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Speeding Tickets and Radar Detectors - Page 3

post #61 of 129
Thread Starter 
points = higher insurance
post #62 of 129
So after following this thread and thinking that I didn't need a detector because I always drive very close to the speed limit, I got pulled over at a speed trap less than a mile from my home. The officer said that I was measured at 41 in a 30. I still don't know if I believe that I could have been going that fast, but I did not look at my speedometer when I was pulled over, so I don't know for sure I was going slower.

However, since then, I have checked my speed multiple times on various roads and I'm always within 5mph of the speed limit.

I have a hearing set for the 3rd of March and I'm trying to decide what to do. It's likely that they'll offer me a plea bargain, but I am loathe to plead guilty to something that I don't think that I did. But, I don't know how to prove that I didn't, and I don't know if I have a prayer to be found not guilty on the basis of their measurement of my speed.

Before I dig around the 'net and find all of the "get out of a speeding ticket by buying my book" sites : , any thoughts?

Added: BTW, "pulled over" was the only way I could think to say it, but this was a stationary, multi-officer set-up. One was hiding behind a bush holding a hand-held measurement device (I do not know which kind it was). A second officer waved me off the road. A third walked up to me and wrote the citation. There were two other officers writing citations for others, as well, and making under-their-breath comments about the other drivers they had cited.

[ February 17, 2004, 04:01 PM: Message edited by: ssh ]
post #63 of 129
ssh,

from the experiences of my kids and their friends, here's what I've learned. I'm not a lawyer, but i'd love to play one on tv.

go to the first hearing and plead innocent. if you talk to a prosecutor type person before the first hearing, they may or may not offer you a lesser charge, but you will most likely do better after you plead innocent.

they have lied straight to my face more than once, so take what they say with a grain of salt.

before the second hearing, you will meet with a prosecutor person. tell them you want the ticket deferred.

if you don't get any more tickets, it goes away after a while.

good luck.
post #64 of 129
ssh-
I just saw a great item on Ch 9 news the other evening-.
It seems that at the beginning of each shift, the police must calibrate their radar guns with a tuning fork. But here's the catch- it seems as though these tuning forks must be inspected and calibrated by the CO Dept Of Ag. It turns out that very few of these tuning forks have been calibrated in years, and therefore many tickets are getting tossed based on this fact.
So if I were you, I'd contest the ticket based upon lack of calibration, a technicality, but hey- a win is a win!

Good Luck!

:
post #65 of 129
Okay, I didn't even finish reading the entire thread but after reading a few post . . .especially officer Thor's. . . I just HAD to open my big fat mouth.

First and foremost. . Active jamming is a FEDERAL crime enforced by the FCC. This means that if you're caught using one you will be charged with a FELONY. If convicted YOU WILL LOSE constitutional rights. . . such as the right to vote, the right to carry arms, freedom of travel . . etc. DON'T do it, it's not worth it especially when their are very effective passive means of doing this if you simply must speed. I'll elaborate at the end.

Second, (sorry Jim) radar detectors DO work . . . if you know how to use them. It doesn't necessarily take years of military training either. Take your new detector and do 'drive-bys' on various types of radar. A little hard sometimes but in example. . if you pass an officer clocking people, go down the road away and turn around, . . do this a couple of times and see for yourself the distances involved, etc.

Third, Although I run a passport and am happy, Valentine is simply the best.

Fourth, Just as Vail Snopro said. . check your state laws. Not only can you force the prosecution to produce documentation on the physicals (FCC licensing for the radar, the officers training certificate, the calibration certificate of the tuning fork, etc) many states dictate how that radar can be used. . . . ie: on what grade of hill, on what radius of curve, what distance from signs dictating a reduction of speed etc. . . . SIMPLY PUT - if you're going to speed . . know your traffic laws.

