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Karma Vs Foil Dilemma

post #1 of 9
Thread Starter 
Hello all, first post. I am a 2-3 week a year skier (10 years running) and I am currently trying to decide between the Karma and Foil. The overall feeling seems to be that the karma is the better overall ski. However, I have tried both and I found the foil more stable at high speeds. That seems to be completely contradictory to everything on this board. I tried the Karma at 169cm and the Foil at 174 so that might have been part of the stability advantage. I am 5'11 and 190 lbs so the Foil should have been too soft? I havent tried either in a year and im looking to buy so if anyone is around my size and actually likes the foil at speed please let me know. Thanks!
post #2 of 9
I can't comment particularly on either ski, but having used several twin tips, I found that they can be skied longer (due to the raised tail). 169 seems a bit short for you, but because I haven't used the Karma, the input of others will be more valuable.

In the end, at the amount you are skiing, I'd suggest that you go for the ski that you enjoyed the most. Are you confident that you tried each ski enough (and in comparable conditions - be sure that they reflect the conditions you usually will use them in)? I bought some Dynastar Big Troubles this year after finding that I love them; however, I came across some reviews and comments that were less than flattering (about the ski, I mean - although that could be said about my skiing, too!).
post #3 of 9
every person is different so go with what u feel is best.. but yeah thats kinda weird considering volkl is "known" for carving and high speed turning and the karma is ALOT stiffer than the foil... the length mite have some impact imo for ur height u should have been on the 177 karmas and possibly longer foils i duno how much longer they go tho...

post #4 of 9
Choosing between a light and nimble ski like the Foil and a stiffer more agressive ski like the Karma is a personal choice. Such is the dilemma of folks going into the demo process with a preconcieved notion of what is a better ski only to discover they liked the other model better. One is not better than the other or more advanced or anything, they are just different. Don't overthink it, buy the one you liked best.

post #5 of 9
SJ, as always, comes with the wise wisdom.

That said, I'd try the Karma in a 177, at least. I personally think you went way, way, way too short in trying the 169.

I have similar height/weight stats to you: I'm 5'11' and 190 (at least at the beginning of the season, but will drop down to 180-185 easily). I ride the Karma in a 177 and it may even be too short (most folks will attest that it rides short given the twin tip).

That said, I haven't had much problems with stability. It works great in the bumps and chutes, a wee bit unstable if you try to run it out balls-to-the-wall on a groomer (i.e. this is where added length would come in handy), but I rode the hell out of it last season at Breckinridge up on the wind blown bowls off the t-bar and it was awesome! Really, the only time I notice that it might be a little too short is on a groomer where you just want to straight line it. Other'n that, it's been pretty damn bueno.

So, while I echo SJ's advice to go with the ski you liked better, I would also suggest you give the Karma another shot in the 177 (and maybe even the try the 185).

My cousin bought some Foils last season and loves 'em and my dad has demoed them and found them decent, as well. Me, I'm not a huge Salomon fan (at least in terms of their skis). All of which goes to say that when it comes to skis, it really is a personal preference. Try the 177 Karma, though!
post #6 of 9
That 169cm Karma skis about like a 162cm conventional ski. I think that is way too short for your height/weight. You should consider at least the 177cm Karma.

I am 6'1" 185lb and ski the 185cm Karma. It already feels short to me, so I wouldn't want to go any shorter (or else give up stability and edge). Great ski, I like it a lot, especially in soft snow where it excels.
post #7 of 9
Thread Starter 


Thanks for the great input. The 169 Karmas were my first time testing a twin tip and thats what the guy set me up with. I guess that I should have pushed for the 177's but I was naive to the twin tip experience. The 174 foil was fine for me but do you all think 182 would be more applicable if I enjoy ripping down the groomers? Im arriving in Park City on Dec 27th and I really wanted to purchase something beforehand. I think im going to go with the foil for now because I felt most comfortable with them. I guess the real question now is 174 or 182cm. I will definitely Demo some 177 Karmas and see what they have to offer. Im going to buy some used Foils so that im not too committed financially. This is a great resource and thanks again!

post #8 of 9
I'd just demo in Park City...save you the hassle of packing along skis and give you the opportunity to try the difference sizes out.

but that's just my 2cents.

post #9 of 9
i bought the karma in 177 recently and it is perfect for me, im 175, 6' and probably a couple notches below you skill wise. I wanted a ski that would sort of challenge me a bit but not be too much to handle day to day, and so far its fit the bill just right. given your skill level and size, the 177 might be right for you, but if i were you id try the 184.
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