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Maplus Wax Test

post #1 of 131
Thread Starter 
As noted in the Maplus Wax test announcement thread in the General Forums, I finally received supplies to prep and ship as provided by RacerRick & Tools4Boards. Upon additional consideration and input, there appears to be substantial interest in trying out the Maplus Universal waxes, liquids, sprays & solids. So, rather than sending everyone the more temperature specific performance P1 paraffins, it seems worthwhile to mix it up a bit and adjust the kits a little by prevailing conditions and personal preferences. For example, there is no point sending P1 Cold to areas that never see those snow temperatures. The 'Wax Thermometer' below shows snow temperature ranges and the picture the basic kit:

Maplus Race Base Hard & Soft
P1 (cold, med & hot) paraffins, Universal or combinations
Snow Thermometer
Brush for Liquid applications
Teflon sheet for between iron & base
Cork/brush for rubbing in and smoothing waxes and nylon polishing brush
Wax chart & Application instructions on waterproof/tearproof map paper
Alpine strap
Nylon pouch, 5" x 7" for carrying small supplies and pocket stones or whatever while skiing or traveling. (Not shown.)

I'll add more info and ideas to this thread and testers please indicate a description of where you live, skiing & tuning experience, goals, preferences and whatever else to help you as well as inform fellow EpicSki members about using these products and trying different approaches.

Thanks in advance to the participation of the testers and EpicSki for allowing this on the forums.

Let the Mad Science begin! Have fun! We can all learn a lot from this.

(Note the previous thread also has other info to revisit.)

post #2 of 131
Thanks Alpinord.
post #3 of 131
Thread Starter 
Thank you and thanks for the reminder that RacerRick of Tools4Boards has supplied the wax and other items. Thanks Rick!

(Anyone going to SIA or OR can meet RacerRick. He's with Fitter First's booth. I'll bring some samples to ESA Aspen Wed & Thursday & OR/SLC over the weekend....Alta anyone? )
post #4 of 131
It's getting interesting...

Here is my "narrative" that i sent to alpinord, if anyone has any further questions, ask away.

I’ve never really tuned my own skis, aside from a little wipe on wax. Being a younger skier whose parents are not into the sport, the financial responsibility of getting the skis tuned has always fallen on me. Over the past two years I have really noticed how my tune, or lack thereof, has severely limited my skiing. I can’t afford a $20+ tune every few times I go out and ski, so I am gradually picking up my own supplies to do it myself.

My biggest season was the winter of 03/04. I purchased an ASC Maine Student pass, and was out at least one day every weekend the entire season. During the week, I taught at a local hill. This was when I first noticed my lack of tune. Currently, my class schedule, work schedule over breaks and general financial situation (college is expensive), determines when I ski. If I am able to go, and the mountain is open, I ski. The weather doesn’t matter. Road conditions are about the only thing that would stop me from going.

A friend of mine, who is a snowboarder, has been waxing my skis for the past few seasons. I have been very impressed, and at the same time have learned a lot from him and the EpicSki forums. Since we have both enrolled in college, it has been difficult to get together and ski/ride, let alone perform any tuning.

My experience with the wipe on wax has not been very positive. I can’t recall the exact brand that I have used, but I do know that it was like $30-$40 a bottle. The stuff worked great on waxless XC skis, but it would only last a run or two down the mountain. I’m really hoping that the new formulations will have longer durability, as it would be great when I am on a trip (sharing a room w/ many other students, no room for a full set up) to just be able to wipe/cork on a quick coat of wax in the morning.

I will defiantly be testing these products on my Metron B5’s and Blizzard SC 18’s. The shop gives me free hot waxes on the B5’s, so I can compare and contrast. I’m fairly sure I will also try out the samples on a few snowboards, friend’s skis, and maybe even my parent’s XC skis. Alpinord has helped me out with a guide and some diamond stones, so my edges will be well taken care of.

While I may not have 25+ years of tuning experience, I do posses a high degree of technical aptitude. Ultimately, I’m looking to get the best tune possible, without spending loads of time, making a huge mess in the apartment, and spending a ton of money. If I think a product works, I’ll make it my primary method, and let everyone know how great it is and why. If I think that it doesn’t work, I’ll let everyone know why I feel it doesn’t. I look forward to the testing (and, of course, the skiing), and letting the forum know how things work out.