Fifth, Officer Thor almost got me flaming on this one :
Radar dectectors are increasingly being used for traffic situation warning. ie: they can be used to warn of construction ahead, reductions in speed, crosswalks, etc. The have also been PROVEN to contribute (or at least be used by) to safer driving. . . why. . . well it seems that users tend to be a bit more alert. . . . This also goes hand in hand that faster drivers cause less accidents. . . .Don't believe me though. Just having a dad that was a fatal accident investigator for GDOT for 15 years (and investigating over 1750 fatal accidents) probably leaves me ignorant on the matter. (BTW, more accidents in Co. are caused by inattentive drivers . . . . and elk (or other large animals)!!!)

Now for the good stuff!!!

I mentioned passive devices. . . they are legal, though if caught using some light defracting coverings you might have to fight. . . remember, there are those who believe you are not free!! The best has been mentioned already . . .Get a rabbit in front of you doing the speed you want to go and let him fish for the police. . . Other passive things you can do include getting a front bra for your car and paint it with a mixture of flat-black paint and a medium crushed charcoal dust sprinkled into the wet paint. . . this is the same principal behind 'stealth' paint. . .it does work in reducing the bounced signal and giving you a bit more time to reduce your speed, it tends to work better on a low profile car such as the corvette, Porsche 944 series, etc. Laser is another beast however, the officer in question will attempt to bounce this beam of light off of a reflective surface. . one of the better ones being a license plate. There are things you can do here too. There are everthing from plate covers to hybrid sprays that you can use to coat these surfaces.

ANYway, I'm not endorsing speeding, (although Officer Brady in South Park is still angry at the 148mph fly by I did on 285 around Red Hill . . especially when he had to let me go [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img] ) But then again I have absolutly NO endorsement of our Police officers being reduced to revenue collection agents in a system that isn't designed to really punish but rather to collect money.

Sorry for the rant and long post. . . NOW, Breck today, key tomorrow!!!
post #66 of 129
Thread Starter 
I have been using the Valentine for a few weeks and I noticed that some people's vehicles set it off.

Is this laser assisted cruise control setting it off or a CB radio or something?

The best situation so far with the detector was in Maine on the ME Turnpike.

A Maine state trooper was just doing laps on each side with his radar on right before the border to NH.

The detector picked him up pretty far so I just hung back and watched him do this over and over again.
post #67 of 129
Now that's what I'm talking about. Try to do this with all of the different types you can . . .ie: Ka, K and (even though it's not that often you find it anymore) X bands. If you're lucky and can find someone using a laser unit try that too.

I don't put very much clout in laser detection. .. sure, it works. It's just that in most cases, unless the unit detects a stray beam, once it's detected laser it's already a lock-on.

As far as in false signals, what is it detecting??? Laser, Ka, K or X???

You'll find that they can be triggered by things like motion sensors (for automatic doors, motion tripped lighting, etc.), as well as other peoples detectors and various in cab signaling devices (trucks using automatic scaling and location devices). These will primarily (but not always) manifest themselves in the form of X or K band. As I said before, most modern forces don't use X band anymore, but you should not allow yourself to ignore it either. I don't know about the new cruise units, but if it involves a laser then it could be possible to get a false laser detection.

You will, after time and use, be able to start recognizing these and what a real threat is.

Good luck

[ February 19, 2004, 09:04 AM: Message edited by: ski2xs ]
post #68 of 129
Quote:
Originally posted by ski2xs:
ANYway, I'm not endorsing speeding, (although Officer Brady in South Park is still angry at the 148mph fly by I did on 285 around Red Hill . . especially when he had to let me go [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img]
There's a story in there that I'd like to hear!
post #69 of 129
Quote:
Originally posted by vail snopro / ric reiter:
ssh-
I just saw a great item on Ch 9 news the other evening-.
It seems that at the beginning of each shift, the police must calibrate their radar guns with a tuning fork. But here's the catch- it seems as though these tuning forks must be inspected and calibrated by the CO Dept Of Ag. It turns out that very few of these tuning forks have been calibrated in years, and therefore many tickets are getting tossed based on this fact.
So if I were you, I'd contest the ticket based upon lack of calibration, a technicality, but hey- a win is a win!

Good Luck!

