecting success and growth. They expect to improve and have fun! So, regardless which system they are in, they already have a mindset which is going to be positive toward the outcome. (Unless the $h1t really hits the fan...)
Those taking HH's PMTS camps are already believing success is at hand, before it has even started. So of course they are going to rave about it afterwards. Those attending the EpicSki Academy are exactly the same way! (Though I wonder if the degree of improvement is as accurate as professed)
Shall we say they have all had a drink of their respective KoolAid before going, therefore it is a reasonable assumption that each will be satisfied with their respective program?
Pierre wrote- "Its going to take you much longer via the PSIA route than the PMTS route however the end results in my opinion is a more rounded skier with the PSIA route."..."PSIA for most people is a series of starts and stops with plateaus. The route has a lot of lateral learning for most skiers and takes years."
I do not disagree with the idea behind this statement either! But that is the nature of the guest! The average student does not ski regularly, nor are they as infatuated by the sport as some of us are. It does take time and experience to gain the skill sets to ski efficiently.
Where PMTS continues with the tried and true "ski week" type of program of yesteryear, most students are not in that realm. They are on vacation to relax and enjoy the environment, not to go through boot camp! That point whatever of 1 % will want that type of programming, and will realize benefit from the consistent, multi-day training.
If more PSIA ski schools still used that format (as very many did back in the 60's and 70's), the response would likely be just as strong at those schools!
I know Pierre has experience with PMTS, so I'll use his numbers... 40% IS HUGE... But 60% IS BIGGER! At this point, NEITHER system is making a very big splash in the pool of potential students! Sure, there are students taking lessons... but when the retention rate is 1:7, thats PATHETIC!
Today's student is into instant gratification! They want the quick fix, the magic pole plant, the blessing of the instr! And when that doesn't happen in their 2 hr, 3 hr, or 5 hr lesson, they are frustrated and perhaps even disappointed! So they don't come back. But if they are hooked into a week long program, the expectation is deferred over the week, not the shorter term lesson. Given that, of course more progress will be made in that format!
But few are willing to put in the hrs, the days, the weeks, the seasons it takes to become proficient in this sport. To offer them the illusion of becoming an expert in any short period of time, or with a minimum of effort, is simply false advertising. I don't care what system is being used, it takes EXPERIENCE! Experience happens over TIME! But those that are willing to put in the time, to enjoy the process as it occurs, they will ultimately reap the benefits of their patience!
I will not dispute that a really knowledgeable instr can facilitate the learning process. (And by really knowledgeable, I do assume a very accurate understanding of the sport.) But there is still a minimum amount of time necessary to achieve true proficiency! The instr can guide the student, but ultimately, the student has to do it for themself!