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Citrus Depot Citrus Solvent?

post #1 of 27
Thread Starter 
Anybody have any experience with this stuff plus or minus as a base cleaner ? :

http://www.citrusdepot.net/info_mutl...gTWAod 5mZLuA

I just ordered a trial size (pint) of their stuff for $ 13.00. They said that they have lots of people who order it for ski base cleaning. 100 % citrus oil solvent.

At $ 29 a gallon it certainly beats SWIX prices for their chemical based cleaner...
post #2 of 27
I have not used that brand but from time to time if the skis are really dirty or I am switching waxes or just cleaning the scrapers and tools I've used Blaster Chemical's Citrus spray cleaner.
post #3 of 27
All of my advice has been first hand from real WC race technicians. These guys get paid to do it and they get paid because they are good at it.

I have been told that the citrus cleaners are too aggressive and leave a residue. Any residue is not good for waxing. I never liked the smell of swix base cleaner. I went to Holmenkol, smells fine, it cuts wax great (you have scraped and brushed big time and you still get some wax out of the grind with the cleaner), dries real quick and is not all that expensive. A pint will last a few seasons if you watch how you use it. I used to use citrus but if I spend $6 per season on specialized cleaner who cares. I spend way more than that in gas getting to the hill.

Another tip is to use Fantastic or 409 spray cleaners to clean your stones. The stuff with a tooth brush really gets the dirt/edge residue out of the stones. If their is junk in the stones they will not cut correctly.

Holmenkol has some great stuff and you can buy direct off of their website. They have some of the best diamond stone I have ever used. They have a sticky backed diamond strip that is replaceable. Their 120 grit is awesome. They also have great brushes.
post #4 of 27
Have any of you tried wet scraping, scraping with base cleaner still on there, with either steel or plastic?
post #5 of 27
I don't know about any residue issues with 100% citrus oil. However, most "citrus" solvents are really regular chemical based solvents (with their attendant residue and other issues) with some citrus added. Sort of a "citrusee smell" marketing thing, in significant part.

I'd say use your 100% citrus oil and see how it works since you have it. If there are any residue issues you could always hot scrape and brush it out, I suspect. If you want to be really cautious try it out on a pair of old rock skis first.

I'm not a environmental gold medalist but I'm trying to use less toxic alternatives where I can. For example I found based on what I read hear at Epic years ago that peanut butter is great for cleaning the wax of plastic scrapers. Smear on, leave it alone for a few minutes and wash/wipe off.
post #6 of 27
I NEVER use base cleaners. I NEVER have problems. I'm just as fast as my friends. The last time I used it was about 10 years ago because of some NASTY buildup, but I could have easily waxed & warm scraped away.

Why do you feel you NEED to use it? I just don't trust the stuff personally. It dries stuff out too much. They don't want you to get it on your hands -- seems like a good enough reason to not put it on anything else porous.
post #7 of 27

2 scenarios for ya.

Originally Posted by axebiker View Post
Why do you feel you NEED to use it?

- several pairs of rec skis to be prepared in one evening. Some of them have ground-in grease, dirt, or even base filings from whoever did that. Some of them have high levels of base fuzz. Some of them are already "dry". All of them will get hot-waxed or penetrant-waxed within the hour.

Do I need to use base cleaner? No. Will I wish to? Yes. The wet scrape as described above, or a wet pass with Scotchbrite/Fibertex/Beartex mounted to a power tool will clean in less than a minute what would take several hot scrape passes to do. It will even knock down/off base fuzz and the latter will polish out remnant base-bevel grot that the file couldn't get to.

Side note: the former is highly effective on edgeless XC skis.

- highly fluorinated or Zardozed bases where a hot CH wax can just barely penetrate the base instead of splattering off, let alone saturate, lift and clean.

I could spend gobs of time rotobrushing or even re-grind. Will I wish to use base cleaner instead? You bet.
post #8 of 27
Comprex - in a shop situation with many sets (sounds like that's where you're at), yes. We used it all the time then as well. We'd clean new skis after the mount, check the tune, and re-wax. Same if we had a long line of sands, grinds, and tunes. Line 'em up, hit 'em with the orange.