Personal Equipment: Lange CRL 90, Atomic Metron B5, Goode SuperMax, Blizzard SC18.
Additional Associated Equip: Ast. Salomon skis & boards, waxless XC skis.
post #5 of 131
Thread Starter 
post #6 of 131
Do you have a testing matrix or questions you want us to complete?
post #7 of 131
Thread Starter 
Currently @ OR, I'll try to expand on this later:
Basically, we are hoping for members to be creative and compare these various waxes to what they are using and playing with different application procedures and report impressions, findings, etc.
post #8 of 131

My first experience with Maplus wax (updated)

It's well known that I'm a huge lover of Hertel Super Hot Sauce for 90% of our midwest ski conditions. The only time it's not great for everyday skiing is at either end of the tempurature and humidity scales (warm/wet snow and really cold/squeaky snow). This weekend we had temps ranging from 18deg f to 28deg f and snow that consisted of crunchy man-made snow covered by and intermixed with fluffy, sparkly, cold natural snow. Usually the Hot Sauce will be somewhat sticky and slow in these conditions, causing the skis to slow down and speed up every time they passed from man-made to natural snow and back.

I did a little experimenting by mixing the Hot Sauce and Maplus Universal Green 1/2 & 1/2 when I waxed last week. I felt the tempurature wasn't quite cold enough to go with the Green exclusively, thus the combination. The combo was surprisingly easy to work with and skied very well. While skiing, I experienced none of the Hot Sauce's usual jerkiness or stickiness and the wax job has held up through 2 full days of skiing - the skis are still shiny, silky, and smooth (the man-made snow will usually cause base burn along the edges within 1-2 days). I'm not a convert from Hot Sauce yet, but I'm very pleased with the results so far and am looking forward to trying the spray on as well.

2 more days on-snow with the wax combination (man-made base with 1-4" of fresh each day). Still no sign of base burn or dryness. With temps ranging from 16deg f to 26deg f, I was flying by other people I ski with (all of whom wax on a regular basis) while on a flat ski. Still haven't experienced any hesitation when skiing through changing snow conditions.

All-in-all, I'm very impressed with this combo so far!
post #9 of 131
I received some samples of MAPLUS spray on from Alpineord at ESA on Wednesday evening. Used the Universal Cold on Thursday morning and ironed it in using a teflon pad as recommended. It worked treat on Thursday at Snomass and again on Friday at Beaver Creek without a reapplication of the wax.

Very easy to use and slides extremely well. It has my hearty recommendation. I'll be trying the solid samples soon.

post #10 of 131
Thread Starter 
Interesting blend volklgirl. If not too traumatic for you to go cold turkey , after you see how long the blend lasts, I'd be curious how you find just the Universal green runs as well as blending the Universal & Universal Hot in the same temp range and conditions you've tried so far.

Bong, what were the temperatures and conditions you skied at Snowmass and Beaver Creek?

On Thursday at Snowmass I skied lots of groomers, old crud, soft bumps, off-piste in powder after using the P1 Cold on Race Base Med. The snow temp at the top was -8°C/17°C which was the high end of the P (1,2 3 & 4) cold scale. I applied it cold (in the sun) at the top of the lift and corked it in, waited ten minutes and brushed. It ran well all day of hard skiing with no sign of wear with the RB Med. Weems said his group had different results after applying to skis cold and would be curious as to what procedure and over what. He did say, he thought it ought to have been applied to warm bases.
post #11 of 131

I just received my test pack in today's mail. I'll start playing around with the Maplus tomorrow. We've been getting dumped on lately and lots of cold temps in the forecast to work with.

I too am a Super Hot Sauce fanatic (been using Hertel exclusively for probably 15+ years now) for all but the warmest slushy temps, then I add Zardoz over top to stop sticking. I'm curious to see how your wax stacks up. I'll post some of my findings in a few days. Thanks for including me in this test.
post #12 of 131

Wow, this Wax Kit Rules....Now how do I use it?