:
That's really useful! Thanks, Ric! (Off to the Ch9 site to see if I can nab the video.)
post #70 of 129
Ski2xs, You really want the good folks to believe that a Radar Detector is used more so then not as a safety device. So a driver will pay more attention to the roadway? That may be the case for say, 2 out of 20 detectors out there.
I can only speak from my experience on the road. The drivers I get going the fastest are the ones that usually have a Detector. Yes, there are exceptions to this.
I will do a survey Fri and SAT nights this week. I am working some traffic overtime. I will post the "RADARGATE" results here Sun. [img]smile.gif[/img]
In Michigan. The tuning forks went out about 10 years ago. Now every unit has a self test once its turned on.
For both Radar and Laser.
post #71 of 129
Quote:
Originally posted by ski2xs:
...Radar dectectors are increasingly being used for traffic situation warning. ie: they can be used to warn of construction ahead, reductions in speed, crosswalks, etc. The have also been PROVEN to contribute (or at least be used by) to safer driving.
Hey, nice try! You might get some of your friends to believe that, but you'll never get anybody that holds your fate in their hands to buy it. Why? Because that excuse has been spun before, and it's still ridiculous. Sorry. : Give it a try, and if you're found guilty, I'd bet you'll get the maximum fine for jerking the judges chain. They tend not to like being blatantly bulshitted. If you're going to fling a B.S. story, be a little more creative.

Quote:
...it seems that (radar detector) users tend to be a bit more alert. . . . This also goes hand in hand that faster drivers cause less accidents. . . (BTW, more accidents in Co. are caused by inattentive drivers . . . .
I'd agree that an alert driver is usually a safer driver, even an alert speeding driver is better than the majority of those who may drive slower, but have their head up their arse. But again, the radar detector does not CAUSE a driver to be more alert (another nice try), it's just that they tend to be USED by drivers who are ALREADY more alert to begin with - they know they're speeding, and are looking ahead for cops, etc. as opposed to people who are on mental cruise control and have no clue as to what's going on outside their little "living room on wheels."

I would suggest not using those excuses on the judge, or the the cop (unless he get's out of his car, and has drool coming out of his nose, and his shoes are on the wrong feet)- you'll guarantee yourself a ticket. Just a little friendly advice! [img]graemlins/evilgrin.gif[/img]
post #72 of 129
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by jim thor:
Ski2xs, You really want the good folks to believe that a Radar Detector is used more so then not as a safety device. So a driver will pay more attention to the roadway? That may be the case for say, 2 out of 20 detectors out there.
I can only speak from my experience on the road. The drivers I get going the fastest are the ones that usually have a Detector. Yes, there are exceptions to this.
I will do a survey Fri and SAT nights this week. I am working some traffic overtime. I will post the "RADARGATE" results here Sun. [img]smile.gif[/img]
In Michigan. The tuning forks went out about 10 years ago. Now every unit has a self test once its turned on.
For both Radar and Laser.
What do you consider fast?

I usually drive 15 over the limit and have control of my vehicle and I am obsessive about knowing what is around me at all times but that is enough for a ticket so I have a detector.
post #73 of 129
Quote:
Originally posted by Glytch:
hey Carvemeister -- I have a question for you:

Does NY accept points from tickets in MA?
Sorry, I can't really give you an answer on that one. I don't believe out of state points affect your NY license, but I'm not really sure. Information on a person's actual points isn't that readily available to most cops in NYS, as far as I know. It's something that you should try to find out from DMV. They could probably tell you if you could get to talk to the right person - which can be a difficult task.

You might want to try looking for info on the NYS DMV website.
Good luck in court! [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img]
post #74 of 129
Uh oh, Another long winded one!

Thor,

That would be interesting to see!

Luckly I lived through my dumb a** stage of life and have learned that dumb a** driving has absolutly no place on public roadways. (the 148mph is another story, but that's been the only stunt I've pulled in around 15 years. It just so happens that I pulled it right slap in the face of a Park, Co. detective)

Now, I'm not saying that none, few or only a handful of speeders will have a detector. . . I'm going to assume ahead of time that it will be quite the contrary. What I'm saying is that based on #'s those with detectors are less likely to be found at fault in an accident. . . .they are SAFER drivers be they faster or not. Whether or not a person exceeds the speed limit has no bearing upon how safe and attentive that person is. I'm sure that you can attest that there are some who are more dangerous at 40 than others at 80. I'm sure you yourself being in a car most the time are a much safer driver at higher speeds than most of the public is at 55.