But in the "home tune" situation, I guess I like to take my time and enjoy what I'm doing. It's actually really a relaxing, enjoyable thing to do. Throw in a ski flic, and get to work. I have never used it at home - at least not in the last 15 years.
post #9 of 27
What Viking Kaj is talking about is 100% citrus oil and not conventional chemical based solvents with some citrus added which is what most "citrus" solvents are. I'm not a big fan of solvents and rarely use them except sometimes in Spring conditions where the snow is dirty and oil from snow cats, lifts and sap from trees covers old snow. That being said, whether its a brand new pair of skis or a freshly stone ground pair there is also often a lot of contaminants left in the base. Hot scraping is the more laborious method of dealing with this, though it's the one I use.

If 100% citrus based oil will do the job easier with no unwanted residue, I'd use it. Since Viking Kaj has ordered it, I'd be interested in his observations. I'll be the first to admit that I haven't placed an order for citrus oil myself.

With a conventional solvent I don't think that "drying out the bases" is so much an issue unless maybe it's overused. It's more a question of conventional solvent residue inhibiting the base from accepting new wax as well. At least that is my understanding.

The difference in speed between a dirty and clean base for non-racers, is relative to how dirty the ski bases are. Certainly in Spring conditions it's detectable. If Axebiker is faster than all his friends with really dirty bases then he's likely a better skier.
post #10 of 27
Originally Posted by Lostboy View Post
If Axebiker is faster than all his friends with really dirty bases then he's likely a better skier.
Never thought about it like that...

Of course, it could just be gravity...I'm about 40# heavier than the person I ski the most with...
post #11 of 27
IMO, the dryness issue of base cleaners is over stated and not an issue (especially for rec skiers) if you get wax on quickly afterwards. Using lighter (non-solvent) cleaners like citrus, simple green, etc are real options, especially if you are short on time or don't want the wax mess. Try it and just look at the gunk in a clean paper towel. Sure makes you wonder what's mixed in and left when you just hot scrape.

You can always rinse off bases or hot scrape after their use if you are concerned about residual effects. I have been trying all kinds of combinations, including to see if I can tell a difference in glide and I cannot. If there is a real difference it has got to be pretty negligible in my little mind.

Comprex (welcome back). I haven't tried scraping, but have used various brushes to work in cleaners. I ought to give it a whirl to see if it makes much difference.
post #12 of 27
I have been using the citrus cleaner again, and my routine is:

Citrus, and rub off with ski paper towel (yup Alpinord, tons of black can come off on some skis.)

Immediately use my dedicated-for-cleaning-only steel brush.

Run my I-don't-remember-what-it's-called-thing over the bases (the razor tool that is the same thing they use to take old inspection decals off of cars, that tognar sells as a base tool.)

Wipe off again.

Then I will often do a warm scrape clean if the skis have been neglected (these being non-living-with me family members skis, mine and my fiances are never neglected.)

Then I will often use my skivisions base flattening tool (with the stone, not the blade.)

Then the razor thingy again.

Then hot wax.

(Sounds like a lot, but goes very quickly.)
post #13 of 27
I generally avoid using cleaners because I find that they do leave the bases drier, and inhibit wax absorption. This conclusion was based on seeing the dreaded "white bases" after just a day of skiing if cleaner was used. My first preference is to clean skis by scraping wax (and dirt with it) while the wax is still soft & warm.

However, sometimes a cleaner is useful for getting major dirt out of the bases. If I do use a cleaner, I restore the base with at least three passes of waxing & warm scraping of a universal (not too hard) wax.
post #14 of 27

You guys got me on citrus cleaners! Works great for me. I'm using the citrus king product by citrus depot. I got it direct online. I did some research and apparently it's the citric acid that cleans so well, but it's still gentle because the fruit can't create an acid that's going to kill it or the person/animal eating it. I actually thing citrus cleaners are a great idea. I had never tried them before but apparently they are good for all sorts of things. I'm on a citrus kick now. It keeps my cat away from my ski equipment too. I didn't know that cat's don't like the smell or oranges?!? Did you guys know that?

post #15 of 27

I'm not sure why you think most citrus cleaners are regular citrus solvents with chemicals added. Can you give me an example? Wen I read about the Citrus King product, it's all natural. It doens't have any harmful chemicals. Let me know which ones are posing so I can avoid!

post #16 of 27
Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

 It doens't have any harmful chemicals.