Like it says in the title, I went to the post box today and found an nice weighty package addressed to me from SlideWright.com labeled Maplus Wax Test Kit. Lets see what we have here...

little Maplus nylon bag with zipper and snap hook
Ski retainer strap with velcro (I think)
1 bottle Maplus Universal liquid wax for 5 to 32 F degrees, cool
1 bottle of Maplus Soft base liquid wax fo r23 to 32 F, hmmm warmer
1 bottle of Maplus hard base liquid wax for -22 to 14 F : (people ski when its that cold?
a square of white wax (warm?)
a square of green wax (cool?)
a square of purple wax (cold?)
a yellow bottle of spray wax -3 to 0 (high tech all temps are in Celcius)
a red bottle of spray wax -9 to -2
a blue bottle of spray wax to match your fingers at -22 to -8.
a little role of teflon or plastic or something
a thermometer (nice touch encased in acrylic)
The essential cork / nylon brush combo tool
and a paint brush

Ok, I'm officially a high tech wax jong, but this stuff looks like hours of entertainment.

I figured out how to open the box...
now where do I begin?
post #13 of 131
Stick the thermometer (you know where- outside before you ski- first time and compare to the resort temperature being reported) to see if it works and is accurate. Then stick it in hte snow, pick a wax to apply based on that temp. and go use it....
post #14 of 131
Thread Starter 
Originally Posted by Cirquerider View Post
now where do I begin?
Punt?...Find snow? :

(This might be good to move into the test thread,)

Per the Maplus Application Procedures the Race Bases (soft, med (solid purple) & hard) are excellent base prep and base waxes for the P1 (performance paraffins) or Universal sprays/liquids you received. Playing around with quick (no heat) and standard (with heat) applications are good places to start. I also really like the RB Med (purple solid) as a very durable no-brainer wax on it's own. It's a little more difficult to work with and using as little as possible reduces scraping. (Using the Binford rotobrush is very helpful. : ) I sent some to testers in various parts of the country to see how it works all over.

The Universal green & hot are other waxes to use for general purpose and blending.....or try it on your friend's, kid's or spouse's skis or boards. Playing with the performance and durability of liquids (with & without heat) versus hot waxing the solids is one idea for testing.

Another thing I'd suggest is to see if you and others can tell the difference between the Universal solids/liquids and the performance waxes relative to glide and durability and various conditions, snow types and temperatures. Some will, others won't.

Part of the exercise is a plot to convert the US to metric. : The thermometer has celsius and fahrenheit as does the wax thermometer in the test thread. It may be handier for many to write the fahrenheit temps on the containers and in log books, if you keep one. The included Wax Chart has conversions as well. (Also, you can click on the Wax Thermometer and it'll open in a separate window which you can print and keep in the spiffy nylon bag.)
post #15 of 131
Finding snow is becoming a challenge. And it looks like its time for that "Hot" wax.
So what works on rocks? :

Originally Posted by NOAA
So the wax will get tested on old metamorphosed and warm snow for now. (Oh, took your advice on merging this post)
post #16 of 131
I don't know what the snow temperatures were since I don't have a snow Thermometer. Air temps seemed similar both days. Snow temps probably matched what you measured. I applied the wax in the room to warm bases and ironed it in using a teflon pad as you recommended.

I also used the universal cold at A-Basin on Sunday. The air temp never got above 20. I applied the wax outside to a cold base and it seemed to work very well, but I think a cold wax would have worked better.

I think the colder waxes are probably more appropriate for the conditions we get here in Summit.

post #17 of 131
Thread Starter 

The Basis of the Wax Revolution

Following are electronic microscopic images of different Maplus wax applications. Notice that the liquid/spray wax has complete base coverage compared to a solid. (Maybe filling in the gaps is why multiple solid hot waxings are usually recommended for new skis or after base grinds??)

A high melt (hard) paraffin is dissolved and is delivered to and saturates the base via a solvent developed by Maplus. This is the basis for the 'Wax Revolution'.

Though the liquid/spray applications have more saturation/coverage than hot waxing solids, it is less durable for the same Maplus solid wax. Adding heat increases the adhesion of the wax to the base. Due to higher coverage, the liquid/spray application should have longer durability with far less effort, time and mess.

1) Will your tests agree or disagree with the scientific testers?
2) What are the pros and cons of liquids/sprays versus solids, rub-ons & pastes?
3) What tricks and skills can be traded, improved or learned how to increase desired glide/performance and durability with waxing procedures for all wax applications with less time, effort and cost?
4) How will this fit into your ski maintenance routines?
5) What else will come of this testing?