It brings to mind the Canyon Courier (Local Evergreen paper) article concerning the # of accidents on Hwy. 74 (had a recent fatal one, therefore the coverage). The stats indicated app. 96 accidents. Out of these app. 25 were due to inattentiveness, app. same # for large animals, 10 or so due to DWI/DUI, 10 or so for too fast for conditions. . . . . There were some others I can't remember but only 5 were list as being due to speeding. . . .The funny thing is that the response from Jeffco Sheriff is to step up patrol against the speeding. . .Now tell me. . . how screwed up is that???

ANYway, I'll look for it and stay safe out there!! There's a bunch of nuts living here in the US!!!

shh,

Maybe you can get the whole story out of me one day. Let's just say that an unmarked, plainclothed Park Co. Detective thought he was just going give me a ticket after a race that not only he enticed but also participated in by not using any lights until after I had taken it upon myself to pull into a parking lot 10 miles down the road. (whew!)

Well, after the marked units he called in refused to issue one he called in a state patrol (because he was pissed that his own deputies wouldn't). He finally arrived and after several minutes of what appeared to be a heated arguement the Patrol Officer FINALLY agreed to fill a citation out for 'careless driving' (because 'Officer Brady' didn't know how to fill the standard form out) but made the HIM sign it. He (the Patrolman) walked over and handed the ticket to me but, while looking me dead in the eye said "Now, I didn't sign this, I refuse too, but I filled it out for him and let him sign it. . . I'm going to make an assumption that you'll go to court (and while nodding his head at me [img]graemlins/thumbsup.gif[/img] ) and WHEN you do, please let the Judge know all of this : !!!

"RESPECT MY AUTHORITI !!!" (cartman)

ANYway, I immediately drove to the courthouse and spoke with both the DA and Judge.

Mmm, Mmm, Mmm. . . I guess middle aged detectives driving new Dodge Rams shouldn't challenge an old Porsche he knows nothing about . . . and then get his feelings hurt!!!

Oh well, . . I ended up talking the DA into selling me a late 80's model 215cm Fischer RC 4 that he had sitting in his office (still new, never mounted) for 5 bucks on that day!!! . . . We still ski together when time allows
post #75 of 129
Carvemeister,

Quote:
Hey, nice try! You might get some of your friends to believe that, but you'll never get anybody that holds your fate in their hands to buy it
Sorry, I'm the keeper of the cheese, . . I hold my own fate. . . You see, the reduced speed ahead function has already saved me a ticket, . . AND made me safer on that day. Plus I love the construction crews who send the alert signal out. . especially at night on dark streaches of I-70. . . . Opps. . . seems that made me a safer driver on those occasions too. . . Perhaps because I was . . . PREPARED MAYBE!!

Also
Quote:
But again, the radar detector does not CAUSE a driver to be more alert (another nice try)
Sorry, but I didn't "try" anything (except you're case here in this courtroom!!) If you would please take the time to reread my post you'll find

Quote:
The have also been PROVEN to contribute (or at least be used by)
Now, notice that last bracketed statement and please read it aloud for me

AND lastly:
Quote:
I would suggest not using those excuses on the judge, or the the cop (unless he get's out of his car, and has drool coming out of his nose, and his shoes are on the wrong feet)
That's not unusual in some places near me (edited to protect the guilty : . The DA tries cases drunk, the Judge smokes weed and one of the deputies shakes so uncontrollably that I'm left wondering how the issue him a service revolver!!!