Please define 'harmful chemical' for me.      Is something  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limonene that metabolizes in your body to create central nervous systems poisons a 'harmful chemical'?  

If I was to get something from pine trees would that make it all natural?   Would pine-tree-sourced turpentine be all natural then? 

post #17 of 27

I'm not here to argue with you. I don't think you have all the information. There's food grade limonene and there's non food grade. It's two completely different things. Clearly you have to look at the ingredients to find out if it's natural and safe. Citrus King is safe. Don't be a doofus and ask smarty pants questions because I gave my opinion. Take it or leave it. Give your opinion. Just don't be a jerk about it. Especially when you're wrong.

post #18 of 27
Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

I'm not here to argue with you.


That's perfectly fine, I have asked you to define your terms so we can proceed with actually learning something.    It seems to have been a vain effort. 

Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

 I don't think you have all the information.


Of course not.  Who does? 

Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

. There's food grade limonene and there's non food grade. It's two completely different things. 


There's also  "food grade" perfluorocarbons and non-food-grade perfluorocarbons.   They are two different things.   So what?

If you wish to assert "food grade limonene is safe" then the onus is on you to show that "food grade limonene" does not metabolise in the human body to something harmful.    You've provided *zero*, nil, nada in evidence of that.  Let alone provided us with a toxicity standard or an exposure standard or a dosage standard (which, of course standards we could then apply to other chemicals).    You've merely given us a label 'food grade'.    

Do you really think that a bureacuratic label that is also applied to such things as Vaseline, to mineral oil, to pure, concentrated ammonia powder, to hydrochloric acid and to vacuum pump oil has any bearing to this debate?    



Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

 Don't be a doofus 



  Please do not be personally insulting.   You've already insulted the intelligence of thread readers with your unsubstantiated assertions and meaningless bureaucratic labels.

Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

 Clearly you have to look at the ingredients to find out if it's natural and safe. 



I have zero idea how to determine that, and you have not provided any enabling test. 

Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

Don't  ask smarty pants questions because I gave my opinion. 



We're supposed to take unsubstantiated opinion without questioning?    I don't think that line of argument will fly, on the Internet or with people in general. 


Originally Posted by LilSkiBaby View Post

 Just don't be a jerk about it. Especially when you're wrong.



You've insulted me personally three times in one post, as well as generally insulting the intelligence of thread readers.     I think that at this point a baldfaced unsubstantiated assertion of 'you're wrong' isn't going to sell terribly well. 

Edited by cantunamunch - 3/30/15 at 1:42pm
post #19 of 27

Probably a shill for the manufacturer.

post #20 of 27

Ha ha, you guys have some serious issues.

post #21 of 27
Originally Posted by SkiMangoJazz View Post

Probably a shill for the manufacturer.


post #22 of 27
Originally Posted by SkiMangoJazz View Post

Probably a shill for the manufacturer.

You got me! Cause I started this thread right ... :bs:

post #23 of 27

The thread was started and ended in 2007, you clearly googled it, found it, and joined just so you could post on it.

Tell me do you even ski?

post #24 of 27
post #25 of 27

Hmm, sorry if I was too harsh.  Just seemed a little odd to join and her first post to be plugging a specific brand of a product.

post #26 of 27

#1  - "we can proceed with actually learning something" - You assume I am interested in learning something from you.

#2 - "this debate" - I don't want to debate you over some cleaner.


You are trolling me and this is bizarre. I have nothing to prove. You're clearly trying to pick a fight. I have a right to post my opinion where I want and not be interrogated by some creep. I am ignoring you. Goodbye.

post #27 of 27

You can have your board. Someone recommended a women's board anyway. Clearly that's where I belong.

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