How's your Italian? (Solid, Powder, Spray cold & Spray heated) :

Solid Wax on Base (coverage is not complete):

Spray Wax on Base (complete coverage):

post #18 of 131
Terry, can you explain the use of the Teflon sheet for me. Is the idea that it is smoother than the base of the iron?
post #19 of 131
Thread Starter 
The teflon sheet essentially replaces the thicker wax typically found during hot waxing that 'protects' the base from the iron and improves iron glide. Since the liquids and sprays are so thin, the teflon does glide across the base a bit better than the iron does. I also use it when crayoning solids or using bare minimum solids to reduce scraping and mess.

As an aside, I've used the spray waxes on patterned base touring skis and my climbing skins to improve glide and reduce icing. If you (or anyone) is up for it, please consider this use as well. One comparison I'm hoping to mess around with if the universal or other sprays/liquids/rub-ons are substantially different than Maplus' Touring & Skin waxes.
post #20 of 131
Thread Starter 

Air to Snow temperature correlation

In the interest of trying to generate a correlation between air temperature and snow temperatures, please record both temperatures if and when you take any readings. Also, it'd be good to indicate shade versus sunshine and other mitigating circumstances you think of value. This may be of some value for everyone. Any sources on this?
post #21 of 131
First opportunity siezed.

The kit came in the mail just as we were leaving the house to go to the hill. My husband had just said, "Dang, I wish I'd waxed my race tigers." so I urged him to read the instructions while I drove and try something.
Being the man that he is, instructions were unnecessary:
He sprayed the Mid temp spray on the ski, and let it set. when we got to the hill, I brushed them for him. He was amazed at how this easy application worked. He actually beat me down the hill a few times.

One question:
Can you give me some advice on waxing so the his skis are slower and mine are faster?
post #22 of 131
Thread Starter 
Use the wrong temperature wax?? How was the durability without adding heat?
post #23 of 131
Originally Posted by trekchick View Post
First opportunity siezed.

The kit came in the mail just as we were leaving the house to go to the hill. My husband had just said, "Dang, I wish I'd waxed my race tigers." so I urged him to read the instructions while I drove and try something.
Being the man that he is, instructions were unnecessary:
He sprayed the Mid temp spray on the ski, and let it set. when we got to the hill, I brushed them for him. He was amazed at how this easy application worked. He actually beat me down the hill a few times.

One question:
Can you give me some advice on waxing so the his skis are slower and mine are faster?
Originally Posted by Alpinord View Post
Use the wrong temperature wax?? How was the durability without adding heat?
I was pleasantly surprised.
Honestly, I have a hard time believing that anything as easy as spray/liquid waxes can perform and hold up as well as traditional waxes, but this went on easy(as I said, it was applied in the jeep) Brushed to a good finish very nicely, and held up through the day.
The application was on race tigers, that were ready for a waxing, but they were not cleaned because of the circumstances surrounding the application.
Thumbs up to the first opportunity to use this product. I hope to give it a real solid chance and report back.
post #24 of 131
Thanks to Terry, RacerRick, and crew! I got my kit last week, and was real pleased to see the nice assortment of stuff included -- this was more like a gift basket for a ski tuner than merely a test sample.

I did my first tune with the Maplus wax yesterday, using it on my Fischer RX-8 skis. Among a quiver, these are my high-speed carving skis, and have been getting a lot of use lately with the packed manmade snow and cold temps -- exactly where I will most notice effects of a wax. I brushed on the universal liquid wax, and that aspect of the application couldn't have been easier -- basically I poured a small "glop" on the ski and spread it about 10-12" in both directions, and repeated my way down the ski length until it was covered. Waited about 10 minutes, then ironed the skis. Waited another 10 minutes and brushed the skis with the nice nylon brush included in the kit. The final result looks very good, and I am excited to try out the skis later this week and report back on the results.

I am also interested in trying the same application without ironing in, as it would make a big difference in the ease of use category, especially when I am on the road. I got the impression that ironing helped blend the wax, but that the basic brushing-on probably got me 80% along the way. I think applying by brush, scraping, and then nylon-brushing would be a fine routine.