[ February 20, 2004, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: ski2xs ]
post #76 of 129
Yeah I have a V1 and give it nothing but props. I will say though that Lovley Gentelman like Jim (Above) are getting smarter guys and they are doing things that we cant stop.
1- 89; I got caught by a plane that was timing me all the way down the road. Don't tell me tha you can see them cause I never even knew untill the Trooper pulled me over a ways down the road. That was a bad one and lost some provilages for a while.
2- No instead of shoot lazar and the Gun still sending off slight signials (1 bar or something like that), they are actually turning the Radar or Lazer on and off so there is noting untill it is to late. Grrrrrr

Jim is there anything out there that you know of or should I just build my own race track?
This is my first post guys but If you have any questions about Atomics let me know.
J.
post #77 of 129
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally posted by J.D.S.:

This is my first post guys but If you have any questions about Atomics let me know.
J.
Dude go post in the Gear section.

Some of us love Atomics and are interested in the new models.
post #78 of 129
hey Carvemeister -- I have a question for you:

Does NY accept points from tickets in MA? I got 'clocked' at 89 in a 65 on I91 in Deerfield Mass about a year ago. I say 'clocked' because I drive a dark green SUV - I was going about 75 in the left lane (fast, but not ridiculous), and a guy absolutely rips past me in the right lane, and as he's going into the left in front of me, we pass a cop (it's a pitch black night, so we just saw the yellow lights on the side). we both instinctually pull into the right lane and slow down, and then the cop pulls me over and gives me the ticket. It's not the money so much as the license points (I'm 19...). I am contesting the ticket, but if for some reason the cop shows up and the judge doesnt believe my story (or the written testimony of the other people in the car), I'd really prefer if the ticket doesnt carry over to NY! thanks for the advice,
Goran
post #79 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Capacity
I use a Escort, my buddy has a V1. I think the V1 is better but the escort is more user friendly. Not as many false signals. Other then these two I would not recommend any orthers.
Has this changed any in the intervening time? It doesn't look like much has changed on the various sites that discuss radar detectors, and it's been about a year since the last major tests. Any thoughts on the comparisons between the Passport 8500 X50, the V1, and any of the others that might be more effective? We're going to take a bit of a driving vacation coming up in August, and I want to stay aware of what's around me, even on those unbelievably boring stretches of highway!
post #80 of 129
Here's a novel idea on how to avoid tickets from a retired Trooper:

Obey the legal contract you agreed to when you were issued your license. When you were issued a license and put your signature down you aggreed to obey the rules.

Also.... ..maybe .01 % of the time folks pulled over for speeding have a valid argument and will be given a warning. The other 99.99% of the time people get pulled over its because they were knowingly doing somethng they shouldnt have been and broke the law. Nobody likes getting a ticket but it really is that simple..slow down and obey te posted limits and you won't have to worry about points or tickets. It's pretty simple.
post #81 of 129
People seem to fail to understand that the little sign says Speed Limit.

It does not say Suggested Speed.

With the exception of the fuel economy limits on the Interstates that came in after the first gas crunch, speed limits are not just number pulled out of a hat. They are calculated by the surrounding conditions of the area and topography ...... VSD's (visual sight distances), such as visibility going up and over a hill, curves etc. are all factors as are the population density and width of the road as well as local conditions such as the number of even things like animal strikes (deer and moose are no joke especially at night). Additionally, one of the calculations involves all of the above and included obstacles within "X" feet of the shoulder ... things such as large trees and rocks .... shoulder versus no shoulder etc.

Now, I realize that we here at Epic are all above average individuals and these rules should not apply to us.

However, also one of the other factors that is calculated into that little annoying formula is the reaction time of the average driver in the average vehicle.
post #82 of 129
Yuki, in the best of all possible worlds, you'd be right, of course. But, having personally been caught in a speed trap (where the speed limit was later changed because it had been improperly set lower than it should be), I beg to differ.

Furthermore, I do drive the speed limit by habit. But, either through the lulling effects of driving hundreds of miles in the American West or through the sudden change in speed limits that sometimes occurs, I don't always realize what's happened. I'm considering a detector to help me "wake up" at those times to just make sure I haven't been going faster than I normally would. This often happens, too, when I go from my noisy, tight Acura Integra to our soft, big Town & Country minivan.