I am going to bring the spray wax and brush along on a family ski trip next weekend, and will give feedback on that product next (will probably get another family member to try that out with me).

Thanks again for the nice kit!

post #25 of 131
I got my kit too. I will post my results one I get back on the snow.
post #26 of 131
I went out for four hours last night to test some bootwork and the new wax, so here goes:

A couple of nights ago I tuned up the Metron B5's and my backup skis, Blizzard Sc20's. I currently do not have an iron, so all apllications are by the "quick" method. The Metron's got a coat of Maplus Hard Base Liquid, followed by a coat of P1 Spray.

I decided to go a different route for the Blizzards. I put one coat of Maplus Universal Liquid on one ski. For the second ski, I corked/crayoned on some Maplus universal hard.

Overall, I liked the way the liquid waxes went on. Just a quick brush, then let it harden up. Little to no mess when it came to brush out the wax.

Unfourtunatly, I forgot my snow thermometer last night. I do know that the high temp for the day was 20 degrees F, and it was about 18 when I got to the hill at 4pm. They had recieved 5" fresh overnight, and I spoke to someone in mountain opps, they had been making snow since noon. I encountered a lot of yellow ice spots, makes me think they were making snow a few days ago when the temps were in the 30's.

First impressions of the hard base/P1 combo on the Metrons were great. Slid real nice around the lifts, and after a warm up run, I went down a green trail to test the glide. Seemed to work fairly well, over the man-made/natural/ice combo that I found. Most of the time I spent of the "double black" that the had been running high school GS races on earlier in the day, the sides of the trail were loose snow and the center hardpack. I think I nailed the temp range for the wax. I skied untill about 7pm on this settup.

I then switched to the Blizzards with the Maplus Universla Liquid and Universal solid. First thing I noticed, my old skis suck, the Metrons are much more fun . On the wax side, the universal did not seem to glide as well, I know that there was no way that the snow was above the temperature range of the wax, so I have to assume that it was below. It was definalty not the worst wax I have encountered for given conditions, but paled in comparison to the Hard Base and P1 cold on the other skis. I did notice that the ski which had the hard wax crayoned/corked on did not glide as well as the liquid version. I switched skis to see of it was just the fact that it was on one leg instead of the other, but the ski still felt like it was dragging more then the other.

I only lasted untill 8pm. Blowing man made kept sticking to my goggles, and I couldn't see very well. With the crowds, I figured it was time to call it good. After jsut an hour, the base of the Blizzards still looked great. Below is a picture of the Metrons after 3 hours of abrasive manmade. This picture shows some base burn, more then I had from a weekend of sking in VT with only a hot wax from the shop. It also shows my first attempt at welding a base repair (I thought I had sandpaper, instead i just used a panzer file) and the fact that I was to lazy to wipe down the skis last night when I got home. Should I use multiple layers of the Hard Base liek you would with a traditional wax?
post #27 of 131

Kit received Friday

No chance to play with it yet

krp8128, try corking the Hard Base layers in?
post #28 of 131
Originally Posted by comprex View Post
No chance to play with it yet

krp8128, try corking the Hard Base layers in?
Should I do this while the wax is still a liquid? I can't remember if I corked after it was hard or not, but I do remember that I followed the directions on the spray, "spread immediatly with a cork or felt, rubbing and pressing", but it seemd like as soon as I touched it the solvent evaporated and it became rock hard.

Alpinord, are there any MSDS availible for these waxes? I'm a little curious as to the solvents that I have been inhaling...
post #29 of 131
I plan to spread with a brush and, if necessary, cork when hard, just for the sake of easiest cleanup. I shudder at the thought of getting hard wax chips or powder out of my felt blocks.

PS I have some questions about that photo.

- the flash can show white where there isn't that much, just from direct, specular reflection off the base. Does the eyeball appearance match the photo?

- the bases weren't steel scraped or Fibertexed to get rid of previous base hairs?
post #30 of 131
The eyeball apperance matches the photo quite well. I think the flash still does highlight the areas a bit though.

No, I did not steel scrape or fibertex the base. When I started out, there was minimal base burn right at the edges underfoot, most of it was there from when I purchased the skis. I did use a green scotchbright pad around the base repair, and that is one of the whitest areas.
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