So, I'll ask the question again: those of you who use detectors, which do you use and why?
post #83 of 129
I've had a V1 for 4-5 years, and it works great. I average about 40k miles per year, 90% highway. I generally go 7-10mph over, not too crazy, but the V1 is a big help. No tickets since I got it. I use the "Logic mode" which screens out some of the false signals.

Valentine's service is excellent as well. If you have problems or questions, call them, and you can talk to a real person, who knows the product! Another neat thing, I can go to their website, enter in my V1's serial #, and it will show if there are any significant upgrades available. If there is, you can send your V1 in, and they replace it with a brand new V1, at half the original purchase price.

Geez, I should get paid for that endorsement! :
post #84 of 129
We all know that police officers target snowboarders more than skiers. Well not really but its sounds about right. So if your a snowboarder, hide your snowboard in the car and get some old Rossi 4s 207cm skis for the roof rack on top of the car. The police officer will immediately recoginze the old Rossi 4s, feel sorry that you can't afford the new shaped skis, and he won't even pull you over. The other trick is make sure you got a car with snowboards on the roof in front and behind you. Best if they have skull and cross bones paint job on their snowboards that says to all police officers pull me over first.
post #85 of 129
ssh, good point! One of the problems that I do have is when I change cars. I tend to "cruise by sound" and find that I am going faster till I adjust to the vehicle.
post #86 of 129
What's the fastest you've gone in a car? (To all)
post #87 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki
ssh, good point! One of the problems that I do have is when I change cars. I tend to "cruise by sound" and find that I am going faster till I adjust to the vehicle.
Exactly! I drive the Integra (1988, 254,000 miles all put on it by me) all the time. But, we're getting ready for that vacation. I can just see me lulled into driving too fast on I-25 north of Ft. Collins or some-such highway. After that last ticket (the first one in about 20 years), I don't want to go there, again... And being a tourist will make me an easier target, I suspect...
post #88 of 129
I have the Bel equivelant to the Escort (I read somewhere that the guts are exactly the same - just about $10 cheaper). I absolutely HATE the fact that I can't turn off the X band warning. It does a good job doing for me what you're looking for ssh: it wakes me up when I space out. I rarely speed, and of course got a ticket one day when I spaced out a bit, bought the detector the next week - even the false alerts on the detector remind me to check my speed, which I think is a good thing.

If anyone is looking for a "story" to try and get out of the speeding ticket - the best one I've ever heard is to dump water in your crotch right after you come to a stop - then explain to the policeman that you have a bladder condition, and point to the "accident" that just happened because you realized you didn't have a chance of making a restroom once you saw his lights...

J
post #89 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuki
People seem to fail to understand that the little sign says Speed Limit.

It does not say Suggested Speed.

With the exception of the fuel economy limits on the Interstates that came in after the first gas crunch, speed limits are not just number pulled out of a hat. They are calculated by the surrounding conditions of the area and topography ...... VSD's (visual sight distances), such as visibility going up and over a hill, curves etc. are all factors as are the population density and width of the road as well as local conditions such as the number of even things like animal strikes (deer and moose are no joke especially at night). Additionally, one of the calculations involves all of the above and included obstacles within "X" feet of the shoulder ... things such as large trees and rocks .... shoulder versus no shoulder etc.

Now, I realize that we here at Epic are all above average individuals and these rules should not apply to us.
While I will agree with your last paragraph , my experience does not concur with the first one. Highway 401 between Toronto and Montreal was engineered with a design speed of 80 mph. I got this info from one of the engineers involved. I remember driving there before the world was about to almost instantly run out of oil in the early and mid 1970s. The speed limit was 70 mph, and you didn't get pulled over for going 80. Now that we have better tires, better suspensions and better brakes, the speed limit is about 62 mph (100 kph) and driving 80 will get you a nasty fine and higher insurance rates.

Highway speed limits are nothing more than a tax, politically supported by the insurance lobby. If they went back to setting the speed limit by the 80th percentile, things would be different.

I always stick within 10 kph of the limit in towns and cities though.
post #90 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublediamond223
What's the fastest you've gone in a car? (To all)
Probably about a buck forty.
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